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black people are supposedly "intellectually inferior"? watch

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    (Original post by KumakoXsd)
    But we're not.

    How can the most diverse people with the largest gene diversity be genetically inferior?

    I got sources.
    You arn't making sense. OP said there was no evidence to the contrary of her opinion, when there is alot of evidence and studies which disprove what she is saying (i.e all mental differences across races are environmental).
    There is also a similar study from America were they compared IQ and academic scores from different races and included household income in the study, white and asian students from low income backgrounds out performed black students from high income houses. I'll try and find this study.

    Also I'd like to take issue with this from OP, and all the other various forms of the same thing, which everyone seems to rely on for thier arguments agaisnt a genetic hypothesis;

    'Your assumption that other immigrant communities are exposed to the same tribulations as Blacks are is the epitome of ignorance. Your assumption is depthless simply because other immigrant communities haven't experienced the downfall that Blacks have. The trans-Atlantic Slave trade, as haunting a topic it may be, is the one setback, and greatest setback, Blacks underwent that no other race can identify with. In fact, much of Black people's issues, both social and psychological, can be traced back to slavery.'

    These events ae completely inconsequential. Firstly a modern black person in a western country has no connection with slavery, they have never been slaves, have never known anyone who has been a slave and have never felt or seen slavery, slavery stopped centuries ago. Modern black culture bares no relevance and only the most extremely distant, minor and trivial connections with slavery. Slavery is not a fact that black people have to live with at all in the west, if they wern't taught about they would not know it had even happened.
    I'd like to see if anyone can point out how the trans-atlantic slave trade is culturally relevant to a black person in the west. And also why other groups who have suffered similary or worse and in more recent and memorable times do not equally under perform e.g. Jews and the holocaust, Germans and defeat in WW1 and WW2, I'm sure there are other examples. Also you should point out how, if there is any connection at all between modern black people and the slave trade why this would be, I dunno, distressing(?) enough to cause the persistent underachievement when compared to other racial groups, including those who've gone through more recent tribulations e.g the Jews.
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    Well that is the point with the trans-racial adoption studies, they bascially took IQ and academic results from black adolescents which had been brought up in white house holds, which removes the aspect of poverty and up bringing. And they were still found to do less well in IQ testing and academically across all fields (math, languages ect).

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minneso...Adoption_Study
    IQ that is rubbish. Seriously, most top academics don't care about that.

    Did you actually read the bottom. At the end you can't really tell what it supports like it says.
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    You arn't making sense. OP said there was no evidence to the contrary of her opinion, when there is alot of evidence and studies which disprove what she is saying (i.e all mental differences across races are environmental).
    There is also a similar study from America were they compared IQ and academic scores from different races and included household income in the study, white and asian students from low income backgrounds out performed black students from high income houses. I'll try and find this study.

    Also I'd like to take issue with this from OP, and all the other various forms of the same thing, which everyone seems to rely on for thier arguments agaisnt a genetic hypothesis;

    'Your assumption that other immigrant communities are exposed to the same tribulations as Blacks are is the epitome of ignorance. Your assumption is depthless simply because other immigrant communities haven't experienced the downfall that Blacks have. The trans-Atlantic Slave trade, as haunting a topic it may be, is the one setback, and greatest setback, Blacks underwent that no other race can identify with. In fact, much of Black people's issues, both social and psychological, can be traced back to slavery.'

    These events ae completely inconsequential. Firstly a modern black person in a western country has no connection with slavery, they have never been slaves, have never known anyone who has been a slave and have never felt or seen slavery, slavery stopped centuries ago. Modern black culture bares no relevance and only the most extremely distant, minor and trivial connections with slavery. Slavery is not a fact that black people have to live with at all in the west, if they wern't taught about they would not know it had even happened.
    I'd like to see if anyone can point out how the trans-atlantic slave trade is culturally relevant to a black person in the west. And also why other groups who have suffered similary or worse and in more recent and memorable times do not equally under perform e.g. Jews and the holocaust, Germans and defeat in WW1 and WW2, I'm sure there are other examples. Also you should point out how, if there is any connection at all between modern black people and the slave trade why this would be, I dunno, distressing(?) enough to cause the persistent underachievement when compared to other racial groups, including those who've gone through more recent tribulations e.g the Jews.
    Hmm, look at this
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worl...chool-3Rs.html
    As it shows black boys do better than poor white boys in primary school. Certainly, poor white boys do the worst at school.

