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    (Original post by rodarte)
    Wellies are not ok, they are a necessity! And well worth the investment considering how often you'll be using them.

    @dragon500uk - that would be revealing a little too much, wouldn't it? I don't do physics though.

    @nuuba - I don't have many friends in the science department so I can't say for sure, but I know St Andrews is generally more well known for its philosophy and IR department. In fact, I'm tempted to believe they invest all their money and resources in the IR dept.
    The east of Scotland is drier than the west. Fact. We're having a particularly wet winter this year though.

    And how would it be revealing too much? You have a gripe with a particular department (of which you are familiar) so wouldn't it be useful to "warn" potential students about that subject? Not all the faculties/schools are equal.

    The science departments are really good here - the university is NOT just investing all their money in the arts, Millions has gone towards building a new, super shiny medic/bio building next to physics. The research departments in St Andrews (for physics at least) is incredibly well known and thought of, we have an awesome optics team and millions of pounds of research going on at any one time.

    It's really awe inspiring being a science student when there's so much going on around you.
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    (Original post by dragon500uk)
    The east of Scotland is drier than the west. Fact. We're having a particularly wet winter this year though.

    And how would it be revealing too much? You have a gripe with a particular department (of which you are familiar) so wouldn't it be useful to "warn" potential students about that subject? Not all the faculties/schools are equal.

    The science departments are really good here - the university is NOT just investing all their money in the arts, Millions has gone towards building a new, super shiny medic/bio building next to physics. The research departments in St Andrews (for physics at least) is incredibly well known and thought of, we have an awesome optics team and millions of pounds of research going on at any one time.

    It's really awe inspiring being a science student when there's so much going on around you.
    The east coast is drier, but this is still Scotland we're talking about here...

    I'm happy for you that you're having a great time here, but I think you need to be open minded and realise that not every student in this university is one happy bunny. Your replies are starting to sound a little personal, and I would appreciate it if we kept the discussion to insights about the school, rather than attack the other party for holding a different opinion to yours. Notice that I have restricted my opinion to issues I have with the school, and I would appreciate if you could do the same.

    I cannot comment on the physic department's research output, but I do know for a fact that certain humanities departments are a lot more prominent in general. Certainly the number of humanities students outnumber the science student population here - although quantity doesn't mean quality, I do believe the ratio reflects the fact that st andrews is generally more well regarded for its arts department. If you can provide examples that will prove otherwise, then I will gladly take back this statement. Also, I don't believe St Andrews is part of the famous Russell Group of research universities. Certainly the school does not strike me as being strong on research.

    I also believe that the investment in a new science building is overdue - the psychology labs and current bute facilities have not been updated in a while and cannot handle the growing enrollment.

    What most people seem keen to avoid discussing is that st andrews' remarkable climb up the league tables has been due to its high student satisfaction rating rather than other factors I would deem more credible, such as research output, quality of facilities, career prospects etc. I'd also like to find out which students they have been interviewing because clearly I am not the only dissatisfied one here. I have a core group of friends that are quite diverse and cosmopolitan, and I can tell you that these types will not enjoy st andrews.
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    We know St Andrews isn't for everyone one. I would advise every single person, in every walk of life, to always always visit any place they plan to spend 4+ years of their life at. This advice hasn't been heeded by your buddy Unadmonishable. I'm not sure if you're a student here or not, but if you're not and you did visit then I'm not sure what your fuss is about.

    (Original post by rodarte)
    The east coast is drier, but this is still Scotland we're talking about here...
    The weather here is fine. Not as good as California but a lot better than Liverpool, Glasgow or lots of other places in the UK.



    (Original post by rodarte)
    I cannot comment on the physic department's research output, but I do know for a fact that certain humanities departments are a lot more prominent in general. Certainly the number of humanities students outnumber the science student population here - although quantity doesn't mean quality, I do believe the ratio reflects the fact that st andrews is generally more well regarded for its arts department.

    If you can provide examples that will prove otherwise, then I will gladly take back this statement.
    St Andrews places 2nd in the RAE (research assessment exercise, the most important assessment of research quality in the UK) for physics this year. I'm a physics student so I'll just deal with physics and astronomy. We have the largest optical telescope in the UK, as well as one of the best places to observe (because of the low amounts of light pollution). We have some of the best optics research in the UK. We are world-leaders in LEP (light emitting plastics) used in skin-cancer treatment. St Andrews may be a mostly arts university - I'm not sure if this is true or not but I'll take you on your word - but the science departments are still world class. Look at the RAE.


