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    If it was proven to be true, beyond a doubt, then I fall to my knees say the Shahaadah out loud, and spend the rest of my life in worship as Allah says I should.

    But all other evidence "in my life" points to the fact that it is not True at all, so I shall not
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    (Original post by mathperson)
    I don't understand what you mean when you say if it is the truth?
    Sorry, by that I mean if Islam is a true religion from God, not a man made one.
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    I believe we only get one chance at life and want to make the most of it and live it to its full. Religion (especially Islam) does not permitt this so I will never ever follow it.

    If Allah turns out to be real I don't want to hang out with that ass hat anyway with all the bad stuff he lets happen. I don't need 200,000 people to die in Haiti to test my faith thank you.
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    Hey everyone,

    I was just going thru this post and thought il add to it.
    The following video pretty much proves, on a scientific basis that Islam is the truth, taking into account the fact that the Quran was revealed 1400 years ago (6 AD) and is the only scripture to have remained in its reserved state i.e. if u find a Quran in france thats like a 100 years old and another Quran in say China, the Arabic in it will be identical. Can't say the same about other scriptures but this is a topic for another day.
    Here is the video:



    feel free to ask me questions, but quote me please
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    Just two words in response;

    Verbose. No.
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    Islam is horrible. Have you ever been to an islam dominated country? One that isn't at all secular and mixes religion with law? Let's all stone women. Great fun....
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    (Original post by HassanBHS)
    ...
    twisting some words there, world was never considered round, it's a myth that is ever was. and it is not shaped like an ostrih egg, as an ostrich egg would "pull" at the poles not flatten, the thing about the rotation of the sun is open to intterperation many ways. ok i stopped watching i'm bored, tell me what was this man's degree in?
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    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    Why doesn't that make sense?
    God's supposed to be all powerful right? It shouldn't be too difficult for him to speak to humans?

    Muslims believe the Qur'an arrived in this manner, Jews and Christians believe the 10 Commandments arrived in this manner etc.



    If he brings you enough evidence that this book he has was actually dictated to him by God and not simply something he came up with himself?



    I think that's where many religious people would disagree with you. A follower of an Abrahamic religion in particular would probably tell you that God actually said that certain things are right and wrong.


    Do you belong to any particular religion?
    i just struggle to come to terms with the fact that we should blindly trust any scripture or holy book that has been written hundreds of years ago by another human like you and i...
    i was raised as a Sikh...
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    (Original post by *Rouge*)
    i just struggle to come to terms with the fact that we should blindly trust any scripture or holy book that has been written hundreds of years ago by another human like you and i...
    i was raised as a Sikh...
    Well yes, I agree - if an ordinary human has written some scripture, there's no need to blindly trust it. But many people don't believe that their scripture was written by ordinary humans, they believe it was written by God. For example, the Qur'an says something along the lines of "Nobody could have produced this Qur'an except for Allah".

    Out of interest, where do Sikh's get their religion from? Isn't it a result of scripture which has been written by Guru's, who are human?
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    (Original post by HassanBHS)
    ...
    Nope, this man hasn't done his research.

    1) "The Big Bang" in the Qur'an:

    Here's the top three most regarded English translations of the very verses he's talking about:

    In Al-Qur'an 051.047

    YUSUFALI: With power and skill did We construct the Firmament: for it is We Who create the vastness of space.
    PICKTHAL: We have built the heaven with might, and We it is Who make the vast extent (thereof).
    SHAKIR: And the heaven, We raised it high with power, and most surely We are the makers of things ample.
    Not one of them contains the idea of an ongoing expansion of the universe. In fact, none of them refers to the “universe” at all.

    Al-Qur'an 051.048

    YUSUFALI: And We have spread out the (spacious) earth: How excellently We do spread out!
    PICKTHAL: And the earth have We laid out, how gracious is the Spreader (thereof)!
    SHAKIR: And the earth, We have made it a wide extent; how well have We then spread (it) out.
    Again, only the earth is mentioned here, nothing about the universe.

    2) Moon reflecting light:

    Nope, again, this was first hypothesized by ANAXAGORAS 428 B.C. (almost a thousand years before the Qur'an was even written), who said that the sun was a red hot stone, and the moon made of earth, for which he was accused of impiety by those who considered the heavenly bodies gods themselves. (Oh, the irony.)

    3) Spherical earth.

    Again, this was proven by ERATOSTHENES 250B.C. who correctly calculated the circumference of the earth by only using two wooden sticks and mathematical knowledge.

    4) Heliocentric theory.

    Nope, it was ARISTARCHUS of Samos 300 BC, who was the first to suggest that the Earth revolved around the Sun, rather than the other way around.

    5) Water cycle.

    Nope, this was common knowledge many, many years before the Qur'an was written, how else do you think we managed to grow successful crops?

    verses 50:9-11, 35:9, 30:48, 7:57, 25:48-49, and 45:5

    ''(God) is the One Who sends forth the winds like heralds of His Mercy. When they have carried the heavy-laden clouds, We drive them to a dead land. Then We cause water to descend and thereby bring forth fruits of every kind. Thus We will bring forth the dead. Maybe you will remember.''

