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    (Original post by spikeymike)
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    University computers have Windows 7 now. :sogood:
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    (Original post by Ape Gone Insane)
    University computers have Windows 7 now. :sogood:
    :rofl: QMB had W7 ages ago. :p:
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    (Original post by Ape Gone Insane)
    University computers have Windows 7 now. :sogood:
    I'm not back yet but we were still on XP last year
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    So, I was chilling out building a TSR message downloader in python.
    My regular expressions were flowing nicely, cutting away vbulletin html crud and revealing the (slightly) less crud-like messages beneath.
    Got it rolling, was working great, storing my messages in a sqlite3 database. The code was clean and life was good.

    Then I decided that what I really needed was some clicky buttons to navigate through and read them. I think to myself "Microsoft got GUI building really good, python can't be too far behind...right?"

    2 days later I'm wading in blocks of the most verbose code (where by 'code' I mean 'tk ****e') since I wrote my last Java application. Except Java was readable. Where Java has verbal diarrhea, tkinter just has diarrhea.

    Who knew GUIs could be so painful?
    Spoiler:
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    Clearly, the entire python community.
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    (Original post by Chrosson)
    So, I was chilling out building a TSR message downloader in python.
    My regular expressions were flowing nicely, cutting away vbulletin html crud and revealing the (slightly) less crud-like messages beneath.
    Got it rolling, was working great, storing my messages in a sqlite3 database. The code was clean and life was good.

    Then I decided that what I really needed was some clicky buttons to navigate through and read them. I think to myself "Microsoft got GUI building really good, python can't be too far behind...right?"

    2 days later I'm wading in blocks of the most verbose code (where by 'code' I mean 'tk ****e') since I wrote my last Java application. Except Java was readable. Where Java has verbal diarrhea, tkinter just has diarrhea.

    Who knew GUIs could be so painful?
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    Show
    Clearly, the entire python community.
    Cool story bro. Lesson learnt: The open source community know nothing about design. :pierre:
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    (Original post by Ape Gone Insane)
    University computers have Windows 7 now. :sogood:
    Yes, yes, very good... but does Groupwise work reliably at all? I remember ICS got very upset when people suggested they might want to look into alternatives

    Incidentally my old flatmate apparently got a live install of L4D running on the old XP setup somehow :holmes:

    (Original post by spikeymike)
    :rofl: QMB had W7 ages ago. :p:
    When did that come in? In 2010 everything was still on XP because they'd had problems with software compatibility and domain migration when they originally tested Win7 IIRC.
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    (Original post by ch0llima)
    Yes, yes, very good... but does Groupwise work reliably at all? I remember ICS got very upset when people suggested they might want to look into alternatives

    Incidentally my old flatmate apparently got a live install of L4D running on the old XP setup somehow :holmes:
    If it's any indication, I couldn't login into the system for the past 2 days because it was being apparently 'unavailable'.

    It's such a crap system tbh. I have to enter my login details everytime/fields aren't even filled in. This is 2011. I don't want to spend time doing this. :pierre:
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    Anyone got any experience of using a Windows RAS server (Small Business Server 2003) with Ubuntu? Really CBA using XP just to access work files at home.
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    (Original post by Dez)
    Cool story bro. Lesson learnt: The open source community know nothing about design. :pierre:
    It's so sad, yet it's true. Focusing on the GNU/Linux community, I can think of precisely 1 thing they did well - multiple desktops. And even that goes down the drain when you (god forbid) attach another monitor.

    Browsers don't count due to their market, enlightenment (and compiz for that matter) is pretty but ultimately a pain to use. I really can't think of any successes...

    R, sed, vim, emacs. I pray I never need to understand any of them, but I know it's only a matter of time.

    I get why, I really do - keyboards are just more efficient. But that doesn't mean everything graphical has to be so pathetic you actually need to use the command line tools to be productive...case in point, GNU R. What the **** were they thinking when this abject failure of a program was created. I am incoherent with rage.

    ...


    Urgh, I hate Linux. Rant over for until the next instalment of 'OS ruins my life'
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    (Original post by ch0llima)
    When did that come in? In 2010 everything was still on XP because they'd had problems with software compatibility and domain migration when they originally tested Win7 IIRC.
    IIRC near the end of semester 1 2010.

    Did you study at Dundee? :holmes:
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    (Original post by Ape Gone Insane)
    If it's any indication, I couldn't login into the system for the past 2 days because it was being apparently 'unavailable'.

    It's such a crap system tbh. I have to enter my login details everytime/fields aren't even filled in. This is 2011. I don't want to spend time doing this. :pierre:
    It's called, security.
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    (Original post by Chrosson)
    It's so sad, yet it's true. Focusing on the GNU/Linux community, I can think of precisely 1 thing they did well - multiple desktops. And even that goes down the drain when you (god forbid) attach another monitor.

    Browsers don't count due to their market, enlightenment (and compiz for that matter) is pretty but ultimately a pain to use. I really can't think of any successes...

    R, sed, vim, emacs. I pray I never need to understand any of them, but I know it's only a matter of time.

    I get why, I really do - keyboards are just more efficient. But that doesn't mean everything graphical has to be so pathetic you actually need to use the command line tools to be productive...case in point, GNU R. What the **** were they thinking when this abject failure of a program was created. I am incoherent with rage.

    ...