    (Original post by rodarte)
    Also, I don't believe St Andrews is part of the famous Russell Group of research universities. Certainly the school does not strike me as being strong on research.
    The "famous" Russell group means almost nothing. Universities like Cardiff University, University of Southampton and University of Nottingham are all members but place below St Andrews in every single metric - both general league tables, RAE and just about everything else.

    Look at this link
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell...#League_Tables

    It shows the league table position of your "famous" Russell group universities. 28, 31, 34... is being in the group really that important? (answer: no)

    (Original post by rodarte)
    I also believe that the investment in a new science building is overdue - the psychology labs and current bute facilities have not been updated in a while and cannot handle the growing enrollment.
    There is a brand new Bute building, due to finish this semester. Can you back up your statement about "cannot handle the growing enrolment"? I think the admissions department will understand the capacity of the university better than you or I, and will admit a suitable number of people each year.

    (Original post by rodarte)
    What most people seem keen to avoid discussing is that st andrews' remarkable climb up the league tables has been due to its high student satisfaction rating rather than other factors I would deem more credible, such as research output, quality of facilities, career prospects etc.
    St Andrews scores highly in all of those metrics, and scores amazingly highly in student satisfaction. Why? Because students here are, in the vast majority of cases, extremely happy. You and Unadmonishable are the only two anti-StAs people I have ever seen posting here, in the few years I've been a member. I don't know anyone in person who doesn't enjoy it.

    Student satisfaction isn't an "unimportant" measure - as a student, the single most important thing to me is am I going to be satisfied. I couldn't care less about the research quality or anything that won't effect me; I really, at the end of the day, only want to be happy at university. St Andrews provides that, and much much more (explaining our current high positions in all league tables).

    I'd rather be here than somewhere where you classify as having better research (even though RAE says otherwise?) but where the students aren't happy.

    (Original post by rodarte)
    I'd also like to find out which students they have been interviewing because clearly I am not the only dissatisfied one here. I have a core group of friends that are quite diverse and cosmopolitan, and I can tell you that these types will not enjoy st andrews.
    I don't even know what the bit in bold means, so I'll leave it there. As a final remark I'll say that St Andrews is an incredibly diverse university, attracting top students from all around the world, and to say you know a type of people who "will not enjoy it", unless they are party-animals, is something I find hard to believe.

    I've written plenty here, hopefully you'll at least scan it over before replying.

    See you around
    James
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    (Original post by M_E_X)
    I would advise every single person, in every walk of life, to always always visit any place they plan to spend 4+ years of their life at.[/B] This advice hasn't been heeded by your buddy Unadmonishable. I'm not sure if you're a student here or not, but if you're not and you did visit then I'm not sure what your fuss is about.
    I am an international student - it would cost quite a fair sum, not to mention quite a fair bit of time for me to fly down just for a day of visiting. I tried my best by looking up online reviews and forums such as this one - in hindsight, I would have appreciated being able to read about both sides of st andrews, instead of all the generic "st andys is awesome!!!! you'll have a great time here!!!!" comments.


    (Original post by M_E_X)
    St Andrews places 2nd in the RAE (research assessment exercise, the most important assessment of research quality in the UK) for physics this year. I'm a physics student so I'll just deal with physics and astronomy. We have the largest optical telescope in the UK, as well as one of the best places to observe (because of the low amounts of light pollution). We have some of the best optics research in the UK. We are world-leaders in LEP (light emitting plastics) used in skin-cancer treatment. St Andrews may be a mostly arts university - I'm not sure if this is true or not but I'll take you on your word - but the science departments are still world class. Look at the RAE.
    I said before that I would take back my statement if you could provide evidence to the point, and I am happy to concede on this point.


    (Original post by M_E_X)
    Universities like Cardiff University, University of Southampton and University of Nottingham are all members but place below St Andrews in every single metric - both general league tables, RAE and just about everything else.

    Look at this link
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell...#League_Tables

    It shows the league table position of your "famous" Russell group universities. 28, 31, 34... is being in the group really that important? (answer: no)
    Maybe this just brings about the question of...how reliable are league tables, anyway? Just maybe...


