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'I'll die here', said tortured boy watch

  • View Poll Results: What sentence do you think the attackers should face?
    Capital Punishment
    89
    23.54%
    Life Imprisonment
    97
    25.66%
    A jail term with psychiatric help - released at some point when theyre 'deemed safe'
    129
    34.13%
    Psychiatric Hospital until 'deemed safe'
    45
    11.90%
    Put back into foster care with more qualified parents and on-hand psychiatric help
    14
    3.70%
    Other... (Speicify in thread)
    4
    1.06%

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    (Original post by Trigger)
    Honestly, sensationalist and reactionary.
    They were tortured - Check
    It lasted ninety minutes - Check
    They thought they were going to die - Check
    They almsot did die - Check

    All of these are facts, and as such none are 'sensationalist', as you so love to describe the ordeal.
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    (Original post by Alexio)
    Cannabis in general is stupid.
    Cannabis for a nine year old is ridiculous.

    Besides, it was more to emphasise the point that they were neglected children living in broken home.
    Could you back that up with some actual facts or a prior arguments?

    I'd think it wrong to give cannabis to a nine year old because they're not mentally or emotionally competent to make a free decision to use it, but that's got bugger all to do with psychopaths torturing someone and it doesn't mean it'd actually hurt him or her. Associating it with this atrocity is pure prohibitionist spin in the same vein of the stories in the American '20s about Mexicans getting high and raping white women that were used to justify banning it in the first place.
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    (Original post by Alexio)
    They were tortured - Check
    It lasted ninety minutes - Check
    They thought they were going to die - Check
    They almsot did die - Check

    All of these are facts, and as such none are 'sensationalist', as you so love to describe the ordeal.
    No i use the word to describe yours and most of the other reactions in this thread.
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    (Original post by Trigger)
    I'm sorry, shall i add a load of emotions that i don't feel to please the rest of you? I am sad that this happened but i can only feel empathy for some kids i have never met. I feel more sadness for the recent disaster in Haiti and just the general social state of the country rather than plough all my bile and rage into one incident.
    I'm sorry, but I don't think I ever mentioned you being heartless towards these children. I said that you seem to be trivialising what happened to them; getting "beaten up" is a slight understatement.
    Also, don't you think that this incident is a reflection on the general social state of this country?
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    (Original post by numb3rb0y)
    Could you back that up with some actual facts or a prior arguments?

    I'd think it wrong to give cannabis to a nine year old because they're not mentally or emotionally competent to make a free decision to use it, but that's got bugger all to do with psychopaths torturing someone and it doesn't mean it'd actually hurt him or her. Associating it with this atrocity is pure prohibitionist spin in the same vein of the stories in the American '20s about Mexicans getting high and raping white women that were used to justify banning it in the first place.
    Well no, this isn't a thread about cannabis so I won't be arguing about why it is bad for you with you.
    However, you yourself said it is morally reprehensible to allow a nine year old access to cannabis, therefore you've said that the person who made it available, their father I believe, is a morally reprehensible person, THEREFORE you have yourself proven that he isn't the best parent and that the attackers may well be a product of their environment, a broken home. This, mate, has everything to do with 'psychopaths torturing someone'.
    I have at no point directly associated cannabis with this crime, merely stated that in a normal, loving home, a nine year old would not jhave access to it.
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    [QUOTE=brokenangel27]I'm sorry but I completely disagree with your comment. Everyone knows that killing is wrong and against the law, a young child would know that. The two boys knew exactly what they were doing. It is their fault and the fault of their parents and they should all be punished. They should suffer for the rest of their lives and I'd be quite happy to watch them suffer. I'm sure a lot of people would. At ten and eleven, you would still know that what they did was totally wrong, regardless of their environment.QUOTE]

