Blame the Parents? Watch

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sapphisticated
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#41
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#41
(Original post by Trousers)
A child's behaviour is absolutely down to how their parents have raised them. Even later in life, their choice of friends is affected by the way they were treated in their first couple of years. The parents often don't realise if they're harming their children, as it's not as obvious as 'spoiled child = nasty adult', but I believe someone's personality is completely moulded by his or her parents.

This is why I don't want children.
What you're really talking about is the nature vs. nurture argument. I think you're mistaken in thinking someone's personality is 'completely' moulded by their parents. That's the line behaviourist psychology would take - the idea that every child is born an essentially 'blank slate' and simply 'learns' to behave to a certain way according to his/her environment. This totally discounts the existence of any 'innate' characteristics. Also, if people are completely moulded by their parents, why do glaring differences often exist between the personalities of siblings? You could argue, of course, that their parents treat them differently because they behave differently - but WHY do they behave differently in the first place?

Having said that, I do agree that many parents are complete and utter sh**e (and ought to be held responsible for some of the appalling behaviour of their offspring!) Too many people seem to be having children simply for the novelty factor and are unwilling to make any major changes to their lifestyles in the long-run. Also, there has been a move towards viewing children as a species apart, entirely exempt from any personal responsibility for their actions.
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Kura1984
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#42
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#42
So far, as a parent, I havn't learned a thing from this discussion! (Beware I have a bit to say here!)

My child won't be perfect and I will be heckled but since my responsibility to my child far outweighs the opinions of others (especially those over-jealous and childless), I take ALMOST no notice. But, I probably would be p**sed off if I was accused of neglect or abuse because I'm raising my child with my disabled fella. Neither of us have parents and up until two weeks ago had no support network whatsoever.

I did hear that gossip and blame helps society to better themselves as contributors since those being berated will want to prove themselves better or, in other cirumstances, they'll want to 'keep up with the Joneses'.

Parents, for the majority, are to be seen as the main contribution to their childs behaviour but we shouldn't overlook every other factor out there (although I admit that most of these other factors are chosen BY the parents):

Media
School
Friends
Family
Home
Area/City/Country
Religion
Etc, etc, etc, etc, etc....

Parents should not be berated if they tried their best. And besides, my parents were the way they were because of theway that they were raised. This is a vicious circle and 'blaming' rarely helps the situation.
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Kura1984
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#43
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#43
Up until the age of around five, kids are still trying to work out why it is that they can't have everything that they want
Why did it take a 16 year old to say this?

(No offence to your age)
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*River
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#44
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#44
Why did it take a 16 year old to say this?
I have four younger siblings...
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Melana
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#45
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#45
Thank you all - you've just contributed to my stimulus material for my A2 Drama devised piece....
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Kura1984
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#46
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#46
Should we actually feel the need to blame any one particular party for a childs entire personality?

This threads question is provocative and has no concrete answer.

Great for an argument... ahem.... debate though. :rolleyes:
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saiyamanadingdongbanana
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#47
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#47
(Original post by zooropa)
It inevitably IS the parents' fault.

It's a parent's job to teach their child values and how to act accordingly in social settings. Throwing tantrums for no apparent reason isn't healthy behaviour in a social setting.

not entirely true, taking a behaviourist approach we see that behaviour is learnt through 3 main types of people;


Family

Friends

Significant others

(SLT)



but to say the child chooses their friends, role models, religion and other things is rather disproved within the world, there are many examples of people who have not embraced their parent's ideals...

Do you listen to the same type of music as your parents?


In order to determine the cause of such behaviours one can either look at it from a biological perspective (genetics) stating that you are 'born as a child who will throw a tantrum', which would be the parent's fault, but would not be socially acceptible.


There are loads of theories of attitude and behaviour,


Biological


ones socioeconomic circumstances


Peer pressure to behave in a particular way (umm probably not the case like)


psychological reasons


i suppose even the health belief model can be applied to a certain extent
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litigation
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#48
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#48
(Original post by zooropa)
It inevitably IS the parents' fault.

It's a parent's job to teach their child values and how to act accordingly in social settings. Throwing tantrums for no apparent reason isn't healthy behaviour in a social setting.
Absolute nonesense.
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litigation
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#49
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#49
(Original post by rubysolstice)
Actually, my entire class agrees that a child's academic success should be attributed to their parents' upbringing.
More nonesense
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saiyamanadingdongbanana
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#50
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#50
(Original post by litigation)
More nonesense
lol, a very good contribution to a D+D discussion.... :rolleyes:
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Trousers
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#51
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#51
(Original post by sapphisticated)
What you're really talking about is the nature vs. nurture argument. I think you're mistaken in thinking someone's personality is 'completely' moulded by their parents. That's the line behaviourist psychology would take - the idea that every child is born an essentially 'blank slate' and simply 'learns' to behave to a certain way according to his/her environment. This totally discounts the existence of any 'innate' characteristics. Also, if people are completely moulded by their parents, why do glaring differences often exist between the personalities of siblings? You could argue, of course, that their parents treat them differently because they behave differently - but WHY do they behave differently in the first place?
Parents treat siblings completely differently, for any number of reasons - the order in which they're born, the state of the marriage at the time the child is born or when it's going through its difficult todler years, the sex of the child, and even the way it looks. Some parents treat a baby particularly nicely if it was conceived under difficult circumstances (by IVF, for instance), or if there's a big gap between one child and the next - the parents' personalities will have changed in that time, and they might use their experiences with the first child to determine how they treat the second one. A child who is quite ill in its first year might have attention lavished on it, or be neglected in favour of a healthier child. These things happen all the time - it's impossible to say that parents will act exactly the same towards two different children.