    (Original post by M_E_X)
    There is a brand new Bute building, due to finish this semester. Can you back up your statement about "cannot handle the growing enrolment"? I think the admissions department will understand the capacity of the university better than you or I, and will admit a suitable number of people each year.
    It is due to complete - it has not yet been completed. I am hardly the only one to have commented on the increasing student population YOY. The strain can be seen in not just school facilities such as the library and labs, but also in the outrageous spikes in accommodation costs.


    (Original post by M_E_X)
    St Andrews scores highly in all of those metrics, and scores amazingly highly in student satisfaction. Why? Because students here are, in the vast majority of cases, extremely happy. You and Unadmonishable are the only two anti-StAs people I have ever seen posting here, in the few years I've been a member. I don't know anyone in person who doesn't enjoy it.
    TSR forums can hardly qualify as a good representation of the student body.

    (Original post by M_E_X)
    Student satisfaction isn't an "unimportant" measure - as a student, the single most important thing to me is am I going to be satisfied. I couldn't care less about the research quality or anything that won't effect me; I really, at the end of the day, only want to be happy at university. St Andrews provides that, and much much more (explaining our current high positions in all league tables).
    So do I, trust me, so do I. Which is why I was delighted to learn of the high student satisfaction rate and chose to attend this university, but I am now doubtful as to why our ratings are so high. Again I know of more than a handful who are unhappy here, so what I say is not based on the crazy ramblings of just myself. That said whilst being happy is definitely very important, I don't think it qualifies to carry equal weight as research output/career placement when computing league tables.

    (Original post by M_E_X)
    I don't even know what the bit in bold means, so I'll leave it there. As a final remark I'll say that St Andrews is an incredibly diverse university, attracting top students from all around the world, and to say you know a type of people who "will not enjoy it", unless they are party-animals, is something I find hard to believe.
    Like I mentioned before, having a high concentration of international students does not necessarily mean diversity - most of these students come from similar social backgrounds that unfortunately have lent some (more often than not) a notion of entitlement and holier-than-thou attitudes.

    (Original post by M_E_X)
    I've written plenty here, hopefully you'll at least scan it over before replying.
    I hope I've not let you down.
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    This discussion is getting tiring.

    Agree to disagree?

    Cake anyone?
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    (Original post by dragon500uk)
    This discussion is getting tiring.

    Agree to disagree?

    Cake anyone?
    Agreed

    This thread was meant to inform, not attack.
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    (Original post by rodarte)
    This thread was meant to inform, not attack.
    Can't say I agree with that analysis.
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    (Original post by Jelkin)
    Hmmm. You seem slightly snobbish - trying to assert that other students delude themselves when they "think" they're having fun. I can see where you're coming from though.

    However, I think it would be kind of cool living in a studenty place where there isn't constant pressure to go out drinking every night - perhaps it would make people more creative with ideas of what to do. Also, I'm from a small town, so I don't really get bored.
    I agree with you, Jelkin. St. Andrews is one of the unis that I would like to go to (and the bad description hasn't put me off at all!) and I am not going to be one of those students who just goes out drinking and clubbing. Yeah sure, I will drink but not to excess. And I am not keen on clubbing, so St. Andrews sounds PERFECT! I have already visited St. Andrews and the surrounding area several times as I have family living there, and I love it.

    Furthermore, one of the big plusses, in my opinion, is its closeness to Edinburgh. Hop on a train from Kirkcaldy and you can be in Edinburgh in about a hour, which is great, as Edinburgh is a fantastic city.

    So I guess the thing to do is visit before you apply to uni there!
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    (Original post by Grace93)
    I agree with you, Jelkin. St. Andrews is one of the unis that I would like to go to (and the bad description hasn't put me off at all!) and I am not going to be one of those students who just goes out drinking and clubbing. Yeah sure, I will drink but not to excess. And I am not keen on clubbing, so St. Andrews sounds PERFECT! I have already visited St. Andrews and the surrounding area several times as I have family living there, and I love it.

    Furthermore, one of the big plusses, in my opinion, is its closeness to Edinburgh. Hop on a train from Kirkcaldy and you can be in Edinburgh in about a hour, which is great, as Edinburgh is a fantastic city.