    Urgh, I hate Linux. Rant over for until the next instalment of 'OS ruins my life'
    PRSOM I love your rants about Linux.
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    (Original post by Chrosson)
    It's so sad, yet it's true. Focusing on the GNU/Linux community, I can think of precisely 1 thing they did well - multiple desktops. And even that goes down the drain when you (god forbid) attach another monitor.

    Browsers don't count due to their market, enlightenment (and compiz for that matter) is pretty but ultimately a pain to use. I really can't think of any successes...

    R, sed, vim, emacs. I pray I never need to understand any of them, but I know it's only a matter of time.

    I get why, I really do - keyboards are just more efficient. But that doesn't mean everything graphical has to be so pathetic you actually need to use the command line tools to be productive...case in point, GNU R. What the **** were they thinking when this abject failure of a program was created. I am incoherent with rage.

    ...


    Urgh, I hate Linux. Rant over for until the next instalment of 'OS ruins my life'
    Multi monitors was one of the reasons for me to switch back to windows.
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    (Original post by Mad Vlad)
    It's called, security.
    That's poor IMO considering all the other parts of the network have my username and password filled in. And they use the same details...
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    Talk about security

    At sheffield, we're only allowed a password that is no longer than 8 characters long, it can't use special characters and it must start with a lowercase letter
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    (Original post by wizard710)
    Talk about security

    At sheffield, we're only allowed a password that is no longer than 8 characters long, it can't use special characters and it must start with a lowercase letter
    What are 'special characters'? Surely that doesn't include punctuation.
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    (Original post by Chrosson)
    What are 'special characters'? Surely that doesn't include punctuation.
    it means everything that isn't A-Z, a-z or 0-9
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    (Original post by wizard710)
    it means everything that isn't A-Z, a-z or 0-9
    Someone needs to tell your admins that password restriction are to try and raise the bar of password strength, not lower it :facepalm2:
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    Many systems are legacy back ends, often running on Unix, and apparently these can get their knickers in a serious twist if you use Unix shell characters as part of your password - this was the reason I was given by my university sysadmins back in the day. Legacy back ends are another reason why a lot of banks in particular don't like massively long and complex passwords as their Jurassic era database and transactional mainframe systems don't understand this bloody modern rubbish

    Still, a-z/A-Z/0-9 is still an alphabet of 62 characters. Use a ten character password and you've got a search space of 62^10 (the Latex wasn't working properly) or 839 299 365 868 340 224 possible combinations which is, as my Maths teacher used to say, 'quite a lot'. You may 'get lucky' and find your password somewhere near the start if you're brute forcing, but somehow, I think it's unlikely your generic PC World netbook will make a serious dent in any kind of feasible timeframe. The only people with the wherewithal and power are the likes of the NSA and they are rumoured to have been building gigantic rainbow tables for quite some time now.

    Anyway, strict password requirements aren't always the best solution. The more complex the password, the more likely it is that somebody who isn't computer literate or has a poor memory will write it down. A lot of people favour the 'passphrase' approach, in which a password of ChrossonIsATSROverLordInTraining AndAPSHelper (43 characters) is easier to remember than the shorter password of ^Dt8}t2&Z?c/tX7Ro,wg (20 characters). The longer plain English passphrase is easier to remember, is not a common phrase and is thus unlikely to appear in any dictionary lists. Its length also means that, despite the somewhat basic character set, you're still looking at a search space of 52^43 when bruteforcing which for 1337-h4><><0r t1mm3h is too much to handle.

    If stored in a database, add a randomly generated per-user salt and a statically set 'pepper' (which is based somewhere on the server) to the hash of the plaintext password, doing this in an undisclosed and non-standard fashion. Then hash the whole lot. Now, if 1337-h4><><0r t1mm3h runs Havij and manages to grab your users table, he's very unlikely to get anywhere.

    Ultimately, enforcing overly strict password policies ("Your password must be between 5 and 15 characters. It must contain at least one digit, at least one uppercase letter, at least one lowercase letter and at least one of the following symbols: ..." :fuhrer:) just gives a potential attacker something to go on and for a determined individual it may be possible to build or adjust bruteforcing solutions with this in mind.
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    (Original post by ch0llima)
    Many systems are legacy back ends, often running on Unix, and apparently these can get their knickers in a serious twist if you use Unix shell characters as part of your password - this was the reason I was given by my university sysadmins back in the day. Legacy back ends are another reason why a lot of banks in particular don't like massively long and complex passwords as their Jurassic era database and transactional mainframe systems don't understand this bloody modern rubbish
    Interesting, would read again.

    Still, a-z/A-Z/0-9 is still an alphabet of 62 characters. Use a ten character password and you've got a search space of 62^10 (the Latex wasn't working properly) or 839 299 365 868 340 224 possible combinations which is, as my Maths teacher used to say, 'quite a lot'. You may 'get lucky' and find your password somewhere near the start if you're brute forcing, but somehow, I think it's unlikely your generic PC World netbook will make a serious dent in any kind of feasible timeframe.
    But for the lucky wizard710 we have one lowercase char followed by at max 7 of [A-Za-z0-9], giving a search space of 26 * 62^7 if everyone uses the strongest passwords they can (as obviously the search space increases by including shorter passwords), an order of magnitude less.
    I think the issue is encouraging weak passwords though. The work factor can make brute forcing prohibitive, but when you have to start with a lowercase char it almost begs for a dictionary attack...
 
 
 
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