Turn on thread page Beta

Chivalry and gentlemanliness seem to be irrelavant nowadays... opinions? watch

    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by missygeorgia)
    You don't really believe this though, do you? Let's weigh it up- on the one hand, I can't own property, can't get easily educated or get a degree to the same standard as men, can't get a particularly fulfilling job, can't take my husband to court if he rapes me, can't vote if I hate the way the country is being run, can't control whether I have children or not, can't have sex when I want to. But men open doors for me.

    When you look at it like that, feminism seems totally worth it, doesn't it?
    Yea, but you can trust men to do all those things for you, and on the other hand, you lead a really cushy life.

    In regards to the rape thing, that was nothing to do with feminism at all. It wasn't statutory law that before 1991 men could rape their wives, it was common law, and it hadn't been challenged in hundreds of years... the court didn't overturn it because of feminism O_o
    Offline

    12
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Bagration)
    Blame women, not men, for this. I don't really understand feminism. You could have men being nice and gentlemanly to you all the time, you'd not have to work, and still retain a whole ton of advantages, what's the point? Why do you want to be equal when being inferior would be so much better?
    :rofl:
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Rick-Raith)
    I feel that there has been a major loss amongst all the guys in the world of the qualities of chivalry and being gentlemanly...

    And even if there are guys who are chivalrous or gentlemanly it seems more of a detriment than an actual bonus quality.

    What is up with this and what is the deal?
    I nearly pee my pants when a guy opens the door for me. I think that's as far as being a gentleman goes nowadays
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Chivalry and gentlemanliness are very good qualities to have, you just need to know when to use them!
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Bagration)
    X
    Ian Smith? Controversial
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Moe Lester)
    Ian Smith? Controversial
    Not for someone who happens to own a 5'3' Rhodesian flag
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    i completley prefer a guy to be a gentlemen. if he was to open a door for me or offer to carry my bags it would be really grateful. i do think its woman who have changed that whole thing because i dont think any guys have a problem with doing it..they just dont see the point because women have started to care less and less. but personally, chivallry would have a huge impact on how much i liked a guy.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Bagration)
    Not for someone who happens to own a 5'3' Rhodesian flag
    Why the admiration, bar the obvious decline of Rhodesia post glorious revolution?
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Bagration)
    Yea, but you can trust men to do all those things for you, and on the other hand, you lead a really cushy life.

    In regards to the rape thing, that was nothing to do with feminism at all. It wasn't statutory law that before 1991 men could rape their wives, it was common law, and it hadn't been challenged in hundreds of years... the court didn't overturn it because of feminism O_o
    Chivalry didn't mean that all men were automatically saints. Many women were left in poverty because they couldn't own property.

    Not being able to have sex out of marriage, not really being able to choose your marriage partner yourself, not being able to decide whether or not to have children, not being able to have a say regarding politics, not being able to have a fulfilling career- all very, very major. I would much rather have all these things than sit around all day bored out of my mind with men being polite to me, and I'm sure the vast, vast majority of women would agree.

    Besides, why can't women have equal rights and still be treated respectfully?
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by missygeorgia)
    Chivalry didn't mean that all men were automatically saints. Many women were left in poverty because they couldn't own property.

    Not being able to have sex out of marriage, not really being able to choose your marriage partner yourself, not being able to decide whether or not to have children, not being able to have a say regarding politics, not being able to have a fulfilling career- all very, very major. I would much rather have all these things than sit around all day bored out of my mind with men being polite to me, and I'm sure the vast, vast majority of women would agree.

    Besides, why can't women have equal rights and still be treated respectfully?
    Chivalry itself as an official code of conduct largely pertained to relations between upper class men, not actually very much to do with women at all. But "to be chivalrous" is to behave in a gentlemanly manner towards women. If you accept that women are equal to men I don't we should behave towards you in any unequal way.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Bagration)
    Chivalry itself as an official code of conduct largely pertained to relations between upper class men, not actually very much to do with women at all. But "to be chivalrous" is to behave in a gentlemanly manner towards women. If you accept that women are equal to men I don't we should behave towards you in any unequal way.
    So we agree then.
    • Wiki Support Team
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    Wiki Support Team
    I think there's a huge difference between being patronising or a complete wet blanket and being gentlemanly..if the OP's finding that he's having issues it probably because he's falling into one of these two categories. There's also a lot of people that try too hard to act one way or another, I've seen a lot of people try far too hard (both men and women) to be kind, or tough or in this case chivalrous and whatever they're trying to be it just comes of as being really insincere and slimy...surely everyone understands good manners and the fact that you have them shouldn't be something to show off about :rolleyes:
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by missygeorgia)
    So we agree then.
    No, we don't. If you want to be equal to men then I will try you how I treat men, i.e. largely like ****.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Bagration)
    No, we don't. If you want to be equal to men then I will try you how I treat men, i.e. largely like ****.
    Thankfully you're an exception from my experience. Everyone should treat everyone else with respect, obviously, and making a distinction between the way you treat men and women is to miss the point.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Notker)
    'Chivalry is dead, women killed it'. You want all the perks of being a lady without acting like one; buy your own dinner, open your own doors, carry your own bags.
    I agree with this

    It pretty much died with equal rights
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by missygeorgia)
    Thankfully you're an exception from my experience. Everyone should treat everyone else with respect, obviously, and making a distinction between the way you treat men and women is to miss the point.
    How many hills can you see over on that horse of yours?
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Bagration)
    How many hills can you see over on that horse of yours?
    I don't think 'treat others respectfully' is a particularly self righteous notion. It's just obvious.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by missygeorgia)
    I don't think 'treat others respectfully' is a particularly self righteous notion. It's just obvious.
    "Treat me with respect because I inherently deserve it", on the other hand...
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Bagration)
    "Treat me with respect because I inherently deserve it", on the other hand...
    Maybe we have different ideas of what respect means. I'm talking basic manners.
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    A lot of "chivalric" behaviour has underlying tones of sexism because all these codes were created in a time when women were considered to be inferior to men, and treated as such (as missygeorgia has nicely illustrated). So a lot of it has become archaic and unnecessary as women have become more independent. The few things that remain are politenesses, but generally things that I would suggest should be offered to either sex. I can behave like a "lady" when it's appropriate, but in more day-to-day things I prefer to assume my gender doesn't really matter. I've never understood the walking on the outside of pavement thing though - what's that all about?

    When it comes to things like paying in restaurants, I think it depends on the couple's situation. Though I was quite annoyed when I took my boyfriend out to a very nice restaurant for his birthday, made the booking in my name, handed the waiter my card (which says "Dr H ******" on it), and they came back and gave him the chip and pin machine. Whether this was because they thought he must be paying, or that Dr H ****** must be male, either way I was not impressed at the assumption.
 
 
 
Reply
Submit reply
Turn on thread page Beta
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

Updated: January 28, 2010
Poll
How are you feeling in the run-up to Results Day 2018?

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.