    So I guess the thing to do is visit before you apply to uni there!
    The closest train station is Leuchars - which is much closer than Kirkcaldy but still on the same line. It's also connected to Aberdeen.
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    (Original post by dragon500uk)
    The closest train station is Leuchars - which is much closer than Kirkcaldy but still on the same line. It's also connected to Aberdeen.
    Oops! Forgot, sorry! I'm not that familiar with the area yet.
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    Right, I have not read through this whole thread because I'm not one who typically goes to the student room.

    St. Andrews is probably the best place in the world. If you make the right friends and follow what's going on your nights out can be a blast.

    The students responding on the student room are not the ones who would be willing to go out to dundee on a wednesday and return at 4am to attend a tutorial at 9am. I know this because I'm so occupied I never have time to use the computer for anything but work.

    Not going into much further detail. But if your a geek or aren't social you just don't get the same experience and sitting in your room lurking the student room, reddit, and digg is dull as ****.

    I'm not going to check if anyone responds so don't try.

    edit: Also, I love the lizard(it is a club). I'm there 3 nights a week. Don't hate just because its small! Ma Bells is great too. Catch on thursdays is always fun. Seriously, no nightlife? what are you talking about.
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    The only crap thing I can think of about St Andrews is the train not running directly to it.

    If it wasn't for St Andrews Direct, getting home and back during holidays would be a pain.
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    (Original post by halon)
    Right, I have not read through this whole thread because I'm not one who typically goes to the student room.

    St. Andrews is probably the best place in the world. If you make the right friends and follow what's going on your nights out can be a blast.

    The students responding on the student room are not the ones who would be willing to go out to dundee on a wednesday and return at 4am to attend a tutorial at 9am. I know this because I'm so occupied I never have time to use the computer for anything but work.

    Not going into much further detail. But if your a geek or aren't social you just don't get the same experience and sitting in your room lurking the student room, reddit, and digg is dull as ****.

    I'm not going to check if anyone responds so don't try.

    edit: Also, I love the lizard(it is a club). I'm there 3 nights a week. Don't hate just because its small! Ma Bells is great too. Catch on thursdays is always fun. Seriously, no nightlife? what are you talking about.
    I hope you come back becuase I think there's a very high chance I know you haha...and I agree with everything you said.
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    [QUOTE=Umiisadorable]You people are so bitter its pathetic.

    we're the bitter ones? hahahahahahaa

    well I'm at St Andrews and I think it's great here. Yep, you should've done your research. If you hate it, transfer, stop moaning because you're putting off potential applicants. Please don't claim that this is the "real" St Andrews - if you have negative thoughts about St Andrews then sure, air them, but be objective about it. I reeeeally really hope I don't run into you during my time here because you don't sound like the sort of person I'd get on with at all.

    University is what you make of it.
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    The idea that it's not full of stuffy nightclubs in which you have to pay £4 for a drink on top of £5 to get in is actually making it sound more appealing to me.

    And hey, if you have to go to Dundee for shopping, well that's an excuse for a little journey on the bus!

    I am such a relentless optimist...
    • Thread Starter
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    [QUOTE=madamebovary]
    (Original post by Umiisadorable)
    You people are so bitter its pathetic.

    we're the bitter ones? hahahahahahaa

    I reeeeally really hope I don't run into you during my time here because you don't sound like the sort of person I'd get on with at all.
    Ditto
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    [QUOTE=madamebovary]
    (Original post by Umiisadorable)
    You people are so bitter its pathetic.

    we're the bitter ones? hahahahahahaa

    well I'm at St Andrews and I think it's great here. Yep, you should've done your research. If you hate it, transfer, stop moaning because you're putting off potential applicants. Please don't claim that this is the "real" St Andrews - if you have negative thoughts about St Andrews then sure, air them, but be objective about it. I reeeeally really hope I don't run into you during my time here because you don't sound like the sort of person I'd get on with at all.

    University is what you make of it.
    This frankly. Once again for the benefit of the applicants who may be making up their minds I love St-Andrews to bits as a place, the only thing I would perhaps change would be to put more tesco value stuff in the intown tesco.
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    I know the OP claimed that the first and second year syllabi are not particularly challenging for everyone but Medicine students, but can anyone from the Medicine class specify as to the quality of medical education.

