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    (Original post by thebucketwoman)
    Northumbrian, do you agree this was a stupid thing to say?
    and why do you think this? give me a reason. if two people have their own thread, it's wrong to go to that's person thread and stir things up. both members do it so i don't really care.
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    (Original post by Northumbrian)
    Wrong yes, stupid quite possibly.
    first, who are you? secondly, back up your statments with valid reasons.
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    (Original post by Northumbrian)
    Sure Asad Tamimi, Welcome.

    Leeds Uni J-Soc are constantly trying to sabotage our events. It is a complete and utter disgrace.

    We were having a simple peaceful stall after the anti nazi rally (attended by none of the Zionist trouble makers) and about 20 of them (some had brought parents) came to shout at us and block the way of ordinary people wanting to come to out stall. They shouted 'suicide bombers' at us. One woman pushed one of our supporters. One guy claimed one of our supporters had called him a ****ing Jew in Arabic. Then later apologised when he realised that he actually couldn't understand Arabic. And one Zionist said to another PSG members 'I know what that means! Don't say that again!# She had said 'Vanunu.' Does this have another meaning in Hebrew?

    Why can't they npiss off and have their own stalls instead of sabotaging Palestinian stalls while ignoring 150 Nazis in the centre of Leeds. A disgrace to the Jewish people.
    anyone that does that to any peaceful protest is a disgrace no matter what their cause.
    sad thing is in protesting against your peaceful stall they were using just the tactics that extremist palestinains do - terrorise, intimidate, bully.

    A bully is a bully is a bully.
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    (Original post by Navindu)
    anyone that does that to any peaceful protest is a disgrace no matter what their cause.
    sad thing is in protesting against your peaceful stall they were using just the tactics that extremist palestinains do - terrorise, intimidate, bully.

    A bully is a bully is a bully.
    My friend u have no right talking about the palestinians like that the only terrorsists that exist is the israeli government and zionism....u should wake up from this propaganda filled world...how can someone defending his rights and his land be called a terrorsit...thats how u ppl are made to see the world...How can u possibly call the ppl of iraq who are defending their country by giving up their lives and blowing themselves up because its the best they can do...how can u call them terrorsits when what they are doing is right and u call the coalition forces anti terrorists....have they bought the democracy the ppl were promised...have they brought ANY hope to the country???????????? U call them terrorsts for asking back for their rights????? u ppl are soo blind if u cant see the real world around u
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    (Original post by Hitman)
    My friend u have no right talking about the palestinians like that the only terrorsists that exist is the israeli government and zionism....u should wake up from this propaganda filled world...how can someone defending his rights and his land be called a terrorsit...thats how u ppl are made to see the world...How can u possibly call the ppl of iraq who are defending their country by giving up their lives and blowing themselves up because its the best they can do...how can u call them terrorsits when what they are doing is right and u call the coalition forces anti terrorists....have they bought the democracy the ppl were promised...have they brought ANY hope to the country???????????? U call them terrorsts for asking back for their rights????? u ppl are soo blind if u cant see the real world around u
    O shut the hell up angry boy.

    A man using a gun to fend off against settlers would be defending his land. A man going onto a bus and blowing himself up. That is just bullying in the worst form until the other side change their views.

    And you are indicative of the problem on both sides here. No questions on where I stand, you just launch straight into a mindless tirade backing up what are in the large part criminals and murderers.
    The real propoganda is that supporting the palestinian people is the same as supporting Hamas or Islamic Jihad.
    Its not. I deplore the militant groups and all they stand for. I support the palestinians that are actually downtrodden. I support the legal representatives of them - the government, which in some areas is actively being attacked by Hamas etc. They are simply smart criminals, no more, no less.
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    (Original post by Navindu)
    O shut the hell up angry boy.

    A man using a gun to fend off against settlers would be defending his land. A man going onto a bus and blowing himself up. That is just bullying in the worst form until the other side change their views.

    And you are indicative of the problem on both sides here. No questions on where I stand, you just launch straight into a mindless tirade backing up what are in the large part criminals and murderers.
    The real propoganda is that supporting the palestinian people is the same as supporting Hamas or Islamic Jihad.
    Its not. I deplore the militant groups and all they stand for. I support the palestinians that are actually downtrodden. I support the legal representatives of them - the government, which in some areas is actively being attacked by Hamas etc. They are simply smart criminals, no more, no less.
    Your simply a blind man in a fabricated world :cool:
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    yes thats right. every single palestinian is ompletely innocent of any crime, and every single israeli deserves what is coming to them.

