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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    Do whites do more for you than your country?
    Impossible to quantify and meaningless anyway. You don't have to choose between being Jewish and being American, why should I have to discard a White identity or my Englishness. Double standards? Quite unexpected.

    (Original post by Alexdel)
    Being white is just a by-product of climate and since mankind originated in Africa as Science at present teaches what difference does being white make?
    Yes, why should White nations be treated differently, my point exactly. Expressions of social/cultural and ethnic affiliation are not frowned on for non-White groups.
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    (Original post by Alexdel)
    The question was on whoever has the highest moral blameworthiness on supplying weapons to Saddam...unless you agree with supplying a tyrant (which is the words you used) as legal then I don't know what contribution you are making.

    I'd rather see you answer the question I asked...
    It takes a real stretch to suggest a person who sells a gun to someone is more morally blameworthy than a person who uses that gun to kill someone.

    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    Impossible to quantify and meaningless anyway. You don't have to choose between being Jewish and being American, why should I have to discard a White identity or my Englishness. Double standards? Quite unexpected.
    Does your loyalty to Britain come before your loyalty to the white race?
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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    It takes a real stretch to suggest a person who sells a gun to someone is more morally blameworthy than a person who uses that gun to kill someone.
    Someone who uses it can do so in a fit of rage or when mentally unstable or due to an autonomous respone. Those selling the weapons always have an intent to sell dangerous lethal weapons...

    K last time I will ask you this..will you asnwer the question then?
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    (Original post by Alexdel)
    Tell that to Mr.Bush..
    One of my favorite proffesors, a Brittish guy, has worked with the US State Department in helping establish and create democracies in dozens of countries, and in almost all of the cases, peacefully.

    "He has worked for the US State Department on issues of electoral and constitutional design for Afghanistan, Angola, Burma, Fiji, Guyana, Indonesia, Jordan, Liberia, Netherlands, Northern Ireland, Sierra Leone, South Africa, and Zimbabwe—most recently in Kabul reporting on election preparations in Afghanistan and as an advisor on constitutional issues for Iraq."
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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    Does your loyalty to Britain come before your loyalty to the white race?
    People who ask the same of Jews are routinely labelled anti-semitic. Are you anti-White? If not why did you switch from supporting people's affiliation to cul/soc/eth identities when I asked if the same expression is OK for Whites?
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    (Original post by Kondar)
    One of my favorite proffesors, a Brittish guy, has worked with the US State Department in helping establish and create democracies in dozens of countries, and in almost all of the cases, peacefully.

    "He has worked for the US State Department on issues of electoral and constitutional design for Afghanistan, Angola, Burma, Fiji, Guyana, Indonesia, Jordan, Liberia, Netherlands, Northern Ireland, Sierra Leone, South Africa, and Zimbabwe—most recently in Kabul reporting on election preparations in Afghanistan and as an advisor on constitutional issues for Iraq."
    Could you please point out where has the US State Department established peacefully a democratic country?

    Btw this is what I advocate but they sure are not doing a good job of it..
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    (Original post by Alexdel)
    So you also refuse to ackknowledge that the US supplied Saddam with weapons..
    It's a fact that America didn't supply Hussein with weapons. It supplied him with intelligence and provided political support for his actions against Iran. Germany and the Soviet Union sold him chemical weapons, while France built him a nuclear reactor.
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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    It's a fact that America didn't supply Hussein with weapons. It supplied him with intelligence and provided political support for his actions against Iran. Germany and the Soviet Union sold him chemical weapons, while France built him a nuclear reactor.
    http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2...q-ushelp_x.htm

    So teaching Iraq how to produce and use with the full knowledge that they would be use against people doesnt bother you at all?
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    (Original post by Alexdel)
    http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2...q-ushelp_x.htm

    So teaching Iraq how to produce and use with the full knowledge that they would be use against people doesnt bother you at all?
    Are you now withdrawing your accusation that America supplied Hussein with WMD?
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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    It takes a real stretch to suggest a person who sells a gun to someone is more morally blameworthy than a person who uses that gun to kill someone.
    I have to agree with Alexdel on this point. The US knowingly, willingly, and intentionally supplied Hussein with chemical weapons with knowledge and approval that these weapons would be used against civilians.
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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    The fact is that this question is asked. AIPAC constantly gets accused of putting its Jewish identity above its national identity.