    ''Have you not seen that God sent water down from the sky and led it through sources into the ground? Then he caused sown fields of different colors to grow.''
    Not in detail at all, very vague and was common knowledge thousands of years before.

    6) Plant sexes.

    Again, this was first thought by ANAXAGORAS and EMPEDOKLES 400B.C. They said that plants are moved by desire, and assert that they have perception and feel pleasure and pain. . . .Empedokles thought that sex had been mixed in them.

    7) Salt/sweet water.

    (Q25:53)"(God) is the One Who has let free the two seas, one is agreeable and sweet, the other salty and bitter. He placed a barrier between them, a partition that it is forbidden to pass."

    (Q55:19) "He has loosed the two seas. They meet together. Between them there is a barrier which they do not transgress.”
    There is neither a physical nor a virtual barrier. The fresh water mixes fully with the sea and the status quo is maintained only because a similar quantity evaporates from the sea and falls as rain upstream. Therefore, the statement that a barrier exists is simply incorrect and disproves, if further disproof were needed, the notion that the Quran was authored by an all-knowing deity.

    The lack of Arabian rivers explains why the description of the ‘two seas’ is so muddled for, surely, even an unschooled river-bank dweller would realise that the separation between fresh and salt waters exists because of the continuous downstream flow.

    Any of the 'scientific' claims in the Qur'an were discovered a thousand years before it was even written. A time when scientific knowledge wasn't squandered by impiety.

    It's the same with the 'iron miracle', iron was discovered in meteorites way before the Qur'an stated it so (it was worth more than gold thousands of years ago.) A child could observe the science known at the time, it was common knowledge.
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    That's a pretty big 'if', but no I wouldn't, because it offends my morals.
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    (Original post by Srxjer)
    Nope, this man hasn't done his research.

    1) "The Big Bang" in the Qur'an:
    1) The Big Bang in the Quran:

    You quoted 51:47 and said that the word "universe" is not mentioned. The arabic word "sama" means "Universe". It can be translated as "heaven" put it is not the "heaven" you are thinking of (as in heaven and hell). The word for "heaven" in arabic is "janaat" which is usually translated as "paradise". To confirm this difference within a Quranic context please see 3:133 41:12, 55:37 and 85:1. Also the Arabic phrase "wa'inna lamusi'una" means "We are expanding it". The translations you are using are very old so I don't know why they translated around the idea of an expansion. The most recent translations that use modern english can be found at www.quranix.com

    The correct translation for 51:47 is:
    [51:47] We constructed the universe with might, and We are expanding it.

    Here are some more Quranic verses about the universe:

    The Big Bang:
    [21:30] Did those who reject not see that the heavens and the earth were one mass and We tore them apart? That We made from the water everything that lives. Will they not acknowledge?

    The universe started off as a gas nebula:
    [41:11] Then He settled to the heaven (al-sama), while it was still gas, and He said to it, and to the earth: "Come willingly or unwillingly." They said, "We come willingly".

    2) Moon reflecting Light:
    This is mentioned in verse 25:51 in the Quran. You don't seem to have a problem with the meaning of the verse, only whether its claims are miraculous or not as you say this had already been hypothesized before the Quran. You are probably correct, however this verse of the Quran may not be scientifically miraculous, but it is still scientifically correct. There is no contradiction in the Quran within itself or with nature (please read the article "No Contradiction in the Quran" by Edip Yuksel for more detail: http://19.org/index.php?id=14,277,0,0,1,0)

    3) Spherical Earth:
    This is mentioned in the Quran in verses 39:5 and 79:30. If you do not see this as miraculous then thats fine, it could very well have been knowledge to people before the Quran. However other Hadith literature written by Arabs contains many scientific flaws inluding the shape of the Earth. This Hadith literature was written two centuries after Muhammad's death, and as these Arab men thought that the Earth was flat, it couldnt have been common knowledge for an Arab man in Muhammad's time that the Earth is round. For more information please read the article "Earth is fixed, or you are Dead" by Edip Yuksel: http://www.19.org/index.php?aid=308

    4) The Earth revolves around the Sun...
    However the Quran also mentions that that the Sun is also in orbit in verses 21:33 and 36:40. We now know that the Sun rotates about its own axis and like all stars in our galaxy it orbits about the centre of the Milky Way.

    5) Water Cycle
    I agree with you that it was not advanced knowledge to know about the water cycle, there are more verses on it than the ones you quoted. However the fact remains that it is not scientifically incorrect either, there is no contradiction with the laws of nature.

    However to give a small taste of the mathematical composition of the Quran I would like to mention that the word "sea" (bahr in Arabic) is used 32 times in the Quran and the word "land" (barr or yabas in Arabic) is used 13 times in the Quran. Therefore the ratio of the usage of these words land:sea rounds to 29:71 which is the actual ratio of land:sea on Earth. There are many more small elements of the mathematical structure of the Quran.

    6) Plant sexes:
    This is mentioned in the Quran in verses 20:53 and 13:3. I agree it could have been common knowledge at that time, but again there is no contradiction with the laws of nature in the Quran.

    7) Barrier between seas:
    The verses which mention this are 55:19-20 and 25:53.

    [55:19] He merges the two seas where they meet.
    [55:20] A barrier is placed between them, which they do not cross.