    And you wonder why people won't take you seriously, and why some like myself would rather you not try to help fight our cause.
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    The Palestinians have nothing to sacrifice but their very bodies. It's amazing that there have not been more martyrdom operations.
    --------------
    I'm Hanif Leylabi President of RESPECT Society at the University of Leeds, President of the Stop the War Coalition at the University of Leeds and MediaWatch Officer for the Palestine Solidarity Group at the University of Leeds. Who are you?

    I think it was stupid because not all Jews su[pport Israel and indeed the most critical poeple of the state odf Israel are usually Jews.
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    (Original post by Navindu)
    O shut the hell up angry boy.

    A man using a gun to fend off against settlers would be defending his land. A man going onto a bus and blowing himself up. That is just bullying in the worst form until the other side change their views.

    And you are indicative of the problem on both sides here. No questions on where I stand, you just launch straight into a mindless tirade backing up what are in the large part criminals and murderers.
    The real propoganda is that supporting the palestinian people is the same as supporting Hamas or Islamic Jihad.
    Its not. I deplore the militant groups and all they stand for. I support the palestinians that are actually downtrodden. I support the legal representatives of them - the government, which in some areas is actively being attacked by Hamas etc. They are simply smart criminals, no more, no less.
    I’m sorry I have to interrupt here but what I see is two people who are on the same side bickering. I see where your coming from and I agree with you on a moral level but I think you also need to look deeper. I am by no means saying I agree with suicide bombings but let’s look at the facts here. You can never compare a Palestinian extremist with an Israeli Extremist. Palestine is the occupied Land and Israel is the occupation, under International Law any country has the right to defend its self and resist forced occupation. As a person I look up to once said, "In a dirty war people will fight dirty" this is by no means an excuse but is the case. You cannot expect a land of people expelled from their home to all sit down at a table with those who stole from them to discuss a peaceful solution or compromise. Mentioning of suicide bombings at every given opportunity is propaganda instigated by Zionist themselves and is merely a detraction of attention from the advanced form of weaponry used by the IDF and the illegality of their actions, every single day they are breaking international law of refugees right to return, everyday they are ignoring UN advice on the Illegal racist wall of separation. Israel have promoted through the world a mass crusade to deliver the term "anti Semitism" into every humans dictionary. Think about it, no other race have their own terminology to describe discrimination against them. Let us not forget 40,000 Muslims where expelled from 1 city in Bosnia, over 100,000 killed in Iraq, the crusade in Spain...yet there is no direct term to describe racism against Muslims, or Christians, and more surprisingly even black people. The words extremist Terrorism etc have been defined by the west and their true meanings warped. ISRAEL IS AN OCCUPATION OF PALESTINIAN PEOPLES LAND, which if you check the definition of fundamentalist in the dictionary defines the WHOLE sate of Israel as fundamentalist along with every single Israel living in the occupied land. The term Israel should not exist. When a large amount Pakistanis migrated to England in the 60's and created majority Asian communities, the area of land they lived on did not incur any change of reference, yet Israel landed on Palestinian territory created their own Identity and proceeded to attempt to wipe another of the map, by all means live along side Palestinians in peace as equals but in Palestine. Palestinians now have one of the largest percentages of disabilities in the world these are facts and unless they are recognised no progress can be made as it is the most important factor in every Palestinians soul. Imagine your anger, my anger, and then imagine being that anger. Obliviously there are some whose actions are stifling any possibility of progress but they are by no means the majority. Talk to a Palestinian in Palestine and see what they have to say and you'll realise its not as wrong and right.
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    (Original post by Northumbrian)
    The Palestinians have nothing to sacrifice but their very bodies. It's amazing that there have not been more martyrdom operations.
    Goodwill? Moral high ground? Influence? More appropriately targeted violence if they chose?

    It's not the best approach Northu--and according to "Muslim moderates" ( :rolleyes: ) it's a perversion of Islam which guarantees an eternity in Hell.
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    I just read this and this whole thread really makes me happy that I decided tnot to join this society, whenever this subject comes up normally intelligent, decent people become ignorant ****holes!