    Racism in America didn't actually stop intill the 1960's, it still ongoing to. Hmm, KKK and hanging blacks is a good example. Lastly, Jews have never been deprived of education like blacks, only during Nazi germany did it really happen. About that, black african immigrants moving to US actually do really good academically and have a higher salary than most Americans, hmm I will find you the study that shows it.
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    (Original post by etnies)
    Hm , looking at Nefertiti I doubt they were Negroids
    African empires kicked off in the sudanese region and were expanded upon the influx of arab migration from the north. Timbuktu was also one of the first civilisations to adopt a uniform method of mathematics. But you know what, you've never heard that on TV so you must somehow believe it is not true :lol:

    The lack of acceptable research from people here is shocking, yet you seem happy to proclaim one race as intellectually inferior to another. You certify hypotheses yet to be certified by the scientific community and then you wonder why you're dubbed as racists? Its either that or you know something that researchers from Imperial and many other renowned educational institutions do not, looking at your visible stupidity, its something I doubt. People like you are as dumb as posts. You choose, no, you thrive in your ignorance and ineptitude, ignoring freely available information which would counteract your narrow-minded views. A doc came on BBC4 (surprisingly) covered some of the empires within the subsaharan region, did you watch it? Exactly.
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    (Original post by ladybird89)
    So. What have black people invented then, hey?
    The videogame cartridge
    The streetsweeper
    Pencilsharpeners
    Elevators
    third rails in subways
    peanutbutter :sexface:

    :lol: these are just to name a few
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    (Original post by Undulipodium)
    What an ignorant viewpoint.

    You can't blithely ignore the possibility of a difference between races.

    Is it so inconceivable that, along with skin colour, hair type, body size, etc., races differ in intelligence?
    That's just stupid. skin colour, hair type etc are genetic features you can't help. When it comes to intelligence, it depends on external factors. How do u explain black people who succeed at what they do/even surpass whites when it comes to academia? A fluke?
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    (Original post by Simplicity)
    IQ that is rubbish. Seriously, most top academics don't care about that.

    Did you actually read the bottom. At the end you can't really tell what it supports like it says.
    I was mainly responding to OP saying there is no evidence conflicting her ideas, she was wrong, there is plenty of evidence.
    Well at the end it says the scientists argued about the results and wether they were influenced by the adoption, and only by how much it was genetic not wether it was genetic or environmental. Also it says that the original scientists tried to make the results "palatable to environmentally committed colleagues", this is a reason why I believe there is more evidence for the genetic hypothesis, beacuse scientists are underpressure both from inside and outside the scientific community to support politically correct results.

    Also about the IQ scores and income there is a graph in the 'race & intelligence' wiki which shows a consistent IQ gap across economic classes.



    (Original post by Simplicity)
    Hmm, look at this
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worl...chool-3Rs.html
    As it shows black boys do better than poor white boys in primary school. Certainly, poor white boys do the worst at school.

    Racism in America didn't actually stop intill the 1960's, it still ongoing to. Hmm, KKK and hanging blacks is a good example. Lastly, Jews have never been deprived of education like blacks, only during Nazi germany did it really happen. About that, black african immigrants moving to US actually do really good academically and have a higher salary than most Americans, hmm I will find you the study that shows it.
    None of this replies to my points or make an argument relevant to this thread tbh.
    Poor white boys doing worse than black boys on a whole is expected since not all black families are poor. Jews experienced aot of discrimination when they came to America during and after WW2, and one specific group of Africans immigraiting to America (Nigerians) doesn't go to show anything. I'm pretty sure you don't understand any of the science surrounding this topic tbvh or you wouldn't be making these points.
    I'd really like to see if you or anyone can respond to my previous point about slavery and modern black people, and add to that how racism is a factor in this. These points are completely unjustified impo.
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    I was mainly responding to OP saying there is no evidence conflicting her ideas, she was wrong, there is plenty of evidence.
    Well at the end it says the scientists argued about the results and wether they were influenced by the adoption, and only by how much it was genetic not wether it was genetic or environmental. Also it says that the original scientists tried to make the results "palatable to environmentally committed colleagues", this is a reason why I believe there is more evidence for the genetic hypothesis, beacuse scientists are underpressure both from inside and outside the scientific community to support politically correct results.

    Also about the IQ scores and income there is a graph in the 'race & intelligence' wiki which shows a consistent IQ gap across economic classes.





    None of this replies to my points or make an argument relevant to this thread tbh.
    Poor white boys doing worse than black boys on a whole is expected since not all black families are poor. Jews experienced aot of discrimination when they came to America during and after WW2, and one specific group of Africans immigraiting to America (Nigerians) doesn't go to show anything. I'm pretty sure you don't understand any of the science surrounding this topic tbvh or you wouldn't be making these points.
    I'd really like to see if you or anyone can respond to my previous point about slavery and modern black people, and add to that how racism is a factor in this. These points are completely unjustified impo.
    I would, but arguing with a guy with a white supremacist logo on his avatar and known links to stormfront just seems like a perfectly good way to waste an otherwise productive thursday afternoon.
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    (Original post by Bishamon)
    I would, but arguing with a guy with a white supremacist logo on his avatar and known links to stormfront just seems like a perfectly good way to waste an otherwise productive thursday afternoon.
    U mad brah?

