Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    The site reads like a joke in very poor taste to me. Is it definitely real? I mean the list of services gets odder and odder as you read it.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by missygeorgia)
    The vast majority of prostitutes are on hard drugs, or have been repeatedly raped, or were sexually or physically abused as children, have been homeless, or want to leave prostitution. There are statistics repeatedly proving this. I find it very, very difficult to believe that an informed, independent choice to enter prostitution is anything but a rarity.
    The vast majority of Ethiopian farmers are living on less than a dollar a day, grew up in an incredibly impoverished household, barely manage to provide enough food for themselves, have had no education and want to leave farming. There are statistics repeatedly proving this.

    The depressing truth is that choice is a privelege only granted to the wealthy. Here in Britain we take choice for granted. The poor in society must do what they can to survive. You could say that ANY low-paid job (i.e. my farming example) is exploitation.

    Moreover, people will still enter prostitution regardless of its legality. Although making it legal will lead to some increase in the number of prostitutes, collectively they will all be able to receive better working conditions as we'll be able to start regulating it.

    It is distressing that a lot of people receive a very bad upbringing and are left at a serious disadvantage, but after a while you gotta accept that people are still responsible for themselves. For example, we still have to punish criminals, even if nearly all them are a product of their upbringing. When there are people who manage to do relatively well in spite of a bad upbringing, you can't let everyone who had a bad upbringing take no responsibility for their actions.


    (Original post by missygeorgia)
    I'm at a loss as to why, when saying 'you shouldn't compare rapists to people who use prostitutes' (or something similar), you claim you were just talking about legal prostitution, since the person you were replying to obviously wasn't, and prostitution isn't legal in this country.
    I just don't accept that prostitution involves zero consent. Obviously you can be heavily pushed towards it by a certain type upbringing, but are all woman who had type of upbringing now prostitutes? No. Unlike rape, you aren't being physically held down by another person and forced into it. By your logic I could tell you that purchasing agricultural products from Ethiopian farmers is abhorrent because it's fuelling an industry where people are forced into abject poverty and then pass on this poverty to their children. It's the exact same kind of situation!

    I suppose if you're that inclined towards determinism, you could argue that NO ONE is responsible for any of their actions. Hypothetically, I could say it would be okay for me to refuse to give to charity or to be arrogant and selfish and uncaring because I'm just a product of the rich, capitalist society I grew up in. And it just wouldn't work. Mentally stable adults have to be held accountable for their actions, regardless of their upbringing. As compelling as determinist philosophies are, they just aren't practical.

    And paying someone for sex is legal in this country by the way.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by numb3rb0y)
    How arrogant you must be to assume that these poor little women couldn't possibly make a free choice to do something.
    How unintelligent and rigid you must be to make an assumption like that.
    Offline

    3
    (Original post by jismith1989)
    How arrogant you must be to assume that there is no level of coercion.
    I'm not assuming they're not coerced, I simply recognise that it is wrong to assume that they are, as so many people are unfortunately far too quick to do.

    (Original post by Earthly)
    How unintelligent and rigid you must be to make an assumption like that.
    You're the sexist here, not me. Maybe you should deal with your own issues before going around calling others unintelligent for pointing out that adults can make their own decisions without getting Earthly's say-so.

    The cry of "We must protect the prostitutes!" is founded on the assumption that prostitutes are basically children who couldn't possibly manage their own affairs and must be being forced into it. I can say this with a good deal of certainty because the people saying it aren't saying "We must protect the abused prostitutes!", they're saying prostitutes are abused. That's incredibly offensive and demeaning to people who've simply made an employment decision; either they're told someone else knows better how to live their lives than them, or they simply don't exist. Until someone can actually demonstrate that there's something inherently wrong with a consensual transaction involving sex, that's not cool.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    Sadly, we lost the battle, and it is soon to become illegal to pay for sex with a trafficked sex worker. We have now ensured that all the sex workers on this site sign to assure us that they work of their own free will and are not trafficked. This means disabled visitors can feel safe to book them. Disabled people need this reassurance. if you are blind, you don't know if you are being followed by a cop; if you need to be pushed in your wheelchair by a PA, taking part in illegal acts would be breaking your contract with them. Many disabled people find it virtually impossible to be "naughty".
    I was under the impression that people trafficking is generally a bad thing that leaves plenty of room for mistreatment and desperate people being forced into situations they don't want to be in. If they can get willing workers instead, why are they so pro-trafficking?! That seems... weird to me. Am I missing something?
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by numb3rb0y)
    I'm not assuming they're not coerced, I simply recognise that it is wrong to assume that they are, as so many people are unfortunately far too quick to do.


    You're the sexist here, not me. Maybe you should deal with your own issues before going around calling others unintelligent for pointing out that adults can make their own decisions without getting Earthly's say-so.

