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    If god is able and willing to prevent evil, then there would be no evil. Otherwise god would be impotent or malevolent. Seems perfectly logical to me..
    No. Unless you can say that there is no possible state of affairs in which an omnibenevolent God can create a world where there is evil (i.e. that it contradicts the very essence of God in the same way as a triangle could not be 190 degrees), you are in no position to claim that you have disproved God, least of all appeal to logic to do so. What ablout Soul Making, what about Free Will, what about the Augustinian Theodicy. You have to show that all of these have no qualitative value before making such a statement. You must answer why a God who allows evil must by definition be malevolent. And don't you dare appeal to intuition to do so.

    You have to remember it's working along the laws of logic, not upon religious principles.
    pot, kettle, black.
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    (Original post by JayJay)
    No. Unless you can say that there is no possible state of affairs in which an omnibenevolent God can create a world where there is evil (i.e. that it contradicts the very essence of God in the same way as a triangle could not be 190 degrees), you are in no position to claim that you have disproved God, least of all appeal to logic to do so. What ablout Soul Making, what about Free Will, what about the Augustinian Theodicy. You have to show that all of these have no qualitative value before making such a statement. You must answer why a God who allows evil must by definition be malevolent. And don't you dare appeal to intuition to do so.



    pot, kettle, black.
    Exactly my point 1 and 2 are necessary truths which are proved logically, 4 is not proved logically by that argument.

    You are also correct about his hypocrisy
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    (Original post by Tek)
    Furthermore, a benevolent God would surely forgive you for not believing in him; he would judge you on your merits as a person.
    I agree with that, but how which god are we talking about here? Muslims see their god as "no way buddy, ur not in Muslim then u go to hell" whilst the rest of teh religions are a bit hazy on that issue
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    The thing i dislike about religion is it follows societies trends rather than vice versa.
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    (Original post by 2776)
    I agree with that, but how which god are we talking about here? Muslims see their god as "no way buddy, ur not in Muslim then u go to hell" whilst the rest of teh religions are a bit hazy on that issue
    Which is the other problem with Pascal's theory: he doesn't tell you which God to believe in.

    Have a look at this - http://www.abarnett.demon.co.uk/atheism/wager.html
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    The Problem of Hell is a far more powerful formulation really. Do we think that the idea of purgatory knocks that on the head though?

    (Ignoring the fact that its got no textual support whatsoever)

    I'd post an essay i did on this if it didnt also happen to be my ox essay
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    "only to come face-to-trunk with Ganesh?" what a line...
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    I don't like pascal's argument that you lose nothing by believing in God if he doesn't exist. What about all those missed oppurtunities of being cruel and evil?
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    (Original post by Seer)
    I don't like pascal's argument that you lose nothing by believing in God if he doesn't exist. What about all those missed oppurtunities of being cruel and evil?
    Yes...well only if you dont get caught...
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    The more educated religious people Tek will tell you that they do infact worship the same God, (muslims/christians/jewish people all come to together to pray) and it is merely just following a different path to him.
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    It's not quite that simple; there are some real contradictions between the religions
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    pascal would also argue that it was always rational to believe a miracle.. whatever the evidence. i've always found that quite amusing. rational to interpret anything as a sign of god - even if it only has a 0.0000000001 probability of being so.
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    (Original post by corey)
    The more educated religious people Tek will tell you that they do infact worship the same God, (muslims/christians/jewish people all come to together to pray) and it is merely just following a different path to him.
    Actually I think it's just Jews who believe that we all worship the same God. But God would be most unhappy if you didn't eat Kosher food, would he not - thus illustrating that the preferences of different Gods may hinder your acceptance into Heavan.
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    Yes true, however I am fairly sure the leaders of the major relgions do pray together at somepoint...
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    (Original post by corey)
    The more educated religious people Tek will tell you that they do infact worship the same God, (muslims/christians/jewish people all come to together to pray) and it is merely just following a different path to him.
    Also Christians worship Jesus and the Holy Trinity, don't they? Jews, on the other hand, most certainly don't...so there are in fact conflicts between Gods.
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    The more educated religious people Tek will tell you that they do infact worship the same God, (muslims/christians/jewish people all come to together to pray) and it is merely just following a different path to him.
    (Original post by Seer)
    It's not quite that simple; there are some real contradictions between the religions
    yes, and thank you to mahatma gandhi for one of the most glib, meaningless statements in the history of religious thought. One of those
    "religion is the opium of the masses"-esque platitudes that people can spout now without really giving much thought to at all. I would say that the Muslim concept of Tawhid (god's essential one-ness), and the Christian idea of the Trinity to be fairly contradictory. Only in so far as Islam regards the Christian idea of the Trinity to be a manifestation of the ultimate sin, shirk. So not much difference.
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    (Original post by JayJay)
    yes, and thank you to mahatma gandhi for one of the most glib, meaningless statements in the history of religious thought. I would say that the Muslim concept of Tawhid (god's essential one-ness), and the Christian idea of the Trinity to be fairly contradictory. Only in so far as Islam regards the Christian idea of the Trinity to be a manifestation of the ultimate sin, shirk. So not much difference.
    Plus don't some religions have more than one God? Buddism?
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    (Original post by JayJay)
    yes, and thank you to mahatma gandhi for one of the most glib, meaningless statements in the history of religious thought. I would say that the Muslim concept of Tawhid (god's essential one-ness), and the Christian idea of the Trinity to be fairly contradictory. Only in so far as Islam regards the Christian idea of the Trinity to be a manifestation of the ultimate sin, shirk. So not much difference.
    What have you applied to oxford for?
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    (Original post by Tek)
    Plus don't some religions have more than one God? Buddism?
    Yes, but don't they think that they are all part of "one"
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    (Original post by 2776)
    Yes, but don't they think that they are all part of "one"
    Maybe Ganesh's trunk is Jesus' leg!
 
 
 
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