    And it is a celtic cross you'll find it on and in just about every church yard in England. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    U mad brah?

    And it is a celtic cross you'll find it on and in just about every church yard in England. :rolleyes:
    No...? Why would I be mad? Why would you care if I was mad? But thanks for verifying the futility of arguments with a person like you. You seem to have deep insecurity issues and you seem far too hung up on a set of data yet to be analyzed and disseminated into a standardized conclusion. I could provide cited sources but I did that in the last debate discussing the exact same topic, it seems like some people become excited at the notion of intellectual differentiation by way of race. Lame.
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    (Original post by Bishamon)
    No...? Why would I be mad? Why would you care if I was mad? But thanks for verifying the futility of arguments with a person like you. You seem to have deep insecurity issues and you seem far too hung up on a set of data yet to be analyzed and disseminated into a standardized conclusion. I could provide cited sources but I did that in the last debate discussing the exact same topic, it seems like some people become excited at the notion of intellectual differentiation by way of race. Lame.
    Well if you're not mad and you're not excited then you can provide these cited sources (for what btw?). I don't think you're going to be able to debate against what I've posted so far tbh.

    Also, U mad brah?
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    Well if you're not mad and you're not excited then you can provide these cited sources (for what btw?). I don't think you're going to be able to debate against what I've posted so far tbh.

    Also, U mad brah?
    Pfft, you're the intellectually superior one are you not? How about displaying your cerebral prowess with implementation of the search thread function.
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    (Original post by Bishamon)
    Pfft, you're the intellectually superior one are you not? How about displaying your cerebral prowess with implementation of the search thread function.
    How about piss off if you can't debate? Or stop getting mad? Must be the low IQ ey?
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    OK cut out the flaming. Either debate the topic or don't post.
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    (Original post by Ayostunner)
    Ok kl !
    i get what you mean noe :thumbsup:

    Yeah sorry I don't think I explained it fantasically well!! Glad I got my point across now, I don't want to offend anybody!
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    (Original post by SmileeTee)
    That's just stupid. skin colour, hair type etc are genetic features you can't help. When it comes to intelligence, it depends on external factors. How do u explain black people who succeed at what they do/even surpass whites when it comes to academia? A fluke?
    Intelligence is something that you can't help. Intelligence isn't
    some ethereal quality without genetic ties - it comes down to neurobiology.

    When people talk about 'external factors', they don't mean quality of education, they mean nutrition as a child, uterine conditions etc.

    There are incredibly clever people in every race - this thread is about the average.
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    I was mainly responding to OP saying there is no evidence conflicting her ideas, she was wrong, there is plenty of evidence.
    Well at the end it says the scientists argued about the results and wether they were influenced by the adoption, and only by how much it was genetic not wether it was genetic or environmental. Also it says that the original scientists tried to make the results "palatable to environmentally committed colleagues", this is a reason why I believe there is more evidence for the genetic hypothesis, beacuse scientists are underpressure both from inside and outside the scientific community to support politically correct results.

    Also about the IQ scores and income there is a graph in the 'race & intelligence' wiki which shows a consistent IQ gap across economic classes.





    None of this replies to my points or make an argument relevant to this thread tbh.
    Poor white boys doing worse than black boys on a whole is expected since not all black families are poor. Jews experienced aot of discrimination when they came to America during and after WW2, and one specific group of Africans immigraiting to America (Nigerians) doesn't go to show anything. I'm pretty sure you don't understand any of the science surrounding this topic tbvh or you wouldn't be making these points.
    I'd really like to see if you or anyone can respond to my previous point about slavery and modern black people, and add to that how racism is a factor in this. These points are completely unjustified impo.
    Lol, conspiracy theory of oppression of truth in science is bad.

    Again, IQ is rubbish and means nothing. Actually, EQ is probably a better measure of success and that is back up by some studies. Nor have you defined what intelligence is, intelligence is not IQ. Intelligence is so complicated that genetics is highly unlikely to be so clear cut, hence not finding intelligence genes. Economics for example plays a role like what social class you are in.

    Actually, black people are normaly in the low income range. Hmmm, on the Gov stats it also show that poor black student also did better than poor white students. WW2, yes, but that is not that long ago. As I said Jews haven't had a history of lack of education and being forced out of education. Not just Nigerians. Also, you can't really compare jews to blacks as they can fit in more easy as they are white and they can hide they are jewish, also they have not been slaves and yeah jews didn't really get killed in huge numbers like black people did.