    Germany, Japan, South Korea, Taiwan. It has also contributed to the democratic revolution in Ukraine and to gradual democratization in other countries.
    PEACEFULLY.....(and how does Japan and Germany classify as the US achievement)

    Oh pls...Ukraine's revolution was all because of the people and this is how you democracy should come. Trying to take credit for it it's ridiculous...
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    (Original post by Kondar)
    I have to agree with Alexdel on this point. The US knowingly, willingly, and intentionally supplied Hussein with chemical weapons with knowledge and approval that these weapons would be used against civilians.
    No it did not. America sold Iraq materials, which could have been used for peaceful purposes, which Iraq instead converted into biological weapons. America did not sell Hussein the weapons themselves. Using the gun analogy, America sold Hussein the steel. Hussein then used that steel to make guns. That doesn't mean that making guns is the only use for steel.
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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    The fact is that this question is asked. AIPAC constantly gets accused of putting its Jewish identity above its national identity.
    True. And we agree there's no reason why they should have to choose? Or me?

    Why did you switch positions from supporting ethnic affiliation, to panic when I asked about Whites? Instinct or education?
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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    Are you now withdrawing your accusation that America supplied Hussein with WMD?
    No I am not withdrawing that...teching someone how to build a weapon is the same as giving them a wepon...I find it astounding that in order to justify your country's position you try to minimise the US involvement in it....apalling..

    And btw...you see I actually answer the questions....unlike yourself..
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    (Original post by Alexdel)
    PEACEFULLY.....(and how does Japan and Germany classify as the US achievement)
    Gee, Germany and Japan were really democratic before they were occupied by the US. :rolleyes: South Korea and Taiwan were successfully pressured to democratize by the US.

    Oh pls...Ukraine's revolution was all because of the people and this is how you democracy should come. Trying to take credit for it it's ridiculous...
    I said America contributed towards the revolution, not that it caused it. Perhaps you should ask the anti-Kuchma groups were they got their funding?
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    (Original post by Alexdel)
    Could you please point out where has the US State Department established peacefully a democratic country?
    Angola, Burma, Fiji, Guyana, Indonesia, Jordan, Liberia, Netherlands, Northern Ireland, Sierra Leone, South Africa. There will always be those who disagree with the way a country is run, even in the US and the UK and no one expects a war torn 3rd world country to become a peaceful Utopia overnight. But what his job involves is helping to set up democratic governments. For example, how many congressman does a country need, where to draw provincial lines, how often to have elections, etc..
    It takes a lot of work and the US is always very willing very helpfull in these cases. It is sad that you NEVER hear about these kinds of things in the news though.
    Btw this is what I advocate but they sure are not doing a good job of it..
    What specific information has lead you to beleive this about each of the countries I have metioned?
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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    True. And we agree there's no reason why they should have to choose? Or me?

    Why did you switch positions from supporting ethnic affiliation, to panic when I asked about Whites? Instinct or education?
    They don't have to choose one; they do have to choose the one that is more important for them. And when did I support ethnic affiliation? Last time I checked, America is not an ethnic group (neither is Britain).
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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    Gee, Germany and Japan were really democratic before they were occupied by the US. :rolleyes: South Korea and Taiwan were successfully pressured to democratize by the US.
    If I remember correctly they all came down to war so how could you say peacefully I just dont understand...



    (Original post by Bismarck)
    I said America contributed towards the revolution, not that it caused it. Perhaps you should ask the anti-Kuchma groups were they got their funding?
    Perhaps you should ask the talebans where they got their funding..
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    (Original post by Alexdel)
    No I am not withdrawing that...teching someone how to build a weapon is the same as giving them a wepon...I find it astounding that in order to justify your country's position you try to minimise the US involvement in it....apalling..

    And btw...you see I actually answer the questions....unlike yourself..
    You're making false accusations against the US. Why should I take you seriously? You went from saying that America sold Iraq WMD to saying that it sold Iraq the materials from which it made WMD. I suppose the people who sold the London bombers chemicals from which they made their bombs (assuming they obtained those chemicals legally) are more guilty than the terrorists themselves?
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    (Original post by Bismarck)
    It's a fact that America didn't supply Hussein with weapons. It supplied him with intelligence and provided political support for his actions against Iran. Germany and the Soviet Union sold him chemical weapons, while France built him a nuclear reactor.
    I was under the impression that it was a FACT that we sold him weapons...??? I can give you a dozen references.
 
 
 

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