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    (Original post by FifthQuarter)
    MS for equity research? I wouldn't go there. Sure, it's Morgan Stanley (not the best bank either, reported almost a $bn loss). But it's equity research and ER is not their forte. Go to MS for M&A.

    I am not trying to downplay asset management. If it's a hedge fund, I would go for it. But other than that, there is little money in it and it's not a competitive field to get into.

    I suggest you take RBS DCM offer. It's their most prized division.
    Shut up. You're the biggest RBS fanboy on this forum. Why are you so proud to work for RBS?
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    (Original post by Teenage Pirate)
    You can't quantify everything

    For instance - equity research doesn't generate revenue
    Wrong.
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    (Original post by oblivious)
    Wrong.
    Ehh.. well you don't generate significant revenue. (Is that correct?) How much do you get from selling your reports anyway?

    Ok, and maybe ER "boutiques" like MWAG which don't do any trading but which are considered top notch can sell their research. To actual investors, not just IBD with a one week lag or whatever.
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    (Original post by Teenage Pirate)
    Ehh.. well you don't generate significant revenue. (Is that correct?) How much do you get from selling your reports anyway?

    Ok, and maybe ER "boutiques" like MWAG which don't do any trading but which are considered top notch can sell their research. To actual investors, not just IBD with a one week lag or whatever.
    Define 'significant'. Nobody sells research reports. PM's pay for ideas/analyst time.

    Commission can be unbundled. E.g. UBS executes the trade, gets 10bps and GS provides the research and gets 10bps.

    AM's also pay for research through their commission pool periodically. Votes from pm's and analysts at an AM translate into commission for research.

    I know how much MWAG typically gets from a client and it ain't small fry.
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    (Original post by oblivious)
    Shut up. You're the biggest RBS fanboy on this forum. Why are you so proud to work for RBS?
    No, I won't. I would be the first one to admit that MS IBD is a lot better than RBS IBD. Overall, MS is a much better bank than RBS and no one would argue against that based on any kind of metric you look at as of now.

    However, the offers presented here are MS ER vs. RBS DCM vs. HSBC AM. I gave my honest opinion within this context. I still think that RBS DCM is a better choice than MS ER and the two are better choices than HSBC AM.
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    (Original post by oblivious)
    Define 'significant'. Nobody sells research reports. PM's pay for ideas/analyst time.

    Commission can be unbundled. E.g. UBS executes the trade, gets 10bps and GS provides the research and gets 10bps.

    AM's also pay for research through their commission pool periodically. Votes from pm's and analysts at an AM translate into commission for research.

    I know how much MWAG typically gets from a client and it ain't small fry.
    I thought that the only way to sell reports was to give them to a database like investtext and that the money from that was pathetic.

    However, it seems like I learn something new every day! Thanks!

    (seriously I had no idea you could unbundle commission thats quite cool)
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    I would take MS, but RBS DCM also sounds good........ For brand value its without any doubt MS.

    Also, DCM is technically IBD, while Equity Research isnt.
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    (Original post by ibd_haunter)
    I would take MS, but RBS DCM also sounds good........ For brand value its without any doubt MS.

    Also, DCM is technically IBD, while Equity Research isnt.
    Actually, it depends. Whether DCM falls under IBD or Capital Markets is quite arbitrary and varies across the industry.

    I agree with one of the posters here...these are very different roles. Go with whichever sounds more interesting to you.
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    RBS DCM every time.

    City Monkey is 100% right, all you numpties choosing on this brand/prestige are clueless.

    DCM is booming and RBS has a good rep on the street in this area. Comparatively better than MS ER (name me one MS sector team that has produced a notoriously accurate/impressive report in the last year?) and HSBC AM (no comment).

    (Original post by oblivious)
    Shut up. You're the biggest RBS fanboy on this forum. Why are you so proud to work for RBS?
    What's wrong with him being proud to work there? If you're like most other people on this forum who have this idiotic and irrational attachment to 'brands' and so automatically denigrate RBS without having a clue what you're talking about, then you're in no position to criticize him. RBS has desks in GBM which are top 5 globally. Fact. And DCM is up there.

    I know idiots like you find that hard to believe, but you should do a bit more research.
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    RBS DCM without a shadow of doubt. Id always go to a 'lesser' bank over a more prestigious and brand named one if the desk i wanted was as strong as RBS DCM is. Besides, if its DCM vs ER in any argument, to me DCM holds better prospects and a more interesting area to work in.
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    RBS DCM rankings:

    Global debt: #10
    Global Investment Grade Corporate Debt: #8
    Global Mortgage-Backed Securities: #7
    Global Asset-Backed Securities: #5
    All Bonds in Euros: #7
    Global High Yield Debt: #10


    2009 Extel (by bank):


    OP: I do this less and less frequently now... But I'll give you my 2p's worth: if you have to come to a student forum and ask a bunch of usernames which firm you should join then you don't deserve an offer.
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    (Original post by uthinkilltellu)
    OP: I do this less and less frequently now... But I'll give you my 2p's worth: if you have to come to a student forum and ask a bunch of usernames which firm you should join then you don't deserve an offer.
    I dont think there's any harm in asking. If (s)he bases his/her decision, solely on this, then it would be stupid...
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    (Original post by Another One)
    I dont think there's any harm in asking. If (s)he bases his/her decision, solely on this, then it would be stupid...
    I see where you are coming from, but I doubt many (any) people on here would be able to give a realistic view of all HSBC AM, MS ER, RBS DCM. There are people with experiences of ER, DCM or AM, but not of all three divisions. So it really depends on what the OP finds interesting because no one on here can confidently say one is definitively better than the other. As I hope my above (informative) post shows.
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    Thanks for your opinions. I just wanted to put it out there to get a general idea, I was curious to see if people still gave a lot of prestige value to MS, and it seems that they do. Anyway, still have some time some time to think about it and speak to people in the respective decsisions. It was interesting to hear your opinions though


