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    (Original post by Trousers)
    Don't panic too much. Most conflict is in fact caused by territorial disputes. That's how the Ireland situation came about - it's just easier to divide the groups into Catholic/Protestant because it's less long-winded than saying 'those descended from the English who are now generally situated in Northern Ireland versus those descended from the Irish and who are usually associated with the Republic of Ireland'.
    slightly inaccurate
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    (Original post by technik)
    generally yes.

    a decent minority of catholics however dont really have any issue with the borders and being part of the UK.

    very few protestants or unionists would ever accept a united ireland though. many of them still see partition and the forming of republic of ireland as a step too far and a disgrace.
    Ok. So what does each side want to happen? Like, how is the dispute ever going to be settled?
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    (Original post by Chardonnay)
    Like, how is the dispute ever going to be settled?
    when one side is exterminated to be blunt.

    as that wont happen, there will never be a solution.
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    (Original post by technik)
    indeed.

    all too often i see people blaming the EVIL ORANGE ORDER for daring to have a march a few times a year to celebrate their history and heritage in the country in which they live. rarely see people even questioning the dirt who start rioting. they are clearly in the right... :rolleyes:
    But why chose to 'celebrate' directly infront of the catholics - marching through republican areas?!
    Imagine Arsenal supporters celebrating a premiership victory through the streets of Manchester. Violence would result and such a 'celebration' would not be permitted by the authorities.

    Therefore I think that these patronising marches should be banned and the consequent violence avoided.
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    (Original post by Quiksilver)
    But why chose to 'celebrate' directly infront of the catholics - marching through republican areas?!

    This depends on a rather naïve view of the topography of Belfast. A 'Republican area' is not some vast swathe of the city which is easy to ignore, it may be a short street linking two 'Unionist' streets. Ardoyne, where the riots occured, is a very good example, the 'Republican Area' is a space of perhaps ten or twenty yards between two Unionist areas; it's physically impossible to get from one Unionist Area to another without passing through this space. Both sides have, in theory, signed up to the idea of the Parades Commission; it sometimes allows the parades, it sometimes doesn't: it's a compromise. Absolutely banning parades because they happen to pass through a Republican area would be unacceptable, and would simply cause more trouble. It is worth remembering, incidentally, that many of the parade routes are traditional, and that when these parades started, none of the journey passed through Republican areas; the changing demographic distribution of Belfast is partly to blame (although there are political factors at work).
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    (Original post by Quiksilver)

    Therefore I think that these patronising marches should be banned and the consequent violence avoided.

    It's worth dealing with this in a separate post. If you ban the marches, the Republicans will be less likely to riot, but Loyalists and their sympathizers will be rather more inclined to riot; it's almost certain that what you will see is an enormous increase, and not a decrease, in violence. Banning is a knee-jerk response to an incredibly complicated issue. That is why we have the Parades Commission, however ridiculous it may appear at times, and however perverse its rulings.
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    (Original post by Quiksilver)
    But why chose to 'celebrate' directly infront of the catholics - marching through republican areas?!
    Imagine Arsenal supporters celebrating a premiership victory through the streets of Manchester. Violence would result and such a 'celebration' would not be permitted by the authorities.

    Therefore I think that these patronising marches should be banned and the consequent violence avoided.
    you need to visit belfast and see the layout and demographics. they often change street to street.

    you also need to consider the length of time these marches have been taking place. they became "traditional routes" long before certain areas became republican.

    its my view that the parades should be allowed, regardless of whos marching and any disturbance from a minority be put down vigourously. that way, those who want to march can just get on with it and get it done with.

    using them as an excuse for violence shouldnt be tolerated as you seem to be advocating. deal with the violence and those causing it, dont just ban parades.
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    well at da end of da day, to put it bluntly, taighs and huns will neva see eye to eye, to willl NEVA happen. I live in Belfast and i av seen it all. ppl in england fink they know what its lyk, but seriously they dont have a clue (no affence). The amount of sleggin dat we get ova here- there is no call 4 it! so to round it up, i think ppl should jus try n forget bout wat happend, let the paramillitaries kill each otha n battle it out, and leave us normal ppl alone!!
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    (Original post by SamTheMan)
    That's the problem... anything that's remotely patriotic here in the UK is no longer politically correct.

    I can understand the anger of the Catholics who identify themselves with those who were "conquered" but they have to accept that they live in the UK and that sometimes, people will celebrate belonging to the UK.

    We're too hard on ourselves. As soon as anything reminds us of our colonial or imperialistic past, we get worried, whereas in effect, that past is pretty shameful but isn't THAT bad. I was watching a documentary on King Leopold, the Belgian King of the Congo. What he got up to in Africa is absolutely despicable, totally sickening, the worst colonial system Africa has ever known, yet you go to Belgium and the place is covered with statues in his honour.
    Oh yes people criticise our colonialisation being totally thick as to why countries like the Ivory Coast and Ghana speak French. Obviously for random choice. Then there's the Romans we experienced. Caesar must be a terrorist and Claudius I as well whilst you're at it. They're no heroes.
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    (Original post by mikeski)
    well at da end of da day, to put it bluntly, taighs and huns will neva see eye to eye, to willl NEVA happen. I live in Belfast and i av seen it all. ppl in england fink they know what its lyk, but seriously they dont have a clue (no affence). The amount of sleggin dat we get ova here- there is no call 4 it! so to round it up, i think ppl should jus try n forget bout wat happend, let the paramillitaries kill each otha n battle it out, and leave us normal ppl alone!!
    think you're going to fail the first GCSE on your list
 
 
 

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