    At my uni the J-Soc and I-Soc got together to do an event not about who's right and who's wrong(or more wrong) but peace.
    I wish this society could be about the same thing.
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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    It's not the best approach Northu--and according to "Muslim moderates" ( :rolleyes: ) it's a perversion of Islam which guarantees an eternity in Hell.
    No-one can say that, really. We can't claim to know Allah(swt)'s mind.
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    (Original post by ayaan)
    ...normally intelligent, decent people become ignorant ****holes!
    And what about TSRers?
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    I included them in that definition...
    --------------
    Don't make me start on you.
    Why is that you never believe that people mean what they say?


    1,500 posts! Woohoo!

    You officially have no life.
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    At my uni the J-Soc and I-Soc got together to do an event not about who's right and who's wrong(or more wrong) but peace.
    I wish this society could be about the same thing.
    What you mean One Voice?

    How can you expect an occupied people, a raped people to have goodwill for the occupier and the rapist? Don't you think the Palestinians would attack soldiers if they had the means? And it's not as if they never target soldier guarded outposts and checkpoints.
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    I'm not talking about the Palestinians and Israelis, I'm talking about you, the people on TSR.
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    (Original post by ayaan)
    I just read this and this whole thread really makes me happy that I decided tnot to join this society, whenever this subject comes up normally intelligent, decent people become ignorant ****holes!
    so what do you propose? not discuss the subject at all instead attend JSOC and I-Soc events promoting peace. Im glad you havent joined because it requires intelligent decent people, you on the other hand seem a liitle ignorant. a peice of advice why dont you try checking up the definition pesce then reading about the situation in Palestine and then getting back to me on how you propose this "peace". Please enlighten us all. Of course its about who right and wrong. If some one stole your money are you goning to not concentrate on the thief?

    (Original post by ayaan)
    At my uni the J-Soc and I-Soc got together to do an event not about who's right and who's wrong(or more wrong) but peace.
    I wish this society could be about the same thing.

    Are you actually promoting JSOC??? ISOC never get politically involved and just tiptoe around trying not to offend anyone, JSOC on the other hand merge politics and religion. At my university they called for a mobilisation of all Jews on campus to attend the AGM (Anual General Meeting, where students exersise their right to democracy by passing motions) so as to block a motion being passed on the right to Education system at Palestinian University!!! is that peace??? This motion was backed by the Union Council but was voted against because 200 JSOC members turned up! Then they all walked out laughing so that the AGM could not continue and none of the other motions could be voted on including Civil Liberties! And how many ISOC members were present? No more then 15!!! Get your facts straight and remove yourself from your holier then thou thrown and you might just realise where the real problem lies.
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    (Original post by mesoptamia)
    so what do you propose? not discuss the subject at all instead attend JSOC and I-Soc events promoting peace..
    Yes, discussing it in an internet forum is going to change the world(especially the way that it's being discussed here, personal attacks and outright racism/predjudice)! You keep going with that.

    (Original post by mesoptamia)
    Im glad you havent joined because it requires intelligent decent people, you on the other hand seem a liitle ignorant..
    Maybe I am a little ignorant, why don't you enlighten me?

    (Original post by mesoptamia)
    a peice of advice why dont you try checking up the definition pesce
    Definitions of pesce on the Web:

    [Italian] fish
    .

    I do realise what you're talking about now but I actually googled this before I'd realised. So I thought that I'd share.

    (Original post by mesoptamia)
    then reading about the situation in Palestine and then getting back to me on how you propose this "peace". Please enlighten us all. Of course its about who right and wrong. If some one stole your money are you goning to not concentrate on the thief?
    Well my first proposal would be that *****ing about J-Soc isn't the way to go about it. It may shock you but:

    a)Jews are people too.
    b)J-Socs do have non-Israel related things to do and
    c)Plenty of Jewish people are anti-zionist, wouldn't it be better to join in with them rather than tarring all jews with the same brush?

    (Original post by mesoptamia)
    Are you actually promoting JSOC???
    Well the J-Soc(and I-Soc) on TSR are clearly more worthwile than your society(based on content.

    (Original post by mesoptamia)
    ISOC never get politically involved and just tiptoe around trying not to offend anyone, JSOC on the other hand merge politics and religion.
    Generalisation.

    (Original post by mesoptamia)
    At my university they called for a mobilisation of all Jews on campus to attend the AGM (Anual General Meeting, where students exersise their right to democracy by passing motions) so as to block a motion being passed on the right to Education system at Palestinian University!!! is that peace??? This motion was backed by the Union Council but was voted against because 200 JSOC members turned up! Then they all walked out laughing so that the AGM could not continue and none of the other motions could be voted on including Civil Liberties! And how many ISOC members were present? No more then 15!!!
    Where do you live/Where's your uni? Maybe there are MORE jewish people than muslims?