    The only way to deal with it is to try to understand from their situation, but the problem is obviously few people are brought up in the same environment. Whereas in society we know what is right and wrong, these kids have developed their own social rules to live by. I think they should be punished, but by making them suffer without psychiatric help would only pile on to what they will likely suffer in life e.g. drugs, crime..
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    Haven't read the whole thread but farck meee, take my eye off the news for one second and I hear about something as big as this on tsr. Death penalty is still a bit harsh. People are still 'finding themselves' well into their 20s in some cases, it just wouldn't be right. They've had a bad start in life and that wasn't their fault (the cannabis-smoking, alcohol-drinking, porn-watching parents) but they need firm punishment and thorough rehab away from the parents. Also waterboarding

    But in all seriousness tougher measures against kids are needed.
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    (Original post by Mr. Cool)
    Haven't read the whole thread but farck meee, take my eye off the news for one second and I hear about something as big as this on tsr. Death penalty is still a bit harsh. People are still 'finding themselves' well into their 20s in some cases, it just wouldn't be right. They've had a bad start in life and that wasn't their fault (the cannabis-smoking, alcohol-drinking, porn-watching parents) but they need firm punishment and thorough rehab away from the parents. Also waterboarding

    But in all seriousness tougher measures against kids are needed.
    Yeah, I've repeatedly said that saying 'Get rid of them' in the first post was kind of a more...spur of the moment, really angry kinda thing. I'm more of a fan of life imprisoment.
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    Capital Punishment all the way its no less than they deserve.
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    clearly they are very mentally disturbed. I wouldn't risk trying to rehabilitate and integrate them back into society. Not worth the risk. They should be locked away indefinitely. Although I'm sure they'll either get a suspended sentence or 12 months in juvy or something.
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    Absolutely disgusting. Although I blame their 'parents' more than the boys themselves, to be honest.
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    It is disgusting but they are so young. Parents are supposed teach their kids the difference between right and wrong, and if they're openly promoting such violent acts within their own home, what can you expect? These kids have not been given the start in life they should have. No they shouldn't be allowed to just 'walk away free' from their crime but they certainly should receive some help so that further down the line maybe they can make something of themselves. I do feel sorry for the victims and their family, though. IMO social services should step in whenever kids have a home life such as that of the attackers. Prevention is, after all, better than cure.
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    At least life, in my opinion. It's all very well to say that because they're so young, they could change and be rehabilitated. However, as they've effectively destroyed the lives of two other people, do they DESERVE that chance? In my opinion, it's a massive no. If it was my children who had been attacked like that, I'd expect the kids who did it to be out of the picture forever. If they got less than life, I'd kill them myself.
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    (Original post by Alexio)
    Yeah, I've repeatedly said that saying 'Get rid of them' in the first post was kind of a more...spur of the moment, really angry kinda thing. I'm more of a fan of life imprisoment.
    I'd agree too, BUT.. Seeing as they're just children.. Think back to when you were 10 years old, of all the distorted views you might have had about the world. It's not enough to say these kids are disturbed, you also have to validate the fact that they are just that - kids. True, their moral compasses need some readjusting but a life in prison is too severe. Had they been perhaps three or four years older I would have been more ready to agree though. Either life imprisonment > effective than death sentence
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    Equally disturbing is that, if this poll is representative of the public at large, 22% would have the state kill two children of 10 and 11 years old who didn't actually kill anyone.
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    (Original post by Mr. Cool)
    I'd agree too, BUT.. Seeing as they're just children.. Think back to when you were 10 years old, of all the distorted views you might have had about the world. It's not enough to say these kids are disturbed, you also have to validate the fact that they are just that - kids. True, their moral compasses need some readjusting but a life in prison is too severe. Had they been perhaps three or four years older I would have been more ready to agree though. Either life imprisonment > effective than death sentence
    When I was ten I was thinking about Pokemon, not dropping bricks on people.
    I don't care if they're kids, in fact, that makes it worse. At ten I, and I'm sure you did too, knew what was right and wrong, I wouldn't have ever even contemplated something like this, in fact, I'm not sure I even knew people did stuff like this to eachother. (Probably thanks to my upbringing), but I had definitely seen footage of stuff on the news, as well as watched some 'scary' films about murderers and whatever, played GTA when I was maybe 12-13. I never thought, however, 'it'd be pretty fun to do that in real life!

