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Iran is "a nuclear state" - Too defiant? Time to put it down? watch

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    (Original post by Krakatoa)
    Since when were Israel and the US different entities.
    You know, the US are not perfect. I'd be the last to stand up for them in some things.

    However, this incessant whining from certain parts of the Middle East as to Jewish conspiracies, US control etc is becoming not only tedious but faintly comedic.

    I would not totally disagree with anyone suggesting the US are effectively building an empire, or rather trying to. Incidentally though I trust them an awful lot more than any of those alarmed at such a strategy. This "world is against us" thing one finds in the Palestinians etc., profoundly gets on my tits. They have suffered enormously. No one is generally denying that. But when I compare certain templates of civilisation, I side with what seems sane.

    The United States have made only one mistake thus far in my eyes and that is being far too soft.
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    (Original post by MJlover)
    Because we have to pass it through the parliament first, don't we?
    If you're refering to Iraq & Afghanistan, the justification for those wars was more than 'They're different to use, therefore they must die'
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    (Original post by Jakko247)
    If you're refering to Iraq & Afghanistan, the justification for those wars was more than 'They're different to use, therefore they must die'
    It exactly that, isn't it?
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    (Original post by Hubert Poo)
    You know, the US are not perfect. I'd be the last to stand up for them in some things.

    However, this incessant whining from certain parts of the Middle East as to Jewish conspiracies, US control etc is becoming not only tedious but faintly comedic.

    I would not totally disagree with anyone suggesting the US are effectively building an empire, or rather trying to. Incidentally though I trust them an awful lot more than any of those alarmed at such a strategy. This "world is against us" thing one finds in the Palestinians etc., profoundly gets on my tits. They have suffered enormously. No one is generally denying that. But when I compare certain templates of civilisation, I side with what seems sane.

    The United States have made only one mistake thus far in my eyes and that is being far too soft.
    Hardly a 'conspiracy'. Look at the statistics. Over $17 billion in US Foreign Military Assistance. The bulk of the IDF's arsenal comprises of US equipment. 226 F-16's,89 F-15's and 700 M-60 Tanks and much much more in may other areas. http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/mideast/RL33222.pdf shows the extent to the military support of Israel.
    It also gives vital diplomatic support to Israel in the UN,virtually blocking any attempt for a lasting peace settlement and violations of international law,and also vetoing nearly 40 SC Resolutions in support of Israel.
    Israel conforms to the US' hegemonic aims and thus recieves vital diplomatic,military and economic support, that has unfortunately spilled over into support for the takeover of the occupied territories.
    The Palestinians have just become pawns in hegemonic politics,hardly a conspiracy.
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    Well you'll be up for a good fight
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/8509765.stm
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    Regardless, I do not see why liberality demands blanket support for a backward people over an admittedly decadent capitalist hegemony. All of the above looks perfectly acceptable to me when one considers a plain choice, and essentially that is what the United States have done.

    The U.S. are not perfect, but even an extensive economic and cultural empire of their making is not the worst possible outcome for the world. Politics is about practical choice.
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    The Revolutionary Guard would absolutely whoop Western asses if the West were to invade Iran too.

    War is never an option. Iraq and Afghanistan have progressively gotten worse because of the wars.

    We have nuclear weapons.... and they're allowed nuclear weapons... surprised? Well you shouldn't be :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Jakko247)
    That's probably because we don't have heads of state going on live television proclaiming 'DEATH TO THE MIDDLE EAST'

    a israeli minister claimed the palestinians were bringing a 'shoah' upon theirselves


    'shoah' being the word for 'holocaust' - exclusively meaning The Holocaust...
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    Problem with Iran becoming Nuclear is that it will spark a Middle Eastern arms race. Israel will also feel more threatened than they already do increasing the likely hood of conflict in an already tense region.
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    (Original post by flugelr)
    Problem with Iran becoming Nuclear is that it will spark a Middle Eastern arms race. Israel will also feel more threatened than they already do increasing the likely hood of conflict in an already tense region.
    So why not also pressure Israel to give up its existing nuclear weapons and, in the future, export its uranium for processing?

    Or, that wouldn't be kosher?
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    tbh we cant risk such a dangerous fundamentalist country having weapons like this.
    allowing them to keep them when they could very easily be used against us is just foolish
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    I remember on Newsnight that Russia said they're willing to party down on the Middle-East like the west; it'll be a massive cluster-****, all the locals'll die then we'll end up fighting each other for the resources.
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    (Original post by Qaz25)
    We have nuclear weapons.... and they're allowed nuclear weapons... surprised? Well you shouldn't be :rolleyes:
    unfortunately we cant govern ourselves and protect our interests based on this naivity.
    allowing them to keep these weapons is an unnacceptible risk... no, its not "fair" on them, and i would be irritated to say the least were i one of them... but the risk is too great.
    i believe the phrase "tough titties" is a good one.
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    Well if Iran is going to use them to nuke Israel, then thats fine. Leave them to it.
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    Fingers crossed Iran does go nuclear.
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    (Original post by UGeNe)
    So why not also pressure Israel to give up its existing nuclear weapons and, in the future, export its uranium for processing?

    Or, that wouldn't be kosher?
    Because Israel won't give up its nukes within the next 18 months. That also doesn't solve the issue of Iran able to close the Persian Gulf and Egypt, Syria etc starting a nuclear arms race.
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    (Original post by Barden)
    a israeli minister claimed the palestinians were bringing a 'shoah' upon theirselves


    'shoah' being the word for 'holocaust' - exclusively meaning The Holocaust...
    I was referring to the incident where I saw the head of state shouting 'Death to Britain and America' to an equally enthusiastic crowd of hundreds. Are you suggesting people who act in this way should be indepently able to possess WMD? much less nuclear weapons?
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    Tbh, I believe we are all stupid, every nation. We all try bullying tactics with one and other and as a race we are capable of so much more. The USA, UK etc made a huge mistake with nuclear weapons and by god don't we all know it. We learned that we can't keep creating weapons of mass destruction and we should not allow any other country to make that mistake. It is not as if we want to hold the arms and point the guns. No country is entitled to nuclear weapons. As a race we should be trying to get rid of nuclear weapons and so we don't all turn on ourselves and destroy us. Iran can only want nuclear weapons so it can threaten every other nation and get all it's sanctions removed by force, nuclear energy is not the way forward for energy supply either. God, if we stopped and thought for a moment we might get somewhere. We should all attempt to make this world better, instead of threats and arms race etc. After all if we decide to have a nuclear war who would want to live anyway, there'd be nothing left to want.
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    (Original post by flugelr)
    Because Israel won't give up its nukes within the next 18 months. That also doesn't solve the issue of Iran able to close the Persian Gulf and Egypt, Syria etc starting a nuclear arms race.
    You can't ask one side to disarm, while the other is armed to the teeth.

    Cold War proved that, I think.
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    (Original post by Numberone-outkast)
    the west tends to be a hypocrite, but since we live in a western world, we will see biased new reporting like we are the good guys, when its us who are doing all the invading and the bullying makes you wonder who is it that is in the really wrong doesn't it.
    I'd rep this but I've already run out.
 
 
 
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