    The cry of "We must protect the prostitutes!" is founded on the assumption that prostitutes are basically children who couldn't possibly manage their own affairs and must be being forced into it. I can say this with a good deal of certainty because the people saying it aren't saying "We must protect the abused prostitutes!", they're saying prostitutes are abused. That's incredibly offensive and demeaning to people who've simply made an employment decision; either they're told someone else knows better how to live their lives than them, or they simply don't exist. Until someone can actually demonstrate that there's something inherently wrong with a consensual transaction involving sex, that's not cool.
    You come across so immature. I didn’t say you were sexist, and I called you unintelligent because of your blatant rigidity. I’m more than willing to discuss this issue with you amicably, but it appears like you’re more concerned with convincing yourself you’re right, than being yielding, compassionate and discovering the actual truth. You’re discussing a subject with someone who specialises in it, who has done plenty research into the facts, and who is pursuing a career in this field. Re-read my previous posts with an open mind, and be yielding towards the truth, instead of rigidly blocking it out due to your ego. Do this and I will be happy to have an agreeable debate with you.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Earthly)
    Re-read my pervious posts


    :getmecoat:
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by jismith1989)


    :getmecoat:
    lol that's a gudn!
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by MittenKrust)
    Its just a difference of opinion but it brings up the idea of what is exploitation, if the women want to work in it how is it exploiting them, if they get paid well and want to do it then so what.

    However to compare someone who pays for sex to a rapist is quite stupid to be honest, I have a friend who worked in Amsterdam for 2 years, he paid for sex sometimes but he said it was because it worked out cheaper than a date and because it is big industry across there the workers get regular drug and std checks so its actually safer than meeting a random girl in a bar.
    I think the point is he was happy to have sex with someone who didn't want to have sex with him and didn't care; sex to most people should be a mutual thing.

    I personally don't think prostitution should be illegal though, I don't see why it's impossible for someone to enjoy that sort of career, giving someone physical pleasure especially people who can’t get it elsewhere could prove re-warding to many and if it's monitored properly no one should be forced into it more than any other job.

    And to a previous post – there’s nothing wrong with indulging in fantasy and it is not mutually exclusive from learning to deal with life. Most people to this to an extent anyway.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    I think it's quite franky disgusting.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Earthly)
    I strongly disaprove. Don't get me wrong, i feel sorry for the disabled people who arn't getting any, but i hate the idea of prostitution, women should not have to do that kind of work.
    They don't "have" to. It's their choice.

    If they was being forced I would strongly dissaprove, but in this case they're not and I feel it's a perfectly acceptable and legit profession.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Earthly)
    Hardly any women want to be prostitutes, some may say they do, but I promise you they’re lying.

    Your friend cannot be 100% sure the girls he paid to have sex with were completely willing. A lot of enslaved girls are shipped to Amsterdam because they ‘work’ for less than the legitimate prostitutes, they too ‘work’ in the parlours just like the girls who pay taxes- your friend wouldn’t know the difference.

    The reason I compare men who pay for sex to rapists is because they’re fuelling the industry, if it wasn’t for people like your friend, women wouldn’t be enslaved, raped and tortured because there would be no demand.
    (Original post by missygeorgia)
    The vast majority of prostitutes are on hard drugs, or have been repeatedly raped, or were sexually or physically abused as children, have been homeless, or want to leave prostitution. There are statistics repeatedly proving this. I find it very, very difficult to believe that an informed, independent choice to enter prostitution is anything but a rarity.

    I must have slept with at least fifty prostitutes. Not streetwalkers, but independant escorts, Dutch window girls and the classy brothels. It's street walkers and crappy illegal brothels that have traficked girls, also sticking to Western European women really goes a long way in eliminating the possibility of trafficking.

    Through experience I can tell you that escorts, the kind of girl that charges £150+ an hour, have serious addictions - generally to shoes, cars and clothes. They want to live a footballer's wife lifestyle. I've seen a woman who told me she once spent £2000 on a pair of shoes. Most have their own houses as well as an upscale apartment they work out of, and fancy cars (the only Lambourghini I have ever seen belonged to an escort). These are not oppressed women; they're women who have great business acumen and pay no attention to popular Judaeo-Christian morality that society shoves down our throats, and of course very expensive tastes.

    Streetwalkers and seedy illegal brothels are where you get drug users, trafficked women, pimps, et cetera. Lumping prostitution together and saying that the independant escort who charges £2000 a night and the heroin-addled, pimped, trafficked streetwalker are the same thing is like saying that consentual sex and rape are the same thing. It's a ridiculous positition to hold; every sex-positive feminist you care to mention would argue similarly.

    I'd also like to ask; how many prostitutes do you actually know? How many have you actually spoken to? Or did you just suck up all of Harridan Harpy's (Harriet Harman) bile?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Notker)
    they're women who have great business acumen and pay no attention to popular Judaeo-Christian morality that society shoves down our throats, and of course very expensive tastes.
    Eh? I don't know about your environment, but I'm rarely in contact with Abrahamic morality. If anything, spending as much money as one is able on consumer items is the Western norm.

