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    there is no life after death no matter how much i wanna believe otherwise when we die that is it
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    (Original post by CrzySxyCool)
    i sound stupid now dont i!but what i meant was when my mum died her heart was still beating but she had "gone" and they said that she was clinically dead
    Was she on life support? Perhaps she had no brain activity but her tissues were being perfused, and therefore alive, through an artifial lung and heart.

    Even people who have been noted as brain dead have been able to regain brain function to a certain degree if the life support allows for healing and enough fucntion is left to facilitate that healing.

    Truly dead is when all your organs have stopped functioning. Clinically dead is when your brain doesn't show activity.

    No one has come back from being brain dead or completely dead and remembered anything about an afterlife... only "tunnel vision" (in brain dead artificially supported patients only, not the completely dead).

    Someone in surgery still has an brain that is active... they are not completely dead. The anesthesia was probably slightly underdosed and they were able to have a surreal experience. You are drugged like hell, of course you are going to see yourself below yourself. LOL

    The "light" by some people's theories is the tunnel vision one sees as they are going out. Just because their heart stops beating for a short time does not mean that they were dead. The mind may be able to remember things and (obviously) misinterpret them if there only a certain amount of time has passed... even if brain dead by our instruments. Just because the mind can function when we detect no activity does not mean some sort of activity is still not taking place. This can be seen as supportive of life after death or not supportive... the evidence yet is not compelling to me for the latter.
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    (Original post by caz)
    how was it lying? it's also true that the world is round, there is much evidence to suggest this. if we had no proof, we'd probably still think the world is flat

    likewise, we have lots of reports, research, and events that suggest there is pre-life, and consequently afterlife, although you could always say, "Just because they found children who could recollect their previous lives, including foreign languages and speak them fluently without ever hearing a word of them, doesn't mean they've lived before! And if they did live before, that doesn't mean they'll live after this lifetime!!!!!"

    See, you can be ignorant all you want...but old-fashioned and traditional views say there is no afterlife because you cannot prove it, while in this modern, changing world, some of us don't pay attention to old ideas and do pay attention to modern ones, including these cases, which provide proof of afterlife. Sure, you can always say, "Well nobody knows for sure!!!" But then again, I could always say to you, "Well, I've never seen you in person. How do I know you exist? You could just a little pissed-off computer taking advantage of the fact that because so many people are ignorant to such events, you can keep telling us they aren't real, or don't prove anything."

    I could also say, "I've never seen you as a child, how do I know you were ever a child? You cannot prove it! These pictures could be fake!!!!!"

    Give me a break. How can I prove you exist? How can I prove I exist? How can I prove my perception of the color blue matches your perception? You cannot prove anything, really. Let's not remove all of our rational thinking processes. All we have to go by is studies, if you want to be this practical, and these studies do exist. But, then again you probably don't believe in hypnosis either because you can't prove it's real because you've never been through it. So, oh well
    Could someone provide a link about those children?

    To those of us who are medical professionals, and know the system, and know what the studies actually studied, the modern cases are no proof. See above post.

    Our minds are complex and have a lot of higher fucntions we don't access on a daily basis... and they are only accessed when we are drugged, skilled at meditation, or on our deathbed. They are not proof of an actual afterlife... even if more complex and thorough than any study I have read about (in other words, providing something more than a "light" and "tunnel vision" when someone was not brain dead or proven to be brain dead [just guessed to be, as with surgical patients]).