    [27:61] The One who made the earth a habitat, and He made in it rivers and He made for it stabilizers, and He made between the two seas a barrier. Is there a god with God? No. But most of them do not know.

    The oceanographer, J. Cousteau, gives the following account as a result of his studies in water barriers: “We studied the assertions by certain researchers about barriers separating seas, and noticed that the Mediterranean Sea had its own salinity and density and housed autochthonous fauna and flora. Then we examined the water of the Atlantic Ocean and discovered features entirely different from those of the Mediterranean Sea. According to our expectations, these two seas that merged in the strait of Gibraltar should present similar characteristics in terms of salinity, density and other properties. The two seas presented different features even though they were adjacent. This greatly puzzled us. An incredible barrier prevented the two seas from coming together. The same sort of a barrier had also been observed in Bab Al-Mandab in the Gulf of Aden connecting with the Red Sea. Subsequent to our observations, further researchers made it clear that the seas which had different characteristics had some barriers.”

    This comment was made with regard to the point at which two seas meet. The Quran also talks about fresh and salty water meeting:

    [25:53] He is the One who merges the two bodies of water. This is fresh and palatable and this is salty and bitter. He made between them a partition and an inviolable barrier

    Modern science has discovered that in estuaries, where fresh and salt water meet, the situation is somewhat different from that found in places where two salt water seas meet. It has been discovered that what distinguishes fresh water from salt water in estuaries is a “pycnocline zone with a marked density discontinuity separating the two layers.” This partition (zone of separation) has a salinity different from both the fresh water and the salt water.

    This "barrier" is also understood by some commentators on the Quran as Evapouration. However I find the former understanding more suited to this verse.

    8) Iron in the Quran:
    Iron is mentioned in the Quran in the following verse:

    [57:25] We have sent Our messengers with clear proofs, and We sent down with them the book and the balance, that the people may uphold justice. We sent down the iron, wherein there is great strength, and many benefits for the people. So that God would distinguish those who would support Him and His messengers on acknowledgement. God is Powerful, Noble.

    The phrase "We sent down" (wa-anzalna) is used many times in the Quran to describe an astronomical event. Modern Science tells us that the Iron in the core of the Earth resulted from an atronomical collision. Therefore this phrase can be interpreted as a description of this event.

    It is also noteworthy that Chapter 57 titled Al-Hadyd (The Iron) is the chapter right in the middle of the Quran which can signify the iron in the core of the Earth. 57 is also the atomic mass of an isotope of Iron. The verse 57:25 is the 26th verse of that chapter (as there is an unnumbered 'Bismillah' verse at the start of the chapter) and it is the only verse in the chapter that mentions "Iron" and its physical properties - 26 is the proton number of Iron. It is also noteworthy that the word "God" or "Allah" occurs for the 26th time in the chapter in the 26th verse of the Chapter.

    There are many more scientific statements in the Quran. However the numerical symmetry of some words in the Quran are less heard of. This symmetry forms a small element of the Quran's numerical structure based on the prime number 19 (more details at www.19.org).

    The word "day" occurs in the Quran 365 times
    The word "month" occurs 12 times.

    More of these can be seen at http://www.submission.org/miracle/endless.html

    I hope this was informative.
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    (Original post by Rananagirl)
    I'm going to be annoying and diverge...

    What is this "Truth" you speak of?

    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense."
    - Buddha


    (This is my cop-out way of saying believe what the heck you want and leave others to it.)
    Buddhism is now the only religion I respect
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    (Original post by Srxjer)
    Any of the 'scientific' claims in the Qur'an were discovered a thousand years before it was even written. A time when scientific knowledge wasn't squandered by impiety.
    Some, NOT all scientific statements in the Qur'an may or may not have been discovered or hypothesised by men a thousand years prior to its revelation as you claim. This knowledge, however, was not made available to the Prophet Muhammad who was illiterate and for the most part a shepard in the middle of the Arabian peninsula prior to his Prophethood. The Arabs of his time knew nothing of science either, believing, for example, that the Heavens or the Universe were supported by two enormous mountains on either end of the Earth. This ancient knowledge of the Greeks would have only come into the hands of the Arabs centuries after Prophets death when the Qur'an had been complete and Islam had spread beyond Arabia.
    The Qur'an has more than a thousand scientific statements which have all been proven to be true.

    Many scientists who are globally respected in their fields have acknowledged that the scientific statements in the Qur'an agree with modern day findings. The detailed reference to embryonic development in the Qur'an, for example, is without a doubt a scientifc miracle, as this knowledge was simply unavailable 1,400 years. Keith Moore, professor emeritus in the division of anatomy (department of surgery), former Chair of anatomy from 1974 to 1984 and associate dean for Basic Medical Sciences (Faculty of Medicine) at the University of Toronto, Ontario, Canada, who is most known for his textbooks on the subjects of anatomy and human embryology asserts this claim, though whether or not he became a Muslim I dont know.

    Here is a short clip on what some leading scientists have said on the scientific statements in the Quran (bearing in mind that these are not laymen, but men with deep insight and knowledge in their respected fields):
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUUPYs0gElU


    As I mentioned in an earlier post, Muslims claim that the Qur'an is primarily a literary and linguistic miracle in the Arabic language and not a scientific one. The scientific statements in the Qur'an only add to the evidence which supports their claim of the Qur'ans Divine origin.

