Nürburgring Watch

Texan88
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#1
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Hey everyone,

Who all here has been to or wants to goto the 'ring? If you have share your experience, if you just wanna go why do you?


I have always dreamed about going to the 'ring ever since I first got into formula 1 and saw some of the old coverage of it. After I got forza 1 I was completely hooked and had to go. I'm hoping to do some time in england here in a couple years and I would be an idiot not to talk advantage of all the tracks within a 500mi radius So I guess this isn't just about my obsession with the 'ring but about anyone that has an obsession with a certain track.


Btw I did some math a trip to the ring during a break would be about $2k :eek3:
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Carl
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I've been down there, I went with two friends while on a tour of Germany. In the end we didn't do the lap because we had a car packed full of camping gear. The plan was to camp nearby, and then do the lap with an empty car, but there was nothing near the track to do except for the track itself, and camping was very expensive, so we didn't bother. We wandered the paddock and saw some cars go past on the track, as well as visiting the F1 circuit too, but then we pressed on down to Stuttgart. We definitely want to go again to do a few laps, hopefully it'll be in something more interesting than my mate's Astra.
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Sync
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I'd love to take my car round. But, in 99.9% of cases, your insurance won't cover you on the 'ring. That means that if you hit anyone, you'll have to fork out for the repairs. Worse, if you seriously injure somebody, then chances are they'll sue you for everything you have...and win. Only way to do it without the massive risk is to hire a car from one of the specialist 'ring firms and take that around. When I save up enough cash, that's exactly what I'll be doing!
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warrenpenalver
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theres plenty of insurers that will do cover for the nurburgring but like all trackday cover its expensive.
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Sync
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(Original post by warrenpenalver)
theres plenty of insurers that will do cover for the nurburgring but like all trackday cover its expensive.
Remember, on Touristenfahrten days (which is what's being discussed here) the Nurburgring won't be considered a track day. Unless it's on private hire, it's not a track day. Catch 22 - regular UK insurers class it as a race track or exclude it entirely, and specialist insurers aren't interested in Touristenfahrten days.

I couldn't find anyone who'd cover me at the 'ring for full third party liability (i.e. car, personal injury, track closure cost, damage to armco, etc). You know of anybody who would?

It seems most people from the UK who are driving the 'ring are doing so uninsured. Probably not a problem, as things hopefully won't go wrong. But, what if your car dumps its oil and a biker hits it? The settlement costs would bankrupt most people...
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Johnthebaptist1
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(Original post by Sync)
I couldn't find anyone who'd cover me at the 'ring for full third party liability (i.e. car, personal injury, track closure cost, damage to armco, etc). You know of anybody who would?

It seems most people from the UK who are driving the 'ring are doing so uninsured. Probably not a problem, as things hopefully won't go wrong. But, what if your car dumps its oil and a biker hits it? The settlement costs would bankrupt most people...
Might sound like a daft question but...

how they gonna sue you?

You will have no assets in germany.

If they sue you in the UK, it will be outside of the court's remit? no?

I could be wrong of course.
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Texan88
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Isn't it basically a toll road? So it's like driving on the road? Talking about the Nordschleife not the f1 track. Either way I'm not too bothered my insurance covers it either way...
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Sync
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(Original post by Johnthebaptist1)
Might sound like a daft question but...

how they gonna sue you?

You will have no assets in germany.

If they sue you in the UK, it will be outside of the court's remit? no?

I could be wrong of course.
Doesn't work like that, I'm afraid. Where the assets are is irrelevant. Otherwise people living in the UK would stick their assets in Swiss banks, just to prevent them from being sued.

Technically, a UK insurer can't completely exclude the Nurburgring from its cover. The RTA here in the UK, means that it is illegal for them to exclude minimum level cover anywhere in an EU member state in a place where insurance is mandatory (as it is on the 'ring). German courts have also confirmed the UK insurers have to fulfil this obligation.

But...

The insurance policies also include a clause to the effect that, if the insurer is obligated to meet a claim it otherwise would not pay for, then the insurer is entitled to re-claim the settlement from the policy holder. In other words, they will pay out to the third party. Then they'll pursue you for the money when you're back in the UK...and you will lose. You'd have to sell any assets you owned in order to pay back your insurers. Stupid and unfair perhaps, but the reality nonetheless.