    (Original post by uthinkilltellu)
    OP: I do this less and less frequently now... But I'll give you my 2p's worth: if you have to come to a student forum and ask a bunch of usernames which firm you should join then you don't deserve an offer.
    Thanks for the 2p, but I did not come here to have a bunch of usernames make a decision for me. Its a forum, so I put it out there. With all due respect to you, I dont think anyone (no matter how acomplished or intelligent) can tell me what I do or do not deserve. I work hard for everything I get, and its sad to see people feel that they are so great that they actually have the audacity to tell someone they dont deserve something. Why so quick to pull people down!
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    (Original post by rajeshahluwalia)
    Thanks for the 2p, but I did not come here to have a bunch of usernames make a decision for me. Its a forum, so I put it out there. With all due respect to you, I dont think anyone (no matter how acomplished or intelligent) can tell me what I do or do not deserve. I work hard for everything I get, and its sad to see people feel that they are so great that they actually have the audacity to tell someone they dont deserve something. Why so quick to pull people down!
    I was not being condescending, if that's what you were implying.

    Just wanting you to make your own unbaised decision (you will note I have not suggested that one is better than the other).

    Rather than looking at 'brand names' go what you want to do. All three roles are very different and will require specific skillsets. You'll have to look at yourself and see what you are good at and go for whatever role you feel your skills can get you converted in.

    Edit: I've had a thimbleful of alcohol (of suspect concoctions) and I hope that ^ makes sense. Basically, go for whatever role you feel you'll have the best chance of getting converted in. If it doesn't, PM me and I'll try to rephrase it once Mr Remy and Mrs Martin have made their peace.
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    (Original post by uthinkilltellu)
    I was not being condescending, if that's what you were implying.

    Just wanting you to make your own unbaised decision (you will note I have not suggested that one is better than the other).

    Rather than looking at 'brand names' go what you want to do. All three roles are very different and will require specific skillsets. You'll have to look at yourself and see what you are good at and go for whatever role you feel your skills can get you converted in.

    Edit: I've had a thimbleful of beer and I hope that ^ makes sense. Basically, go for whatever role you feel you'll have the best chance of getting converted in.
    ya, i think thats what it will come down, choosing the area that I prefer and that will suit my skills...but sometimes its hard not to get taken in by the whole prestige thing....i am trying to get in touch with people from the actual divisions to get a better understanding, hopefully that will help too.
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    (Original post by rajeshahluwalia)
    ya, i think thats what it will come down, choosing the area that I prefer and that will suit my skills...but sometimes its hard not to get taken in by the whole prestige thing....i am trying to get in touch with people from the actual divisions to get a better understanding, hopefully that will help too.
    Just know that this market is applying a massive risk premium for 'prestige'. Whilst it has its place, be very careful about how much you factor it in to your decision. Market fundamentals have changed a lot in the last 3 years, don't base it on a bunch of A-levelers and 2nd yr university students who haven't spent more than a spring week on a bank floor preaching to you about 'prestige'. Good luck.
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    (Original post by ghostrider88)
    RBS DCM every time.

    City Monkey is 100% right, all you numpties choosing on this brand/prestige are clueless.

    DCM is booming and RBS has a good rep on the street in this area. Comparatively better than MS ER (name me one MS sector team that has produced a notoriously accurate/impressive report in the last year?) and HSBC AM (no comment).



    What's wrong with him being proud to work there? If you're like most other people on this forum who have this idiotic and irrational attachment to 'brands' and so automatically denigrate RBS without having a clue what you're talking about, then you're in no position to criticize him. RBS has desks in GBM which are top 5 globally. Fact. And DCM is up there.

    I know idiots like you find that hard to believe, but you should do a bit more research.
    When did I say there was something wrong with that? Personally, from the people i know at rbs, its a real ******** there. Rather than criticising the brand, I was attacking his shameless bias towards RBS, regardless of the differentiation between roles on offer.

    If you see other metrics as important such as 'culture', then rankings are pretty meaningless, just like brands.

    I think you should do a 'bit more research'. I can name you many strong sector teams at MS ER, based not only on the quality of research but standing with the best fund managers. But I'm sure you know more than me, you've probably read all the research at MS, rather than sitting at a desk doing actual equity research and generating revenue.
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    (Original post by uthinkilltellu)
    RBS DCM rankings:

    Global debt: #10
    Global Investment Grade Corporate Debt: #8
    Global Mortgage-Backed Securities: #7
    Global Asset-Backed Securities: #5
    All Bonds in Euros: #7
    Global High Yield Debt: #10


    2009 Extel (by bank):


    OP: I do this less and less frequently now... But I'll give you my 2p's worth: if you have to come to a student forum and ask a bunch of usernames which firm you should join then you don't deserve an offer.
    Just for your info, nobody in ER cares about extel. It is a much lesser survey to II.
 
 
 
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