    This 30 min video is a lecture given at Oxford on the literary and linguistic miracle of the Qur'an.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irIS9osq6pI
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    In reply to;
    (Original post by rrea436)
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    (Original post by Srxjer)
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    ok so ur trying to tell me that some orphan in the deserts of Arabia in 6 AD who couldnt read nor write was able to get in touch with a greek philosepher that live well before he did? Or are you trying to say that out of the thousands of Greek hypotheses made by countless Philosophers throughout the ages this guy knew exactly which ones would be later proven to be true after some how managing to find all these hypotheses, within in the 15 years of his Prophethood?

    Theres not much more i think i need to say because these guys have done so quite well;
    (Original post by Katana)
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    (Original post by enlightened)
    ...
    but if ur stil not convinced then do care to explain the following...

    Spoiler:
    Show
    In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful
    Some scientific verses in the Quran:
    INTRODUCTION

    Ever since the dawn of human life on this planet, Man has always sought to understand Nature, his own place in the scheme of Creation and the purpose of Life itself. In this quest for Truth, spanning many centuries and diverse civilizations, organized religion has shaped human life and determined to a large extent, the course of history. While some religions have been based on books, claimed by their adherents to be divinely inspired, others have relied solely on human experience.

    Al-Qur’aan, the main source of the Islamic faith, is a book believed by Muslims, to be of completely Divine origin. Muslims also believe that it contains guidance for all mankind. Since the message of the Qur’aan is believed to be for all times, it should be relevant to every age. Does the Qur’aan pass this test? In this booklet, I intend to give an objective analysis of the Muslim belief regarding the Divine origin of the Qur’aan, in the light of established scientific discoveries.

    There was a time, in the history of world civilization, when ‘miracles’, or what was perceived to be a miracle, took precedence over human reason and logic. But how do we define the term ‘miracle’? A miracle is anything that takes place out of the normal course of life and for which humankind has no explanation. However, we must be careful before we accept something as a miracle. An article in ‘The Times of India’ Mumbai, in 1993 reported that ‘a saint’ by the name ‘Baba Pilot’ claimed to have stayed continuously submerged under water in a tank for three consecutive days and nights. However, when reporters wanted to examine the base of the tank of water where he claimed to have performed this ‘miraculous’ feat, he refused to let them do so. He argued by asking as to how one could examine the womb of a mother that gives birth to a child. The ‘Baba’ was hiding something. It was a gimmick simply to gain publicity. Surely, no modern man with even the slightest inkling towards rational thinking would accept such a ‘miracle’. If such false miracles are the tests of divinity, then we would have to accept Mr. P. C. Sorcar, the world famous magician known for his ingenious magical tricks and illusions, as the best God-man.

    A book, claiming Divine origin, is in effect, claiming to be a miracle. Such a claim should be easily verifiable in any age, according to the standards of that age. Muslims believe, that the Qur’aan is the last and final revelation of God, the miracle of miracles revealed as a mercy to mankind. Let us therefore investigate the veracity of this belief.

    I would like to thank Brother Musaddique Thange for his editorial assistance. May Allah (swt) reward him for his efforts, Aameen

    THE CHALLENGE OF THE QUR’AAN

    Literature and poetry have been instruments of human expression and creativity, in all cultures. The world also witnessed an age when literature and poetry occupied pride of position, similar to that now enjoyed by science and technology.

    Muslims as well as non-Muslims agree that Al-Qur’aan is Arabic literature par excellence - that it is the best Arabic literature on the face of the earth. The Qur’aan, challenges mankind in the following verses:

    "And if ye are in doubt As to what We have revealed From time to time to Our Servant, then produce a Soorah Like thereunto; And call your witnesses or helpers (If there are any) besides Allah, If your (doubts) are true. But if ye cannot –And of a surety you cannot. Then fear the Fire Whose fuel is Men and Stones – Which is prepared for those Who reject Faith." [Al-Qur’aan 2:23-24] [Al-Qur’an 2:23-24 indicates Soorah or Chapter No. 2 and Ayaat or Verses 23 and 24]

    The same notation is followed throughout the book. References and translation of the Qur’aan are from the translation of the Qur’aan by Abdullah Yusuf Ali, new revised edition, 1989, published by Amana Corporation, Maryland, USA.

    The challenge of the Qur’aan, is to produce a single Soorah (chapter) like the Soorahs it contains. The same challenge is repeated in the Qur’aan several times. The challenge to produce a Soorah, which, in beauty, eloquence, depth and meaning is at least somewhat similar to a Qur’aanic Soorah remains unmet to this day. A modern rational man, however, would never accept a religious scripture, which says, in the best possible poetic language, that the world is flat. This is because we live in an age, where human reason, logic and science are given primacy. Not many would accept the Qur’aan’s extraordinarily beautiful language, as proof of its Divine origin. Any scripture claiming to be a divine revelation must also be acceptable on the strength of its own reason and logic.

    According to the famous physicist and Nobel Prize winner, Albert Einstein, "Science without religion is lame. Religion without science is blind." Let us therefore study the Qur’aan, and analyze whether The Qur’aan and Modern Science are compatible or incompatible?