I don't think innate characteristics exist per se, but someone's pointed out that disorders like ADHD and dyslexia might affect things, and they're right - but, in the absence of conditions like this, I really think that nurture is the key.


(Original post by sapphisticated)
Having said that, I do agree that many parents are complete and utter sh**e (and ought to be held responsible for some of the appalling behaviour of their offspring!) Too many people seem to be having children simply for the novelty factor and are unwilling to make any major changes to their lifestyles in the long-run. Also, there has been a move towards viewing children as a species apart, entirely exempt from any personal responsibility for their actions.
Quite right. I'm getting a dog.
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zooropa
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#52
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#52
(Original post by litigation)
Absolute nonesense.
So it's nonsense that a parent teaches their child values?

Which people do YOU see that throw tantrums in public?
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zooropa
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#53
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#53
(Original post by saiyamana)
not entirely true, taking a behaviourist approach we see that behaviour is learnt through 3 main types of people;


Family

Friends

Significant others

(SLT)
Of course these would all influence behaviour. But a small child would surely initially gain experience of social interaction through its parents.
but to say the child chooses their friends, role models, religion and other things is rather disproved within the world, there are many examples of people who have not embraced their parent's ideals...
Perhaps
Do you listen to the same type of music as your parents?
Nope.
In order to determine the cause of such behaviours one can either look at it from a biological perspective (genetics) stating that you are 'born as a child who will throw a tantrum', which would be the parent's fault, but would not be socially acceptible.


There are loads of theories of attitude and behaviour,


Biological


ones socioeconomic circumstances


Peer pressure to behave in a particular way (umm probably not the case like)


psychological reasons


i suppose even the health belief model can be applied to a certain extent
And upbringing isn't one?
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zooropa
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#54
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#54
(Original post by litigation)
More nonesense
Great debating skills.

Would you care to explain WHY it's nonsense?
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littlemissalex
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#55
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#55
I have to agree that it is down to the parenting to "blame" if a child acts in a certain way which is unaccepted to society as you say. If you do see a child in the shop throwing a tantrum (aged 5+) then i do say "blame the parents" because you wonder why that child is behaving that way:if its because the child hasnt learnt yet to communicate through speech, then its the parents fault for not teaching the child the proper way to ask for something, if the child has a physical problem (medical and therefore cant speak and all that it knows is to scream) then thats a different circumstance. Teenagers who have behaviour problems and are as a result, a mennace and danger to society, are that way completely due to bad parenting. If you look at teenagers in those situations, you will find that they either have one parent, or their parents are going through a divorce or have drinking problems or or or... Now im not saying, whoever's parents are going through a divorce turn out to be wild! But if you look at the root of the problem as to why they behave that way, then all you have to do is look at the parents and your question is answered
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saiyamanadingdongbanana
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#56
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#56
(Original post by zooropa)
Of course these would all influence behaviour. But a small child would surely initially gain experience of social interaction through its parents.
you mean how they should react in social situations?

True.

Well it would initially be the parents fault, however parents do not have a significant effect on behaviour toward the teenage years... It's more from role models and social stereotypes (Wayne Rooney, David Beckham etc), and peer pressure. The only possible arguement in favour of this idea of 'blaming the parents' would be if the child was conditioned by the parents to like the wrong types of social stereotypes (and idolising players, such as Wayne Rooney - who was a role model for many kids when he swore at the referee's)


(Original post by that guy)
Perhaps
Definately. Ill try and find an article.





And upbringing isn't one?
it's implied in socioeconomic :p:

socioeconomic --> social and economic background.
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saiyamanadingdongbanana
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#57
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#57
(Original post by alexandra010588)
I have to agree that it is down to the parenting to "blame" if a child acts in a certain way which is unaccepted to society as you say. If you do see a child in the shop throwing a tantrum (aged 5+) then i do say "blame the parents" because you wonder why that child is behaving that way:if its because the child hasnt learnt yet to communicate through speech, then its the parents fault for not teaching the child the proper way to ask for something, if the child has a physical problem (medical and therefore cant speak and all that it knows is to scream) then thats a different circumstance. Teenagers who have behaviour problems and are as a result, a mennace and danger to society, are that way completely due to bad parenting. If you look at teenagers in those situations, you will find that they either have one parent, or their parents are going through a divorce or have drinking problems or or or... Now im not saying, whoever's parents are going through a divorce turn out to be wild! But if you look at the root of the problem as to why they behave that way, then all you have to do is look at the parents and your question is answered

you know, i'm currently studying SEN in schools for psychology and was wondering, is this your attitude toward them too?

some psychological problems, such as ADHD (attention Defecit hyperactivity disorder) may not be considered socially acceptible....


so, if someone had a learning difficulty, you would blame the parents? You going to blame the parents on a genetic level, or would you argue that a learning difficulty is a direct result of a 'learned behaviour'?

what physical condition would cause a baby to scream all day and not speak? LOL. They would be hospitalised if they were in pain, or without the ability to physically speak- even then they would be classed as mute, and you do realise what it is like for children like this dont you? Well they will most likely be 'classed as an outsider', therefore a lot can be down to their peers, as it will be likely the parents will care more for them and pay more attention..... dont you mean psychological? The only thing related to this i can think of is Autism (only started A2 psychology ), where children will stay up all night screaming, and have a difficulty in communicating.


Bit of a generalisation there! :rolleyes:
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