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Kill, Negotiate with or Buy off the Taliban...so many options Watch

  • View Poll Results: What is going to happen?
    Extermination
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    49.02%
    Negotiation
    19
    37.25%
    Bribery
    7
    13.73%

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    (Original post by Diaz89)
    That's fine I guess the status quo shall remain. Just remember however 10 years have gone past and now the West is begging the Taliban to stop fighting them....
    Begging? What kind of world do you live in? I don't see any evidence for this statement at all. Like it says in my sig - you're one of those people with emotional needs to be satisfied. Which is why you're inventing a mystical victory for the Taliban.

    It's quite a new one to me. The Taliban have won because they're dead or living in caves.

    Your attitude reminds me of Arab culture. Where they celebrate wars against Israel, even though every single one of those wars was a devastating defeat of a massive alliance against a tiny country. Why are these wars celebrated? Because the Arabs have a desperate emotional need to believe they're right, their "Allah" looks after them and Muslims don't get defeated. :rolleyes:

    Wake up and smell the coffee. More people die in the UK from tripping over then are dying in Afghanistan.
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    (Original post by Moe Lester)
    Quite, but the strength of the Taliban comes, at least partly you must concede, from Western support during the Russian Afghan campaign.
    Of course I agree. It was a massive mistake to help them. My government and other western ones make mistakes all the time.

    I'm sure Russians will feel the same way about Iran in 20 years time when they have nuclear weapons and suddenly take a strong interest in the Caucasian mountains.
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    (Original post by RyanT)
    Begging? What kind of world do you live in? I don't see any evidence for this statement at all. Like it says in my sig - you're one of those people with emotional needs to be satisfied. Which is why you're inventing a mystical victory for the Taliban.
    Mystical victory? I'm merely reciprocating what the army generals are saying, you cannot defeat the Taliban it's simple as that, all the might of Western armies have failed to crush them not only that, they're making unprecedented gains on the field. They've penetrated every section of the Afghan security apparatus. They're audacious enough to reject all attempts for a ceasefire and come to the negotiation table and this a I remind you is coming from a bunch of rag tag peasants with rusted Kalashnikovs.

    It's quite a new one to me. The Taliban have won because they're dead or living in caves.
    And that statement makes sense how exactly?

    Your attitude reminds me of Arab culture. Where they celebrate wars against Israel, even though every single one of those wars was a devastating defeat of a massive alliance against a tiny country. Why are these wars celebrated? Because the Arabs have a desperate emotional need to believe they're right, their "Allah" looks after them and Muslims don't get defeated. :rolleyes:
    Again any of this is of no relevance. You let your ignorant ego cloud reality and now you're trying to evade the argument with the above
    babble.

    Wake up and smell the coffee. More people die in the UK from tripping over then are dying in Afghanistan.
    That's good.
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    (Original post by Clens)
    Iran also needs to be dealt with, who do you think supplies the resistance in both Iraq and Afghan, as well as Al-Qaeda?
    Iran supplying Al-Qaeda? :lolwut:
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    You really think that the taliban are up for negotiaiton?
    For some reason, i don't think they are up for a bit of a chat and some negotiation.
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    (Original post by Diaz89)
    Mystical victory? I'm merely reciprocating what the army generals are saying, you cannot defeat the Taliban it's simple as that
    The real issue is that these generals do not understand what constitutes victory. This is as close as a victory is possible in such culturally opposed nations. I don't think anyone ever said that the French resistance won a victory against the Germans. Yes they were there - yes they were a PITA. They didn't defeat Germany however.

    I think you suffer from this same disease. Measuring success on the conflicts of today with the metrics of yesteryear.
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    (Original post by RyanT)
    The real issue is that these generals do not understand what constitutes victory.
    :facepalm2:

    /debate
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    (Original post by EffieFlowers)
    You really think that the taliban are up for negotiaiton?
    For some reason, i don't think they are up for a bit of a chat and some negotiation.
    They're like a snake. The head isn't up for negotiation but if you cut it off you can negotiate with the farmers that fight for them. The "Taliban" is a weird narcotics big business buying mercenaries and putting out cultural propaganda. You can talk to the mercenaries, especially after you assassinate their religious leadership.

    Part of the problem is we're being too nice. We could easily wipe out the Taliban if we disregarded Geneva. To fight in Afghanistan within the confines of Geneva - you really need a big army.
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    (Original post by RyanT)
    Of course I agree. It was a massive mistake to help them. My government and other western ones make mistakes all the time.