    P.S. Anyway, carry on thinking you are intellectually superior to black people.
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    (Original post by Eveiebaby)
    If we jump on the whole "blacks iz stupid" bandwagon, maybe you need to take into account which countries these black people, they are testing are coming from, because as someone mentioned earlier, black people are more diverse as a race than any other. Black people with origins in one African country may be likely to have a different intelligence (which I cant suggest an ideal measure) to those of another African country and then again completely different from that of a Caribbean country. Also taking into account that the standards of education and environment/attitude for learning in each country vary widely.

    I highly doubt that studies have been able to take this into account and put this into practice.
    That is correct that there is a lot of within group genetic differentiation but in terms of genetic distance among Africans, as a group they are different from other groups. You can see how population groups cluster here. It is because of this that you get genes occuring in different frequency across groups leading to average differences.

    http://infoproc.blogspot.com/2009/06...-progress.html

    And recent evidence shows that up to 7% of the genome has been under strong selection over the past 10,000 or so years. Some of these may involve neurological function. For example there is a new version of a gene called DAB1 affecting the layers of the cerebral cortex which shows up in East Asian samples. Another variant was discussed in the NY Times a few years ago:

    Last year, Dr. Lahn, one of a select group of researchers supported by the Howard Hughes Medical Institute, showed that a group of 20 brain-associated genes, including microcephalin and ASPM, had evolved faster in the great ape lineage than in mice and rats. He concluded that these genes might have had important roles in human evolution. As part of this study, he noticed that microcephalin and ASPM had an unusual pattern of alleles. With each gene, one allele was much more common than all the others. He and his colleagues have now studied the worldwide distribution of the alleles by decoding the DNA of the two genes in many different populations.

    They report that with microcephalin, a new allele arose about 37,000 years ago, although it could have appeared as early as 60,000 or as late as 14,000 years ago. About 70 percent of people in most European and East Asian populations carry this allele of the gene, but it is much rarer in most sub-Saharan Africans.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/09/sc...pagewanted=all
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    (Original post by Simplicity)
    Lol, conspiracy theory of oppression of truth in science is bad.
    It is not a conspiracy theory it is a fact that will be confirmed by many scientists especially in genetics.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1299305/

    Again, IQ is rubbish and means nothing. Actually, EQ is probably a better measure of success and that is back up by some studies. Nor have you defined what intelligence is, intelligence is not IQ. Intelligence is so complicated that genetics is highly unlikely to be so clear cut, hence not finding intelligence genes. Economics for example plays a role like what social class you are in.
    IQ is rubbish? IQ correlates heavily with all measures of intelligence and cognative ability, also with educational and professional achievement. It is the best way to quantify mental ability.

    Actually, black people are normaly in the low income range. Hmmm, on the Gov stats it also show that poor black student also did better than poor white students.
    Source please, also you haven't sourced the last statement you made about African immigrants even though it is irrelevant.

    WW2, yes, but that is not that long ago. As I said Jews haven't had a history of lack of education and being forced out of education. Not just Nigerians. Also, you can't really compare jews to blacks as they can fit in more easy as they are white and they can hide they are jewish, also they have not been slaves and yeah jews didn't really get killed in huge numbers like black people did.
    Not being in education in the past doesn't mean you would have a lower IQ today. Lol holocaust denial, mods I hope you know that is illegal under EU law.

    Ok so why are black people underperforming today since they now go to schools?
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    (Original post by Simplicity)
    L

    Again, IQ is rubbish and means nothing.
    It predicts academic performance. For instance, Ashkenazi Jews average about 110 and East Asians about 105. And sure enough at the upper end of the distribution these groups are overrepresented. The value of it is discussed here.

    The important question is Q2: what good is it?

    A tremendous amount of research has been conducted on Q2. For a nice summary, see Why g matters: the complexity of ordinary life by psychologist Linda Gottfredson, or click on the IQ or psychometrics label link for this blog. Links and book recommendations here. The short answer is that g does indeed correlate with life outcomes. If you want to argue with me about any of this in the comments, please at least first read some of the literature cited above.
    http://www.technologyreview.com/blog...354&bpid=24445

    Also, increasingly the neurobiological basis for it is being identified in neuroscience.

    The UCLA researchers took the study a step further by comparing the white matter architecture of identical twins, who share almost all their DNA, and fraternal twins, who share only half. Results showed that the quality of the white matter is highly genetically determined, although the influence of genetics varies by brain area. According to the findings, about 85 percent of the variation in white matter in the parietal lobe, which is involved in mathematics, logic, and visual-spatial skills, can be attributed to genetics. But only about 45 percent of the variation in the temporal lobe, which plays a central role in learning and memory, appears to be inherited.
    http://www.technologyreview.com/biomedicine/22333/
 
 
 
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