    The Qur’aan is not a book of science but a book of ‘signs’, i.e. ayats. There are more than six thousand ‘signs’ in the Qur’aan of which more than a thousand deal with science. We all know that many a times Science takes a ‘U-turn’. In this book I have considered only established scientific facts and not mere hypotheses and theories that are based on assumptions and are not backed by proof.

    I. ASTRONOMY

    CREATION OF THE UNIVERSE: ‘THE BIG BANG’

    The creation of the universe is explained by astrophysicists in a widely accepted phenomenon, popularly known as the ‘Big Bang’. It is supported by observational and experimental data gathered by astronomers and astrophysicists for decades. According to the ‘Big Bang’, the whole universe was initially one big mass (Primary Nebula). Then there was a ‘Big Bang’ (Secondary Separation) which resulted in the formation of Galaxies. These then divided to form stars, planets, the sun, the moon, etc. The origin of the universe was unique and the probability of it occurring by ‘chance’ is zero. The Qur’aan contains the following verse, regarding the origin of the universe: "Do not the Unbelievers see That the heavens and the earth Were joined together (as one Unit of Creation), before We clove them asunder?" [Al-Qur’aan 21:30]

    The striking congruence between the Qur’aanic verse and the ‘Big Bang’ is inescapable! How could a book, which first appeared in the deserts of Arabia 1400 years ago, contain this profound scientific truth?

    THERE WAS AN INITIAL GASEOUS MASS BEFORE THE CREATION OF GALAXIES

    Scientists say that before the galaxies in the universe were formed, celestial matter was initially in the form of gaseous matter. In short, huge gaseous matter or clouds were present before the formation of the galaxies. To describe initial celestial matter, the word ‘smoke’ is more appropriate than gas. The following Qur’aanic verse refers to this state of the universe by the word dhukhan which means smoke.

    "Moreover, He Comprehended In His design the sky, And it had been (as) smoke: He said to it And to the earth: ‘Come ye together, Willingly or unwillingly.’ They said: ‘We do come (Together), in willing obedience.’" [Al-Qur’aan 41:11]

    Again, this fact is a corollary to the ‘Big Bang’ and was not known to the Arabs during the time of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). What then, could have been the source of this knowledge?

    THE SPHERICAL SHAPE OF THE EARTH

    In early times, people believed that the earth is flat. For centuries, men were afraid to venture out too far, lest they should fall off the edge. Sir Francis Drake was the first person who proved that the earth is spherical when he sailed around it in 1597. Consider the following Qur’aanic verse regarding the alternation of day and night: "Seest thou not that Allah merges Night into Day And He merges Day into Night?" [Al-Qur’aan 31:29]

    Merging here means that the night slowly and gradually changes to day and vice versa. This phenomenon can only take place if the earth is spherical. If the earth was flat, there would have been a sudden change from night to day and from day to night.

    The following verse also alludes to the spherical shape of the earth: "He created the heavens And the earth In true (proportions): He makes the Night Overlap the Day, and the Day Overlap the Night." [Al-Qur’aan 39:5]

    The Arabic word used here is Kawwara meaning ‘to overlap’ or ‘to coil’– the way a turban is wound around the head. The overlapping or coiling of the day and night can only take place if the earth is spherical.

    The earth is not exactly round like a ball, but geo-spherical i.e. it is flattened at the poles. The following verse contains a description of the earth’s shape:

    "And the earth, moreover, Hath He made egg shaped." [Al-Qur’aan 79:30] [The Arabic word dahaha has been translated by A. Yusuf Ali as "vast expanse", which also is correct. The word dahaha also means an ostrich-egg.]

    The Arabic word for egg here is dahaha, which means an ostrich-egg. The shape of an ostrich-egg resembles the geo-spherical shape of the earth. Thus the Qur’aan correctly describes the shape of the earth, though the prevalent notion when the Qur’aan was revealed was that the earth is flat.

    THE LIGHT OF THE MOON IS REFLECTED LIGHT

    It was believed by earlier civilizations that the moon emanates its own light. Science now tells us that the light of the moon is reflected light. However this fact was mentioned in the Qur’aan 1,400 years ago in the following verse:

    "Blessed is He Who made Constellations in the skies, And placed therein a Lamp And a Moon giving light." [Al-Qur’aan 25:61]

    The Arabic word for the sun in the Qur’aan, is shams. It is referred to as siraaj, which means a ‘torch’ or as wahhaaj which means ‘a blazing lamp’ or as diya which means ‘shining glory’. All three descriptions are appropriate to the sun, since it generates intense heat and light by its internal combustion. The Arabic word for the moon is qamar and it is described in the Qur’aan as muneer, which is a body that gives nur i.e. light. Again, the Qur’aanic description matches perfectly with the true nature of the moon, which does not give off light itself and is an inert body that reflects the light of the sun. Not once in the Qur’aan, is the moon mentioned as siraaj, wahhaaj or diya or the sun as nur or muneer. This implies that the Qur’aan recognizes the difference between the nature of sunlight and moonlight.

