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TSR Argument:'There is no point going to university if it isn't in the Russell Group' watch

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    (Original post by az1992)
    come again?
    maybe i've misinterpreted what you have said but.........
    indeed st andrews and durham are better but the way you put that you make it look as though all those unis are sheds of education in comparison with the mighty st andrews and durham?
    Are they? :O
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    (Original post by jakemittle)
    Are they? :O
    apparently so, although if i had the choice out of those two and the others, I would rather choose one of the others ie manchester, cardiff as i consider those cities more exciting then Durham and am probably likely to meet students from a more varying background.
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    russel group is just that 20 universities that get the most government funding for research or something aren't they? So obviously not necessarily the best.
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    Although I dislike elitism. I don't see why it should be narrowed down so much, perhaps top 50 instead of these specific groups? I don't personally see anything wrong with my top two choices (Reading & Aberystwyth), and I even had an offer from a Russell Group university (Leeds) which I haven't chosen as one of my top two.

    Also in honesty, it depends on what subject you are doing. If you want to do a Creative Arts such as I am going to, the league tables are quite irrelevant when choosing a university.
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    (Original post by kratos90)
    russel group is just that 20 universities that get the most government funding for research or something aren't they? So obviously not necessarily the best.
    Yeah, but many uni's are judged on the quaility of their research which tends to go hand in hand with the amount of funds they get. the 20 of them get something like 2/3rds of all funding to the government sends to universities.
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    Nonsense.
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    Russell Group universities aren't the be all and end all. All it means to be in the Russell Group is that the university receives a lot more research funding, and to be fair, at an undergraduate level this means squat.
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    (Original post by shyopstv)
    The bold assertion was that going to a university not in the top 20 for a partiuclar subect is probably not going to improve somebody's job prospects and the reason why I said that you do not have the life experience required to make that assertion is because as you said, neither you nor any of your peers are in graduate jobs right now let alone employing new graduates for graduate jobs and so are relying on articles from the biased, sensationalist media.

    'Graduates have the wrong skills' is not something that is going to be fixed by a top 20 uni. Especially with arts degrees, most employers will not give a **** about your knowledge of the subject that you studied and will care more about "soft skills" which unis spend comparatively little time teaching regardless of whether it is Oxford or London Met.



    Never before have I seen a TSR user contradict their own username so much :p:
    lol oh no its only so i get enough money to fund my coke and faberche egg addiction before crashing my ferrari into a wall at 27
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    Hard work is important, but I do think that the university matters at the end of the day to a certain extent. It is a competitive world after all and graduating with a degree from a top 20 university or so would do your chances a world of good. Put yourself in the shoes of a prospective employer; let's say a top law firm. How would you choose between two applicants, one from the University of Bristol and the other from UWE, Bristol?

    You and I both know the answer to that; the Bristol Uni candidate will most likely bag the job.
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    Oh, and replying to the topic on hand, that statement is not entirely true with respect. As someone has mentioned, being in the Russell Group does not necessarily mean that it is the top 20 in the country. It is purely based on research output, and would bear little impact to undergraduates. It is a point to consider however, that all Russell Group unis are generally very good on the whole. Of course, there is the 1994 Group too. Everyone should strive to get to the best uni they can possible, and using the Russell Group and the 1994 Group unis as a target seems reasonable to me.
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    i applied to unis; didnt even think about the russell group or what not
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    (Original post by Tha_Black_Shinobi)
    well thats not true. http://www.highfliers.co.uk/download/GM10Report.pdf
    this article would beg to differ. Where it states the most targeted unis for graduate recruitment for the top unis were mainly Russeell Group. There was NOT one ex-poly in there. Maybe when your talking about serving coffee people from ex-polys are more desired but when it comes to the upper echelons of graduate jobs where the highest salaries are an Economics graduate from Warwick will be more desired than someone with a BA in Stage Management fro Birmingham City
    I didn't say they get into the best jobs, just that they do get graduate positions on leaving uni, and quite quickly. Presumably, they didn't have the grades to get into a top Uni. The statement that there's "no point" going unless it's a top University implies that, unless it is, you might as well not go at all. Since obviously these people who didn't get into those Universities wouldn't get the jobs they have without a degree... there's obviously not "no point".
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    that is an arrogant statement - not saying u are a toff, but just saying that people who think like that aren't worth the plane they are born on! :cool: - scum of the earth if you ask me. Happiness is the most important thing in life and a uni that brings happiness is the most important thing...and if uni doesn't bring you happiness then you shouldn't go to uni - simple
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    Theres no point going to university full stop, at the rate the tuition fees are going :p:
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    Well, I'm applying to an ex-poly that I really want to go to. In the field I want to study it's the best in the country and leads to good employability opportunities afterwards. Russell/1994 group unis aren't always the best, especially in healthcare related fields (nursing, paramedic science etc)!
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    (Original post by chriscpritchard)
    Well, I'm applying to an ex-poly that I really want to go to. In the field I want to study it's the best in the country and leads to good employability opportunities afterwards. Russell/1994 group unis aren't always the best, especially in healthcare related fields (nursing, paramedic science etc)!
    respect for you mate! nothing but respect. I wish i went to a ex poly - the people there must be much better than in the russel gp - i'm at UCL n i hate it - full of 2 many toffs who think they're better than anyone and anything from a stateschool!

    To the guy who neg repped me saying "my anti snobbery is out of order" --> your snobbery is out of order :rolleyes:
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    lets change it then...


    There is not point going to a uni if it isn't a top 20 or russel group

    that is better and probbably now true by TSR standards
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    Look, the term 'Russell Group' is a little misleading because it is seen by the mainstream media to represent out 'ivy league' and they often call it 'the 20 most prestigious universitires' (according to a recent Independent article). However, we all know that it is just a collection of the 20 biggest reserach institutions and that a few other uni's are research intensive enough to be in there (Bath, Durham, York, St Andrews and maybe Exeter). Although i would argue that that's it and places like Loughborough should not be.

    The point is that the general public have often heard of the group and no doubt it helps going there. You will find that the people on here who say going to a Russel group is not important dont go to one, and those that say it is important do.

    If you look at the list all the big players that have dominated the top 10-15 places in league tables and have the highest entry requirements are there, bar Durham, York, Bath and St Andrews (which are nevertheless small) i.e:

    Oxbridge
    LSE (sought to join so must be important)
    Imperial
    UCL
    Warwick (sought to join as well)
    Bristol
    Edinburgh
    Nottingham
    Kings


    And then the big player red brick's like Manchester, Sheffield, Birmingham, Leeds e.t.c


    It is a pretty good grouping, and if the thread said the 94 group as well then i would agree that going to Russel group (or some 94 group ones) is very important and more of a return on your money.

    People forget here that an LSE study recently showed that going to a Russel Group uni increased your lifetime earnings by quite alot - so it must count for something.
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    (Original post by domino0806)
    Durham and St Andy's aren't in the Russell group whereas universities such as Birmingham, Cardiff, Leeds, Liverpool, Sheffield, Manchester, Newcastle are, and they're obviously worse...

    Yes, obviously...
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    Students who think it's worth going to a RG university have probably been a victim of advertising by certain universities who boast about their membership of such an organisation, how much money is being spent on research and all that academia **** waving. In reality, it means little, if any, to undergraduates. The assumption of research-intensive universities providing the best teaching in said disciplines has been proved non-existent and it is only a academia's tradition that keeps this debate going.

    Bias disclaimer: I'm at Durham, for now.
 
 
 
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