    Of course, your distinction may have some (though, like everything, not absolute) validity. Nonetheless, I am worried by the glamorisation of ostentatious consumption (or addiction thereto, as you characterise it), but I suppose that's veering off into a different issue.

    Again, one could also argue that clients' sense of entitlement to attractive women that money can bring in such an environment can entail negative effects.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by jismith1989)
    Eh? I don't know about your environment, but I'm rarely in contact with Abrahamic morality.
    It is societally entrenched from over a thousand years of influence. Whether you recognise it or not most of our 'common moral values', particularly with regards to sex, are derived from Christian teachings.

    (Original post by jismith1989)
    Of course, your distinction may have some (though, like everything, not absolute) validity. Nonetheless, I am worried by the glamorisation of ostentatious consumption (or addiction thereto, as you characterise it), but I suppose that's veering off into a different issue.
    We all participate, and are addicted to, ostentatious consumption. The difference is we slave away for a month of 9-5 to earn what a professional esort can in a few hours.

    (Original post by jismith1989)
    Again, one could also argue that the sense of entitlement to attractive women that money can bring in such an environment can bring negative effects.
    I don't have a sense of entitlement. If I have the money to pay for a couple of hours with a stunningly beautiful, 6ft tall, 32FF, blue-eyed blonde I choose to spend it on that rather than, say, a new PC. If I chose to pay for the new PC instead does that infer that I have a sense of entitlement towards having a new PC? Of course not.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by jismith1989)
    Cool, I'm glad to hear it. It's encouraging to challenge the assumption of this website that all disabled people are unfit to find relationships etc. (even though it may well be the case in some instances, just as it may in the case of many non-disabled people).
    I wouldn't say that the website says that at all, just that they are able to accommodate the needs of someone who is disabled. Obviously there are different levels of disability and no-one has said 'everyone who is disabled will find it hard to have sex.' The fact is though that some disabilities (depending on severity etc) will make it harder for people to build relationships and this includes physical relationships. This site is just one that caters specifically for this type of client.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by numb3rb0y)
    How arrogant you must be to assume that these poor little women couldn't possibly make a free choice to do something.
    If Prostitution was legal then she could make the choice, it's her body she can do what she wants.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by innerhollow)
    It's just another job. You could say that hiring people to be cleaners is exploitation because they don't really choose it- they just do it out of the need to make money. No one really has a choice in life- you gotta do what you need to in order to survive. Seriously, it's better to have it legal where we can at least regulate it and make sure it's safe, and we can actually reduce exploitation by guaranteeing the right of women who want to stop being a prostitute to leave the industry. If a grown woman (let's disregard male prostitutes for now) wants to work such a job, that's her pregorative. She's not so weak and frail that she can't make her own decisions.

    I'm in support of legalising prostitution obviously, so that would include this sex workers for the disabled thing.
    Why?
    There seems to be a massive double standard that if a male is a prostitute 'that's alright, good for him,' but if a woman is a prostitute everyone immediately thinks drugs, rape, trafficking etc.

    I understand why the latter is an issue but I don’t see why it would be impossible for woman to chose the job and possibly like their job... everyone's different after all.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    I think society should have better respect for women.
    Offline

    3
    (Original post by Earthly)
    You come across so immature.
    Opening with an ad hominem? Classy.

    (Original post by Earthly)
    I didn’t say you were sexist, and I called you unintelligent because of your blatant rigidity.
    You're the one leaping to the assumption that prostitutes must have been forced into it, and I'm rigid?

    *slowly shakes head*

    (Original post by Earthly)
    I’m more than willing to discuss this issue with you amicably, but it appears like you’re more concerned with convincing yourself you’re right, than being yielding, compassionate and discovering the actual truth. You’re discussing a subject with someone who specialises in it, who has done plenty research into the facts, and who is pursuing a career in this field. Re-read my previous posts with an open mind, and be yielding towards the truth, instead of rigidly blocking it out due to your ego. Do this and I will be happy to have an agreeable debate with you.
    For someone who's apparently specialised in this field, you haven't cited much to back up your wild claims and assumptions. All you've done is post more and more of your tired quasi-religious morality and sexism. Post some evidence of your claims and I might be willing to respond, but absent that, I shall simply assume you're a troll and bow out.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Kendun)
    If Prostitution was legal then could make the choice, it's her body she can do what she wants.
    Prostitution is perfectly legal, and always has been in Britain. Some things surrounding it are illegal namely pimping, curb crawling, streetwalking and running a brothel; the illegality of these things are to protect women from exploitation and abuse.
 
 
 
Reply
Submit reply
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

Updated: January 23, 2010
Poll
Do you agree with the PM's proposal to cut tuition fees for some courses?
Useful resources

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.