    Consider the following verses related to the nature of light from the sun and the moon: "It is He who made the sun To be a shining glory And the moon to be a light (Of beauty)." [Al-Qur’aan 10:5]

    "See ye not How Allah has created The seven heavens One above another, "And made the moon A light in their midst, and made the sun As a (Glorious) Lamp?" [Al-Qur’aan 71:15-16]

    THE SUN ROTATES

    For a long time European philosophers and scientists believed that the earth stood still in the center of the universe and every other body including the sun moved around it. In the West, this geocentric concept of the universe was prevalent right from the time of Ptolemy in the second century B.C. In 1512, Nicholas Copernicus put forward his Heliocentric Theory of Planetary Motion, which asserted that the sun is motionless at the centre of the solar system with the planets revolving around it.

    In 1609, the German scientist Yohannus Keppler published the ‘Astronomia Nova’. In this he concluded that not only do the planets move in elliptical orbits around the sun, they also rotate upon their axes at irregular speeds. With this knowledge it became possible for European scientists to explain correctly many of the mechanisms of the solar system including the sequence of night and day.

    After these discoveries, it was thought that the Sun was stationary and did not rotate about its axis like the Earth. I remember having studied this fallacy from Geography books during my school days. Consider the following Qur’aanic verse: "It is He Who created The Night and the Day, And the sun and the moon: All (the celestial bodies) Swim along, each in its Rounded course." [Al-Qur’aan 21:33]

    The Arabic word used in the above verse is yasbahûn . The word yasbahûn is derived from the word sabaha. It carries with it the idea of motion that comes from any moving body. If you use the word for a man on the ground, it would not mean that he is rolling but would mean he is walking or running. If you use the word for a man in water it would not mean that he is floating but would mean that he is swimming.

    Similarly, if you use the word yasbah for a celestial body such as the sun it would not mean that it is only flying through space but would mean that it is also rotating as it goes through space. Most of the school textbooks have incorporated the fact that the sun rotates about its axis. The rotation of the sun about its own axis can be proved with the help of an equipment that projects the image of the sun on the table top so that one can examine the image of the sun without being blinded. It is noticed that the sun has spots which complete a circular motion once every 25 days i.e. the sun takes approximately 25 days to rotate around its axis.

    In fact, the sun travels through space at roughly 150 miles per second, and takes about 200 million years to complete one revolution around the center of our Milky Way Galaxy.

    "It is not permitted To the Sun to catch up The Moon, nor can The Night outstrip the Day: Each (just) swims along In (its own) orbit (According to Law)." [Al-Qur’aan 36:40]

    This verse mentions an essential fact discovered by modern astronomy, i.e. the existence of the individual orbits of the Sun and the Moon, and their journey through space with their own motion. The ‘fixed place’ towards, which the sun travels, carrying with it the solar system, has been located exactly by modern astronomy. It has been given a name, the Solar Apex. The solar system is indeed moving in space towards a point situated in the constellation of Hercules (alpha Layer) whose exact location is firmly established.

    The moon rotates around its axis in the same duration that it takes to revolve around the earth. It takes approximately 29½ days to complete one rotation. One cannot help but be amazed at the scientific accuracy of the Qur’aanic verses. Should we not ponder over the question: "What was the source of knowledge contained in the Qur’aan?"

    THE SUN WILL EXTINGUISH AFTER A CERTAIN PERIOD

    The light of the sun is due to a chemical process on its surface that has been taking place continuously for the past five billion years. It will come to an end at some point of time in the future when the sun will be totally extinguished leading to extinction of all life on earth. Regarding the impermanence of the sun’s existence the Qur’aan says: "And the Sun Runs its course For a period determined For it; that is The decree of (Him) The exalted in Might, The All-Knowing." [Al-Qur’aan 36:38] [A similar message is conveyed in the Qur’an in 13:2, 35:13, 39:5 and 39:21]

    The Arabic word used here is mustaqarr, which means a place or time that is determined. Thus the Qur’aan says that the sun runs towards a determined place, and will do so only up to a pre-determined period of time – meaning that it will end or extinguish.

    THE PRESENCE OF INTERSTELLAR MATTER

    Space outside organized astronomical systems was earlier assumed to be a vacuum . Astrophysicists later discovered the presence of bridges of matter in this interstellar space. These bridges of matter are called plasma, and consist of completely ionized gas containing equal number of free electrons and positive ions. Plasma is sometimes called the fourth state of matter (besides the three known states viz. solid, liquid and gas). The Qur’aan mentions the presence of this interstellar material in the following verse: "He Who created the heavens And the earth and all That is between." [Al-Qur’aan 25:59]

    It would be ridiculous, for anybody to even suggest that the presence of interstellar galactic material was known 1400 years ago.

    THE EXPANDING UNIVERSE

    In 1925, an American astronomer by the name of Edwin Hubble, provided observational evidence that all galaxies are receding from one another, which implies that the universe is expanding. The expansion of the universe is now an established scientific fact. This is what Al-Qur’aan says regarding the nature of the universe: "With the power and skill Did We construct The Firmament: For it is We Who create The vastness of Space." [Al-Qur’aan 51:47]

    The Arabic word mûsi‘ûn is correctly translated as ‘expanding it’, and it refers to the creation of the expanding vastness of the universe. Stephen Hawking, in his book, ‘A Brief History of Time’, says, "The discovery that the universe is expanding was one of the great intellectual revolutions of the 20th century."