    They knew what they were doing and they knew it was wrong. No-one deserves a second chance after that.
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    Capital punishment or life imprisonment is a ridiculous idea. Whilst the crime was obviously horrible, these two boys are a product of a terrible upbringing, and quite clearly mentally damaged. I can barely remember what sort of things I was doing when I was 10 and 11, but I sure as hell know I wasn't caring too much about the morals of anything at that age. Obviously this is on a bigger scale, but the fact remains the same - kids at that age are little more than what they've been raised to be. Give the boys a jail sentence and psychiatric help, and punish the parents.
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    Disgusting.

    However - at such young ages, one wonders how messed up their lives had to have been to engage in pure, wanton sadism at that point in their lives. Of course, punish them, but the odds of them getting life imprisonment are low. As they will be released at some point, make sure that they are treated in a secure psychiatric ward, separately, and ensure that this can never happen again. Also consider punishing the parents of the brothers - two of them engaging in the same sick activity is not circumstancial.
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    (Original post by EdwardCurrent)
    Equally disturbing is that, if this poll is representative of the public at large, 22% would have the state kill two children of 10 and 11 years old who didn't actually kill anyone.
    What's even more worrying is that this board is a student board, and consequently more liberal than the wider population.

    I fear that if this was put to a wider public vote by someone like Ipsos Mori, then capital punishment or life imprisonment would win out.
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    (Original post by Alexio)
    Did a search and nothing about this came up, so I thought I'd post it.

    http://news.uk.msn.com/uk/articles.a...ntid=151830404

    In short, two brothers, 10 and 11 years old, from a broken home where cannabis, alcohol, porn and 18-Rated DVDs were readily available, battered and nearly killed two boys of similar ages just because, according to the oldest of the attackers, 'They were bored'.
    The attack involved forcing the victims to perform sex acts on each, eat nettles, stamping on their heads, dropping bricks and sinks on their heads and telling them to kill themselves. After the 90 minute attack they simply left the scene, with both victims naked.
    The youngest victim, after pretending to be dead, went up to his older brother and asked if he was okay, to which he replied 'No. I cant see and I can't move my body. You go and I'll just die here.'

    The youngest victim managed to stagger to nearby houses and members of the public aided them.


    I'm sorry, but this story has really infuriated me. Not simply because of the brutal nature of the attack, but because I know for a fact that, despite these kids being tried in an adult court, they are already not going to be facing 'attempted murder' charges, and I know that they'll probably get 're-habilitated', let out of jail early and they and their families will be given new identities and a new chance at life, whilst the victims and their families will likely never live a normal life again.

    I've never been a fan of the death penalty, serves no use in deterrence as far as I'm concerned, but these boys are a waste of space and will likely spend the rest of their lives on the payroll of the taxpayer. I don't care anymore, get rid of them.

    THE POLL WAS ADDED AFTER THE START OF THE THREAD AT THE REQUEST OF A POSTER. IT ISN'T GREAT AS I WASN'T SURE WHAT OPTIONS FOR PUNISHMENT/REHAB THAT ARE AVAILABLE, BUT YOU GET THE IDEA.
    My concern would be for the two victims. What about THEIR treatment, THEIR trauma, THEIR recovery. Before spending even a pence on those two scumbags, I would try to rebuild the life of those two poor victims. They deserve it. I would happily pay tax money for the victims, but not for the some sickos to have new identitys and live their own life as they please. If people are so concerned about these pscho children, then they should pay out of their own pocket to keep them alive.

    Not everyone has a stable/secure/decent home life, but not many people turn into monsters either. The law is failing innocent children, it needs to be toughened and quickly.

    Also jail those parents/guardians who allowed two children to be bought up in such an awful environment. It's their fault cannabis/porn/alcohol were available so readily to those two children.
 
 
 
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