    Let me add that when the heart stops pumping, the drug does not enter the brain anymore to the same extent. This explains the tunnel vision because the brain can detect strange things happening to field of vision and when we loose blood to our brain, we also know it interprets things in very strange ways and it makes some of our organs spaz out... and seeing visions of light behind closed eyes is akin to the state while on LSD. They have proven that the receptors activiation on drugs that give this closed eye vision/hallucination are also being activated when someone is in the dying process.
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    ok now let me tell u a story. a year ago my little bro (he was 11 at that time) was diagnosed with cancer. he had this tumor in his throat. the thing with this kind of cancer is that it cannot be removed coz this would cause an unstoppable bleeding and the death of a patient. the only thing the docs could do was the chemiotherapy. my bro was taken to the hospital and he had to undergo some medical tests. one of those was checking if he had cancer cells in his spine (im not sure if u r aware of the method of checkin it so: they placed my bro on one side on this, they put him to sleep and they put a huge needle in his spine to take some fluid out of it) since they had found sth wrong in my bros spine they had to repeat the whole thing 14 times during the year in hospital.my bro was really brave at that time but he was rather scared of this needle in back and all so he asked my dad who is a doctor as well to stay in the operation room. my father tried to stay but when my brother was under narcosis my dad could not stand looking at Pawel's lil body being punctured. so he left the room and was standing in the hall. soon a nurse came and my dad was talking with her till the end of the "operation". then when my bro was about to wake my dad came into the room.my bro woke up and the first thing he said was: why did u left me? my dad said: what do u mean? and then he said: u promised ull be with me all the time but u left and u talked to the nurse!why did u left me? my dad was shocked. after a while he asked: how do u know? Pawel said: i was in the upper corner of the room. i saw u leaving and then i could see the other room with u and the nurse. my dad was speechless. i havent talked to my bro about that. im too scared to ask. i asked one guy thou who is said to know sth about those spooky things and he said that thou my bro was only under narcosis and not dead his consciousness kinda "stuck" to my dad as if for security.thou he was unconscious he had to watch my dad. and he did somehow.mind is a powerful thing.

    i know it sounds stupid or even unbelievable but i didnt make that up.


    ps this happened 3 times thou my dad never left the room from that time. my bro was able to tell where my dad was standing or which doc was doing what during the operation.
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    (Original post by jazzy_girl)
    ok now let me tell u a story. a year ago my little bro (he was 11 at that time) was diagnosed with cancer. he had this tumor in his throat. the thing with this kind of cancer is that it cannot be removed coz this would cause an unstoppable bleeding and the death of a patient. the only thing the docs could do was the chemiotherapy. my bro was taken to the hospital and he had to undergo some medical tests. one of those was checking if he had cancer cells in his spine (im not sure if u r aware of the method of checkin it so: they placed my bro on one side on this, they put him to sleep and they put a huge needle in his spine to take some fluid out of it) since they had found sth wrong in my bros spine they had to repeat the whole thing 14 times during the year in hospital.my bro was really brave at that time but he was rather scared of this needle in back and all so he asked my dad who is a doctor as well to stay in the operation room. my father tried to stay but when my brother was under narcosis my dad could not stand looking at Pawel's lil body being punctured. so he left the room and was standing in the hall. soon a nurse came and my dad was talking with her till the end of the "operation". then when my bro was about to wake my dad came into the room.my bro woke up and the first thing he said was: why did u left me? my dad said: what do u mean? and then he said: u promised ull be with me all the time but u left and u talked to the nurse!why did u left me? my dad was shocked. after a while he asked: how do u know? Pawel said: i was in the upper corner of the room. i saw u leaving and then i could see the other room with u and the nurse. my dad was speechless. i havent talked to my bro about that. im too scared to ask. i asked one guy thou who is said to know sth about those spooky things and he said that thou my bro was only under narcosis and not dead his consciousness kinda "stuck" to my dad as if for security.thou he was unconscious he had to watch my dad. and he did somehow.mind is a powerful thing.

    i know it sounds stupid or even unbelievable but i didnt make that up.


    ps this happened 3 times thou my dad never left the room from that time. my bro was able to tell where my dad was standing or which doc was doing what during the operation.
    Wow that is really interesting! I hope you're brother is/gets better
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    1) re the time thing: there is a book, God and the New Physics, which goes into this time problem. if the world is simply cause and effect, then the future is already there, so it exists all the time.