    The Qur’aan mentioned the expansion of the universe, before man even learnt to build a telescope! Some may say that the presence of astronomical facts in the Qur’aan is not surprising since the Arabs were advanced in the field of astronomy. They are correct in acknowledging the advancement of the Arabs in the field of astronomy. However they fail to realize that the Qur’aan was revealed centuries before the Arabs excelled in astronomy. Moreover many of the scientific facts mentioned above regarding astronomy, such as the origin of the universe with a Big Bang, were not known to the Arabs even at the peak of their scientific advancement. The scientific facts mentioned in the Qur’aan are therefore not due to the Arabs’ advancement in astronomy. Indeed, the reverse is true. The Arabs advanced in astronomy, because astronomy occupies a place in the Qur’aan.

    II. PHYSICS

    THE EXISTENCE OF SUBATOMIC PARTICLES

    In ancient times a well-known theory by the name of ‘Theory of Atomism’ was widely accepted. This theory was originally proposed by the Greeks, in particular by a man called Democritus, who lived about 23 centuries ago. Democritus and the people that came after him, assumed that the smallest unit of matter was the atom. The Arabs used to believe the same. The Arabic word dharrah most commonly meant an atom. In recent times modern science has discovered that it is possible to split even an atom. That the atom can be split further is a development of the 20th century. Fourteen centuries ago this concept would have appeared unusual even to an Arab. For him the dharrah was the limit beyond which one could not go. The following Qur’aanic verse however, refuses to acknowledge this limit: "The Unbelievers say, ‘Never to us will come The Hour’: say, ‘Nay! But most surely, By my Lord, it will come Upon you – by Him Who knows the unseen – From Whom is not hidden The least little atom In the Heavens or on earth: Nor is there anything less Than that, or greater, but Is in the Record Perspicuous.’" [Al-Qur’aan 34:3] [A similar message is conveyed in the Qur’an in 10:61]

    This verse refers to the Omniscience of God, His knowledge of all things, hidden or apparent. It then goes further and says that God is aware of everything, including what is smaller or bigger than the atom. Thus the verse clearly shows that it is possible for something smaller than the atom to exist, a fact discovered only recently by modern science.

    III. GEOGRAPHY

    THE WATER CYCLE

    In 1580, Bernard Palissy was the first man to describe the present day concept of ‘water cycle’. He described how water evaporates from the oceans and cools to form clouds. The clouds move inland where they rise, condense and fall as rain. This water gathers as lakes and streams and flows back to the ocean in a continuous cycle. In the 7th century B.C., Thales of Miletus believed that surface spray of the oceans was picked up by the wind and carried inland to fall as rain. In earlier times people did not know the source of underground water. They thought the water of the oceans, under the effect of winds, was thrust towards the interior of the continents. They also believed that the water returned by a secret passage, or the Great Abyss. This passage is connected to the oceans and has been called the ‘Tartarus’, since Plato’s time. Even Descartes, a great thinker of the eighteenth century, subscribed to this view. Till the nineteenth century, Aristotle’s theory was prevalent. According to this theory, water was condensed in cool mountain caverns and formed underground lakes that fed springs. Today, we know that the rainwater that seeps into the cracks of the ground is responsible for this.

    The water cycle is described by the Qur’aan in the following verses: "Seest thou not that Allah Sends down rain from The sky, and leads it Through springs in the earth? Then He causes to grow, Therewith, produce of various Colours." [Al-Qur’aan 39:21]

    "He sends down rain From the sky And with it gives life to The earth after it is dead: Verily in that are Signs For those who are wise." [Al-Qur’aan 30:24]

    "And We send down water From the sky according to (Due) measure, and We cause it To soak in the soil; And We certainly are able To drain it off (with ease)." [Al-Qur’aan 23:18]

    No other text dating back 1400 years ago gives such an accurate description of the water cycle.

    WINDS IMPREGNATE THE CLOUDS

    "And We send the fecundating winds, Then cause the rain to descend From the sky, therewith providing You with water (in abundance)." [Al-Qur’aan 15:22]

    The Arabic word used here is lawâqih, which is the plural of laqih from laqaha, which means to impregnate or fecundate. In this context, impregnate means that the wind pushes the clouds together increasing the condensation that causes lightning and thus rain. A similar description is found in the Qur’aan: "It is Allah Who sends The Winds, and they raise The Clouds: then does He Spread them in the sky As He wills, and break them Into fragments, until thou seest Raindrops issue from the midst Thereof: then when He has Made them reach such Of His servants as He wills, Behold, they do rejoice!" [Al-Qur’aan 30:48]

    The Qur’aanic descriptions are absolutely accurate and agree perfectly with modern data on hydrology. The water cycle is described in several verses of the Glorious Qur’aan, including 3:9, 7:57, 13:17, 25:48- 49, 36:34, 50:9-11, 56:68-70, 67:30 and 86:11.

    Couldnt fit all of it so for rest go to
    http://www.sunnahonline.com/ilm/quran/0020.htm





    "Verily, those who disbelieve, it is the same to them whether you warn them or do not warn them, they will not believe" [Quran, Al-Baqarah 2:6]

    http://www.quranexplorer.com/quran/
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    Hi, Prophet Muhammad's Prophethood lasted 23 years and not 15.