    Many thanks
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    (Original post by hh1991)
    I know the OP claimed that the first and second year syllabi are not particularly challenging for everyone but Medicine students, but can anyone from the Medicine class specify as to the quality of medical education.

    Many thanks
    every Medic I know here thinks it's great...
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    (Original post by Umiisadorable)
    O.K, I'm writing this because I wished someone had done the same for me when I was applying to University, and been honest about what its REALLY like at St Andrews. I am a Second year student at the University, and wanted to make a formal warning to people wanting to apply to this University, because I don't want others to be duped the way that I was and then arrive here and realise what a colossal mistake they have made.

    O.K, academically, the university has a very strong reputation which in my opinion, isn't entirely justified; having been to a private school since the age of 12, I have actually been relatively unimpressed by some of the teaching standards here at St Andrews especially in the first two years which do not actually count towards the rest of the degree. So essentially, two out of the four years you'll spend here, unless you are actually studing medicine are a complete waste and count for nothing, and some of the tutors in the Arts honours degree are simply postgraduate students whose tutorial sessions are completely redundant and useless and essentially function as a means of checking that you've simply read the pointless articles and snippets set. The point is that St Andrews has a strong reputation primarily because it is an OLD university- the oldest in Scotland in fact, which is why its regarded so highly- so don't be fooled as I was into believe that it is truly anything special.

    Now, to the most significant part of my article- the place itself is hopeless. Its like a tiny, picturesque little prison with no clubs, and a very limited amount of shops and NO SHOPPING CENTRE whatsoever. People really skim over that fact when talking about this place as if it doesn’t matter, but its important because it becomes maddening- even for people who claim to adore the place, the fact that the highstreet has basically very few shops is a drag, as is the standard and quality of the so-called 'nightlife'. As I stated there are NO CLUBS just tiny crowded pubs with embarrassingly little space that attempt to mould themselves into clubs, but have 'dancefloors' the size of a small bedroom and play awful music. Students BEHAVE as though they are enjoying themselves thoroughly, getting dressed up to stand around in grotty pubs and drink, but they’re either very sad or pretending, honestly, because there's never any space and ALL VENUES SHUT AT ONE O CLOCk in the morning. I'm not kidding. So people leave their little dorms at 11 to come back two hours later drunk and say they've had a great night. It’s very, very sad. If leaving the Union at 1 in the morning after spending your time in there listening to the same terrible music in a tiny box of a room sounds fun then perhaps not, but people behave as if they're SO excited for absolutely no reason at all because there is nothing to get excited about. I love going out, but going out here is not what i call going out because all you're doing is going to one of the pubs next to Tesco to the Union which are all five minutes away from each other because the place is so ridiculously, pathetically small.
    It is a beautiful place if you like castles and rabbits, and there is a gorgeous beahc although its only really ‘usable’ for one moth over the two Semesters and the fact that it is as small as it is ruins things, because instead of being able as you should in a city or a larger town, to escape to the centre for an afternoon just to relax or go somewhere a little different with friends- here there is no 'centre' to escape to, and So little to do its incredibly claustrophobic.

    The centre of town consists of three streets with tiny little shops and a few banks, like the bare minimum you would expect from an underdeveloped borough in London. There’s Dundee to go to which is 25 minutes away on a bus, but that in itself is actually a very dismal place with a few half decent shops although it does have a few clubs, which are the only saving grace of the place- I’ve been a few times and the clubs are actually good there which is a plus, but the cab fare to get there and back is 60 pounds- you know why? Because of the terrible transport system which means that there are no such thing as night buses here and so you HAVE to take a cab if going out to Dundee later than midnight- it’s things like that which bother me, because even ATTEMPTING to have fun is hard work here.

    Its also very difficult to find decent work here because of the lack of opportunities because of the lack of shops, and the \university’s Career Centre is completely hopeless, and basically has no reason for existing, because all the vacancy details could just be sent by e-mail to students, but they refuse to do that and instaead obligate you to go there in person and look up a vacancy located in a single file, which yu then have to que for half and hour to get access to. I am NOT joking.
    Most significantly, I have spoken to three people from London, two of whom are my friends and one who has now left because he hated the place so much, and they all say the same thing about it. I had to write this because since I came I have contemplated leaving several times, so if you’re from a decent, fun city, be prepared for the hugest disappointment of your life.