(Original post by Texan88)
Isn't it basically a toll road? So it's like driving on the road? Talking about the Nordschleife not the f1 track. Either way I'm not too bothered my insurance covers it either way...
To an extent, yes. But, 99.9% of UK insurance policies specifically exclude it. The fact is that this exclusion doesn't actually hold any legal weight from a third party point of view, for the reasons I mentioned above. So, they would have to pay. But, the only reason they 'exclude' it in their policy wording, is so that they can claim it falls under their "obligated to meet a claim it otherwise would not pay for, then the insurer is entitled to re-claim the settlement from the policy holder" clause. This then means they can pursue you for the settlement costs in its entirety. Their team of £1000 an hour QCs will win the case and you'll be liable for every penny.
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Texan88
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(Original post by Sync)

To an extent, yes. But, 99.9% of UK insurance policies specifically exclude it. Even the optional track day insurances tend to have a number of potentially expensive exclusions (third party injury being one). Assuming your UK policy didn't specifically exclude it, I wouldn't fancy fighting the insurance company's team of £1000 an hour QCs with my defence being "it's a toll road".

Covers me on Texas motor speedway, all the local drags, prettymuch any race track. I think it will cover a toll road
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Sync
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(Original post by Texan88)
Covers me on Texas motor speedway, all the local drags, prettymuch any race track. I think it will cover a toll road
I suspect your US insurance won't have the same exclusions as our UK insurance. You're probably good to go and are fully covered. However, 99% of people with UK based insurance won't be so lucky!
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Texan88
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(Original post by Sync)
I suspect your US insurance won't have the same exclusions as our UK insurance. You're probably good to go and are fully covered. However, 99% of people with UK based insurance won't be so lucky!
Kinda sucks to hear that, though I hear alot of UK insurance is very strict. Just got off the phone planning the whole trip with my brother. Gonna buy a couple Go Pro hero HD cameras for the trip and record it all. Myself and him have dreamed about this for years so it only makes sense to do it as a team. Plus spending that much money to go it alone kinda suck, he's been my driving mentor since I was 13 so havin him there to help me on one of the craziest tracks in the world will be a huge help.


I have a feeling I'll be coming back with twice my wardrobe in nurburgring apparel :yep:
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Carl
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^You better have a lot of money to spend because anything with a Nurburgring logo is hideously expensive. Even a simple Nurburgring sticker for your car was 7€.
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AeroMad
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If my memory serves me well, ADAC (German equivilent to RAC) were offering some sort of insurance policy for people who wanted to drive round the Nurburgring...
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Sync
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(Original post by Carl)
^You better have a lot of money to spend because anything with a Nurburgring logo is hideously expensive. Even a simple Nurburgring sticker for your car was 7€.
I suppose they know that nobody will take their car around and then not buy it a sticker. It's the one thing they can guarantee selling even if it is stupidly overpriced.

I wouldn't get any t-shirts...but the Nordschleife sticker is a must!
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Texan88
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(Original post by Carl)
^You better have a lot of money to spend because anything with a Nurburgring logo is hideously expensive. Even a simple Nurburgring sticker for your car was 7€.
I know I'm gonna end up with like 20 of those stickers lol, bunch of my buddies are givin me some cash to pick them up some. But the hoodies and such I don't think I could pass up, such is my obsession.
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richard-
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I went around the nurburgring last year and stayed in nurburg for about 4 days. It is tummy turning experience, especially when you have my mate with a track car driving a couple of inches behind motorbikes. But he had done a few thousand laps around the nurberg. One thing, you really do see everything driving around, police cars, old mini's, campvans ..

It is expensive, paying for the laps seperate, so it is much cheaper using a swipe key paid for a year I think.. but if you just want a couple of laps then its a little pointless with the key.

I have a nurburgring t-shirt, just had to buy one

Few pictures:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/8021242...7620810245049/
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Riderz
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Just to point out that everyone who does a TD - inc the 'ring, does so at their own risk. So if say a biker comes off and another biker hits him, neither can sue each other. When buying TD insurance you can get personal accident cover included, which would pay out in this circumstance, but each party would have to claim off their own policies for their own injuries.
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Sync
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(Original post by Riderz)
Just to point out that everyone who does a TD - inc the 'ring, does so at their own risk. So if say a biker comes off and another biker hits him, neither can sue each other.
TD rules only apply if the 'ring is on a private hire. Assuming it's a Touristenfahrten day as is the norm, then German road law applies and the 'at your own risk' proviso is null. You cause the accident and they can sue the pants off you.
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Texan88
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Even if you're going slow in the left side they can as well german law applies if you're slow stick right, if not and someone rear ends you you are responsible for their car any repairs to the track and the down time to the track which is about 1075 euro's per hour its shut down
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khalaf
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I'd love to go there, hopefully the ring & the autobahn will be the first places i'll go when i have my own cash..
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