    Good answer though
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    (Original post by Katanta)
    1) The Big Bang in the Quran:

    You quoted 51:47 and said that the word "universe" is not mentioned. The arabic word "sama" means "Universe". It can be translated as "heaven" put it is not the "heaven" you are thinking of (as in heaven and hell). The word for "heaven" in arabic is "janaat" which is usually translated as "paradise". To confirm this difference within a Quranic context please see 3:133 41:12, 55:37 and 85:1. Also the Arabic phrase "wa'inna lamusi'una" means "We are expanding it". The translations you are using are very old so I don't know why they translated around the idea of an expansion. The most recent translations that use modern english can be found at www.quranix.com

    The correct translation for 51:47 is:
    [51:47] We constructed the universe with might, and We are expanding it.
    I concur :yep:
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    (Original post by Katanta)
    ...
    It seems each different translations have interpreted the Qur'an in different ways, but who decides which is the correct translation and which isn't?

    This whole phenomena started when Maurice Bucaille saw a money-making opportunity and promptly wrote the book "The Quran, the Bible, and Science" in 1976. This 'science in the Qur'an' has now become widespread especially on the internet and is aptly called 'Bucailleism', you can see more about it here:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8A9DEeglXI

    The 'sciences' in the Qur'an haven't been contradicted because A) they're extremely vague and cryptic, and could apply to literally anything -- much like astrology, palm readers and clairvoyants. B) They aren't new science claims, it was either known at the time, or, it's been interpreted centuries later when the main text has undergone translation after translation and interpretation after interpretation over the many years. The mathematical 'miracles' in the Qur'an are most likely crafty translations by theologians and scholars, just like the miracle of Pi in the Bible.

    I should have expanded earlier, the reason why iron was more expensive than gold is precisely because it was known to come from meteorites (again, before the Qur'an was written.)

    The 'science' can't be contradicted, but the morals of the Qur'an sure don't fit with a modern society. Misogyny, sexim, homophobia and barbarous capital punishment have been surely and utterly contradicted.
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    The Qur'an is a not a science book... I think this is where most people are getting confused. It is a miracle, a Revelation, a Call to Humanity. It may contain some scientific miracles, but this consititues a very small part of it. There's so much more to it that just that.
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    (Original post by Srxjer)
    ...
    It seems each different translations have interpreted the Qur'an in different ways, but who decides which is the correct translation and which isn't?
    The Quran itself will clarify what certain words mean by using the same word in another verse. Please could you be specific as to which verse you find has been mistranslated to indicate a scientific miracle? I will then direct you to some verses that use the same words to clarify the meaning.

    The 'sciences' in the Qur'an haven't been contradicted because A) they're extremely vague and cryptic, and could apply to literally anything -- much like astrology, palm readers and clairvoyants.
    Could you be specific to which "vague" verse(s) you are referring to? You can just refer to each scientific claim by the number I assigned to them in my previous post.

    They aren't new science claims, it was either known at the time.
    It may have been known to the Greeks or other civilizations as you say but many of the scientific knowledge was not available to the Arabs. This can be verified by checking the numerous scientific contradictions with the Quran in Hadith literature written by Arab men - these were written centuries after the Quran and yet they still contain scientific contradictions. Therefore this common knowledge could not have been common to the Arabs.

    it's been interpreted centuries later when the main text has undergone translation after translation and interpretation after interpretation over the many years
    The number of translations of the Quran is irrelevant because the original Arabic text is still intact. With regard to different interpretations over time, yes old commentaries on the Quran interpret some of these scientific verses differently. For example the Quran says that the Earth is egg shaped (79:30), yet old commentators of the Quran could not comprehend this and obscured the meaning of the Arabic word "dahaha" as "he spread the Earth (like an egg's nest)" instead of "egg shaped" - this is the correct, literal, translation as "dahaha" comes from the root word "dahy" which means "egg". Therefore when one ignores the comments of previous generations and simply looks at the Arabic of the Quran the correct and most simple translation is clear. The Quran itself claims that its verses are clear so that people may understand (24:1).

    The mathematical 'miracles' in the Qur'an are most likely crafty translations by theologians and scholars, just like the miracle of Pi in the Bible.
    Crafty translations? Translations have nothing to do with the mathematical structure of the Quran as the Arabic words and letters are being counted.

    The 'science' can't be contradicted, but the morals of the Qur'an sure don't fit with a modern society. Misogyny, sexim, homophobia and barbarous capital punishment have been surely and utterly contradicted.
    You have made such a big claim about the Quran. I can understand where you may have got this from as many people assume that current Sharia Laws and (un)Islamic customs are based on the Quran. All of the terrible values you mentioned (that I put in bold) are not in the Quran - they are the invention of Arab men trying to cover the system of peace and progression (islam) with their barbaric values.

    To answer all your claims about the Quran I would like to recommend you read the "Manifesto for Islamic Reform" by Edip Yuksel here http://islamicreform.org/index.php?o...d=45&Itemid=53

    If you do not want to read such a lengthy article, then please find any verses of the Quran which advocate these values (in bold) and I will do my best to answer them.
 
 
 
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