    This is an excellent place for social climbers who live in Wellingtons and wear Ray Bans and tweed in December and actually consider drunkenly stumbling around in someone’s lounge or the crowded rooms in the Union until only 1 in the morning to be a fun night out. My experience here has illustrated the extent of people's capacity for self deception and delusion because sincerely, the place is pathetic. One of the most boring places I have ever lived, and a regretful and frustrating experience. If you want a real taste of University life, do not come to St Andrews- almost everyone I’ve spoken to since coming here has expressed that they dislike the place for the very same reasons I have stated here. Obviously, as I expect, people will disagree with me, but this needs to be said, because I have seen hints of others stating negative things about the place but no-one so far I have read has really given the place the dressing down it deserves.

    WARNING- Big post! If you’ve just read OP’s OP and have found a point that shocked you, I’ve tried to organise by argument, so it should be easier to find the response. I couldn’t be bothered getting all the quotes in the “quote” thing, but I promise I’ve cut and pasted without amendment. If you want to read the whole thing, go on…

    OP, you're mistaking fact for opinion, and assuming everyone is like you. Features about St Andrew's you see as cons, others will see as pros. Thusly-

    FACT: St Andrew’s is small.
    YOUR OPINION: This is “ridiculous and pathetic”
    MY OPINION: This creates a friendly atmosphere and close-nit student community. It was one of the factors that sold the place to me; I’m from a town of similar size and would hate living in a city.
    CONCLUSION: St Andrew’s is a small town. Don’t come to St Andrew’s if you don’t like small towns, do if you do. Duh.

    FACT: St Andrew's does not have any clubs. (Actually incorrect in the strictest sense but I'll let it stand for now)
    YOUR OPINION: This means St Andrews is a boring place and people won't like it.
    MY OPINION: Nobody's going to force me to pay an extortionate amount of money so I can stand in a cramped and noisy room and feel awkward and self-conscious because I can’t dance. Brilliant!
    CONCLUSION: St Andrew's is a bad place for people who like clubs, a good place for people who don't!

    FACT: St Andrew's does not have a shopping centre.
    YOUR OPINION: No shopping centre is a terrible, terrible, dark and evil thing.
    MY OPINION: St Andrew's doesn't need a shopping centre, and neither do I. I can’t think of a single occasion I’ve wanted something I can’t buy in the shops on the high-street. Groceries, cake, clothes, climbing magazines, a new ink cartridge. My needs are fulfilled.
    CONCLUSION: St Andrew’s is a bad place for people who view shopping as their essential pass-time, hobby, form of exercise and raison d’être, but fine for people who view shopping as a way of getting stuff.

    Now let’s consider where opinion differs from fact:

    YOUR OPINION: Coming to St Andrews was “A colossal mistake.”
    MY OPINION: Coming to St Andrews was the best decision I ever made!
    FACT: Universities are different. People are different. If you don’t take time to pick the right one for you, you will regret it. St Andrew’s, like anywhere else, is not for everybody, some will thrive here, a few will wither. The fact St Andrew’s has the lowest drop-out rate of any UK university, and the highest rating of student satisfaction anywhere though, would suggest most people pick more carefully than you.

    YOUR OPINION: “Tutorial sessions are redundant and useless.”
    MY OPINION: Tutorial sessions are challenging and enjoyable. I’m an English Lit student, and our tutorials revolve around discussing the book we read that week, so yes, we need to do the reading. If you don’t want to do the reading, why the hell are you at Uni at all? My tutor is an incredibly intelligent, engaging and experienced lecturer who has experience of teaching at Oxbridge, Kings and abroad, and the people in my group are all keen and talkative. I’ve found myself putting in loads of extra reading to try and compete with them, and I’m pretty sure they’re doing the same for me.
    FACT: Tutorials can be utterly brilliant, utterly dismal and anywhere in between. Some of it depends on the tutor you get, there just aren’t enough lecturers to go around 200+ undergrads in a week, but far more important is your attitude and approach. If you view the system as pointless, you won’t try and you won’t get anything out of it. Good lesson for life there, actually!