    2) there is some 'quantum theory of consciousness' that allows there to be no more to us than matter (ie no afterlife), but for consciousness to exist outside the body, so these NDEs could be explained. i dont pretend to understand it though, so u'd have to look it up in google if u want to know it.

    3) sorry to sound a sceptic but if u want to make it fair, u have to take into account all the 'failed' NDES - nothing happened, predicted events that were wrong etc.
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    (Original post by Cate)
    Wow that is really interesting! I hope you're brother is/gets better
    thx he is ok now. like i said its almost a year after.he s got his hair back and he even has blonde highlights which makes him look really cool (he has about 4 g/fs now!)
    last week he was on a control and everything is ok but 5 years have to pass till we say: now its over.
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    (Original post by jazzy_girl)
    ok now let me tell u a story. a year ago my little bro (he was 11 at that time) was diagnosed with cancer. he had this tumor in his throat. the thing with this kind of cancer is that it cannot be removed coz this would cause an unstoppable bleeding and the death of a patient. the only thing the docs could do was the chemiotherapy. my bro was taken to the hospital and he had to undergo some medical tests. one of those was checking if he had cancer cells in his spine (im not sure if u r aware of the method of checkin it so: they placed my bro on one side on this, they put him to sleep and they put a huge needle in his spine to take some fluid out of it) since they had found sth wrong in my bros spine they had to repeat the whole thing 14 times during the year in hospital.my bro was really brave at that time but he was rather scared of this needle in back and all so he asked my dad who is a doctor as well to stay in the operation room. my father tried to stay but when my brother was under narcosis my dad could not stand looking at Pawel's lil body being punctured. so he left the room and was standing in the hall. soon a nurse came and my dad was talking with her till the end of the "operation". then when my bro was about to wake my dad came into the room.my bro woke up and the first thing he said was: why did u left me? my dad said: what do u mean? and then he said: u promised ull be with me all the time but u left and u talked to the nurse!why did u left me? my dad was shocked. after a while he asked: how do u know? Pawel said: i was in the upper corner of the room. i saw u leaving and then i could see the other room with u and the nurse. my dad was speechless. i havent talked to my bro about that. im too scared to ask. i asked one guy thou who is said to know sth about those spooky things and he said that thou my bro was only under narcosis and not dead his consciousness kinda "stuck" to my dad as if for security.thou he was unconscious he had to watch my dad. and he did somehow.mind is a powerful thing.

    i know it sounds stupid or even unbelievable but i didnt make that up.


    ps this happened 3 times thou my dad never left the room from that time. my bro was able to tell where my dad was standing or which doc was doing what during the operation.
    undefined
    i believe all what u have said hun as im a gr8 believer in the paranormal ... i wish ur brother well hes a very brave lad take care
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    ...wise...
    that makes me laugh :rolleyes:
    wise...
    hahaha

    Caz, I am sorry, but where are you pulling this stuff from? I don't make faith beliefs - either provide evidence for this 'absolute truth' or be honest with yourself. You know nothing.
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    (Original post by 2776)
    Life after death=unproved. After all no one has "truely" died and then "came" back to life. Apart form Jesus and he didnt ecxactly say anything.
    What about Nazi camps? Didn't they kill people and bring them to life and kill them again and again?

    There also seems that few people have experienced a past life, as on Strange But True, and managing to recall vivid memories, which if they guessed right, would probably have had a minute chance of getting correct.
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    (Original post by NDGAARONDI)
    What about Nazi camps? Didn't they kill people and bring them to life and kill them again and again?
    Oh, yes, of course. Nazi camps - didn't think of those. It must be true then.
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    (Original post by eric bischoff)
    if your heart stops your dead
    But how do they know that your heart has stopped - maybe its just beating very slowly.

    I think what you're talking about is called "After Death Experiences" and I've heard that it is just a way for your brain to respond so that you don't have to experience your own death (like when you are in lots of pain you pass out so you don't have to experience it).
 
 
 
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