    I'm sure Russians will feel the same way about Iran in 20 years time when they have nuclear weapons and suddenly take a strong interest in the Caucasian mountains.
    As soon as the Iranians look funny at those mountains, they'll be erased with EU support I'm sure.
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    (Original post by Sakujo)
    Iran supplying Al-Qaeda? :lolwut:

    It's no secret that both Iran and Russia, to a lesser extent, supply the Taliban and Iraqi insurgents. It would not surprise me in the slightest if they were supplying Al-Qaeda... The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
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    (Original post by Clens)
    It's no secret that both Iran and Russia, to a lesser extent, supply the Taliban and Iraqi insurgents. It would not surprise me in the slightest if they were supplying Al-Qaeda... The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
    Any proof or just Russo-phobia?

    If they use AKs, then they must have bought them from the Russian government? :eek:
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    (Original post by Clens)
    It's no secret that both Iran and Russia, to a lesser extent, supply the Taliban and Iraqi insurgents. It would not surprise me in the slightest if they were supplying Al-Qaeda... The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
    Woah, back up for a second.

    I have seen nothing to suggest that Russia has supplied anything in Iraq. Also, Russia is working with ISAF/NATO to limit the Taliban in order to avoid them destablising the Caucasus and Muslim majority reigons in Russia.

    Iran has supplied it's supporters in Iraq with weapons as Iran considers Iraq as its sphere of influence. They've been some reports claiming Iran is supplying the Taliban but even these concede it is very small scale.

    Now about AQ, are we talking about the same Al- Qaeda? You know the one that's killed Russian civlians and continues to kill hundreds of shias every year? Are you being serious?

    The very fact that you've equated small scale suport for the Taliban as a possible indication for support of AQ shows how little you know about the conflict.
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    negotiate a nuke to their sandpit
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    id say whatever gets our troops home the quickest/safest
    but it does have to be dealt with properly or they will be back in a few years
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    In the current political situation there is no win. its just loose loose and how much we loose depends on lots of things.

    Buying them off will only work for the bottom level people choosing taliban because theyd be killed otherwise!

    Negotiations wont work. We have nothing they want. They wont compromise and we arent prepared to accept thier ideals and more importantly niether will the afghan government.

    So killing them ALL is the only option. Sadly our governments are too weak to do that. They are not prepared to pull out the media and implement the harsh conflict necessary as wed look "morally bad" (and we dont already?? LMAO).

    The only way to do it is total war. 150000 plus troops on the ground in afghan and pakistan, door to door tactics, submit or be killed, heavy weaponry, brutal and harsh. You need the 2 front approach as if you sweep across afghan youll just drive them into pakistan. Therefore youd need 2 fronts driving them into a corner for final destruction. You need to remove the press and keep the politicians out. The press only get in the way and will just upset the public, people seem to have forgetten that war is nasty, bloody and unkind. Imagine in WW2 if wed had TV and the upfront brutality of war was broadcast: support would have wained a bit for sure. So total war will work!

    Sure total war is expensive but cheaper in the long run IMO compared to sustained conflict over the next 100 years. We need to kill the extremist islam movement as much as possible over next 50 years or we are ******. Even the vast majority of moderate muslims hate the extremists!!!
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    (Original post by warrenpenalver)
    The only way to do it is total war. 150000 plus troops on the ground in afghan and pakistan, door to door tactics, submit or be killed, heavy weaponry, brutal and harsh. You need the 2 front approach as if you sweep across afghan youll just drive them into pakistan. Therefore youd need 2 fronts driving them into a corner for final destruction. You need to remove the press and keep the politicians out. The press only get in the way and will just upset the public, people seem to have forgetten that war is nasty, bloody and unkind. Imagine in WW2 if wed had TV and the upfront brutality of war was broadcast: support would have wained a bit for sure. So total war will work!
    Yeah good luck with that.

    (Original post by warrenpenalver)
    Sure total war is expensive but cheaper in the long run IMO compared to sustained conflict over the next 100 years. We need to kill the extremist islam movement as much as possible over next 50 years or we are ******.
    :facepalm2:
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    Well you can't kill them all. They're scattered everywhere. They're like ants..
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    they are mostly based in afghan and pakistan so you can get most of them! the rest can be picked off as we discover thier whereabouts.

    Its breaking the organisation as a whole thats important, not individual terror cells. We are always likely to have problems with extremist terrorists operating on an independant cell based model.

    Longterm it means dealing with the iran problem too!
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    Some Taliban are there soley for financial reasons. If the government was able to develop infrastructure and provide jobs for the Afghans they wouldn't need to buy any one off.
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    (Original post by warrenpenalver)
    they are mostly based in afghan and pakistan so you can get most of them! the rest can be picked off as we discover thier whereabouts.
    Do you realise how big Afghanistan is? Compare with Iraq.



    (Original post by warrenpenalver)
    Its breaking the organisation as a whole thats important, not individual terror cells. We are always likely to have problems with extremist terrorists operating on an independant cell based model.
    Individual cells can rebuild the whole structure given the right conditions.

    (Original post by warrenpenalver)
    Longterm it means dealing with the iran problem too!
    That has nothing to do with the Taliban.
 
 
 
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