    YOUR OPINION: “O.K, academically, the university has a very strong reputation which in my opinion, isn't entirely justified”
    FACT: Google “University rankings 2010” and hit the first option (http://extras.timesonline.co.uk/tol_...rsityguide.php) we get 4th. In the second 5th, in the third we get 3rd. That’s pretty good honeybunch. I know the league tables aren’t perfect, but they’re a pretty good indicator. It might not be the best, but you can’t deny it’s up there.
    MY OPINION: You’ve decided you don’t like St Andrews and though having an uninformed stab at its academic reputation would add to the persuasive power of your argument.

    YOUR OPINION: “there is no 'centre' to escape to, and So little to do its incredibly claustrophobic.”
    MY OPINION: There is no centre to escape from, and so much to do I am constantly busy. You’re bored because you like clubbing and shopping and (for reasons best that I’m sure make sense to you) came to a university with friendly pubs instead of clubs and beautiful architecture instead of soulless and sprawling consumerist hell-holes. I’m not bored because I’ve got involved in the opportunities this University offers, doing creative and fun stuff with some cool people and stopped whinging for long enough to see there’s actually loads going on.

    A look at my organiser for March, to see what I’ve been up to: the 1st, class reps forum with Rector and Deans, the 2nd climbing trip with friends, 3rd, debate on secularism in Lower Parliament Hall, 5th house-party for friend’s birthday, 6th Grill a Christian event as part of White Wash Week, 8th, a meeting of the Mountaineering Soc committee, 10th, trip to Edinburgh with the Mountaineering Soc, 12th- 14th trip to Sheffield to compete in BUSA, paid for by the AU, 16th theatre trip to see Julius Caesar in the Union, 17th debate again, 18th campaigning for student elections, 19th sporting competition (again, all expenses paid, but unfortunately missing a string orchestra in LPH I really wanted to see…) 20th night at theatre to see a riveting production of “Who’s afraid of Virginia Woolf” by a bunch of students receiving support from the Mermaids... And that’s only the stuff I considered worthy of writing down; add in pub trips, training with the mountaineers, time with the GF, studying with friends, pier walking in my gown, creative writing with an informal group in our hall, flaming people on TSR and I’ve hardly had time to breathe. You must walk round with your eyes closed, our notice board in halls is an inch thick with flyers and posters for stuff to get involved in, how narrow-minded to you have to be to start whinging about having to get a taxi instead of a bus when you want to get smashed in a club? I betting there's something for pretty much everyone here if you look. Has OP tried the Lumsden club? “Even attempting to have fun is hard work here.”?! It depends on your definition of “fun” sweetcheeks, not to mention how blindly resolute you are on maintaining a fashionable ennui…
    FACT: Uni is what you make of it; fun does not equal clubbing alone, St Andrew's has a wide range of stuff to get involved in. It can't be blamed if you don't get involved in it.

    YOUR OPINION: “Most significantly I have found three people…all say the same thing”
    MY OPINION: If the best you can do is to find three people who don’t like St Andrew’s you’re not proving anything, particularly as they are all from London and going through the same culture shock as you. London is a massive city in Southern England; St Andrew’s is a small University town in Scotland. They’re possibly the two most opposite places in the UK. We haven’t got any gun crime, gangs, congestion or pollution for a start…

    Look people, basically St Andrew's is St Andrew's, and that isn't changing. Pick your Uni carefully, nothing can please everybody - if the OP's vision of a perfect St Andrew's was the reality then I wouldn't be here. The fact remains that you've been a little overly critical of what, for most, is an enjoyable and educative experience. After only a Semester and a half I feel I've learnt loads, trained hard, partied hard with some awesome people and been to some amazing places I wouldn't have otherwise got to see. My St Andrew's is a happy and enjoyable place, and I'm sorry your's is not, but please don’t be arrogant enough to assume because you don’t like something it must be rubbish, or people might just listen to you and miss out on something amazing.

    EDIT- If you've just read this and thought "My God, he sounds like a massive nerd, I'm not going there!" then don't worry, everyone around me has come to the same conclusion, we're not all nerds. I can promise there's more to St Andrew's than sport, debating, gowns and Societies, it's just those are the bits I like! I might be a nerd, but I can promise I'm a happy one! Oh, hall food does suck though, that bit's true.
 
 
 
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Updated: April 10, 2018
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