    (Original post by mesoptamia)
    Get your facts straight and remove yourself from your holier then thou thrown and you might just realise where the real problem lies.
    What problem?
    My holier than thou attitude?
    Pfft...

    Arrrrgggghhhh!
    I want to like you! I want to like everyone, but you're making it very difficult by responding in such a condescending and generally rude manner!
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    (Original post by mesoptamia)
    I’m sorry I have to interrupt here but what I see is two people who are on the same side bickering. I see where your coming from and I agree with you on a moral level but I think you also need to look deeper. I am by no means saying I agree with suicide bombings but let’s look at the facts here. You can never compare a Palestinian extremist with an Israeli Extremist. Palestine is the occupied Land and Israel is the occupation, under International Law any country has the right to defend its self and resist forced occupation. As a person I look up to once said, "In a dirty war people will fight dirty" this is by no means an excuse but is the case. You cannot expect a land of people expelled from their home to all sit down at a table with those who stole from them to discuss a peaceful solution or compromise. Mentioning of suicide bombings at every given opportunity is propaganda instigated by Zionist themselves and is merely a detraction of attention from the advanced form of weaponry used by the IDF and the illegality of their actions, every single day they are breaking international law of refugees right to return, everyday they are ignoring UN advice on the Illegal racist wall of separation. Israel have promoted through the world a mass crusade to deliver the term "anti Semitism" into every humans dictionary. Think about it, no other race have their own terminology to describe discrimination against them. Let us not forget 40,000 Muslims where expelled from 1 city in Bosnia, over 100,000 killed in Iraq, the crusade in Spain...yet there is no direct term to describe racism against Muslims, or Christians, and more surprisingly even black people. The words extremist Terrorism etc have been defined by the west and their true meanings warped. ISRAEL IS AN OCCUPATION OF PALESTINIAN PEOPLES LAND, which if you check the definition of fundamentalist in the dictionary defines the WHOLE sate of Israel as fundamentalist along with every single Israel living in the occupied land. The term Israel should not exist. When a large amount Pakistanis migrated to England in the 60's and created majority Asian communities, the area of land they lived on did not incur any change of reference, yet Israel landed on Palestinian territory created their own Identity and proceeded to attempt to wipe another of the map, by all means live along side Palestinians in peace as equals but in Palestine. Palestinians now have one of the largest percentages of disabilities in the world these are facts and unless they are recognised no progress can be made as it is the most important factor in every Palestinians soul. Imagine your anger, my anger, and then imagine being that anger. Obliviously there are some whose actions are stifling any possibility of progress but they are by no means the majority. Talk to a Palestinian in Palestine and see what they have to say and you'll realise its not as wrong and right.
    save it. i've heard every argument before and debated this a darned more times than you i would warrant. i simply don't want to get into it all again.
    my point was not referring to the palestinians doing the suicide bombings. but those controlling it all. do you think they are sitting in poverty like the rest of them? do you think their aims are entirely altruistic?
    no. many of them are no better than the ultra-nationalist zionists. im not talking soldiers drafted into the idf, i mean the ones like the lad who shot up arabs on a bus. (and died soon after ).
    these people don't do what they do for love of their own people - they do it for hate of the other people. and with them around there will never be peace.

    You might view this post as arrogant, but i would be willing to bet my life i know more on this topic than 99% of the people here. I can recite the relevant UN directives, qoutes on each side, landmark events etc.
    I started out neutral. then i went heavily towards the palestinian cause. but the more knowledgable i get the more i realise that the palestinian cause is tainted and hijacked by people who have no love for them, just hate for jews.
    one would be wise to always ensure not to fall into that trap. some of the jews of israel deserve contempt. but the vast majority like themajoprity of palestinians are innocent men and women trying to live their lives in peace.
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    (Original post by ayaan)
    Yes, discussing it in an internet forum is going to change the world(especially the way that it's being discussed here, personal attacks and outright racism/predjudice)! You keep going with that.
    This Forum is Read by many people, some neutral, it wont change the world but if it changes one persons opinion then that will do me just fine, what is your big problem with that, why are you so against a PSG? this is form of education and debate if you dont like it why are you getting involved?

    (Original post by ayaan)

    Maybe I am a little ignorant, why don't you enlighten me?
    Im sure you have noticed I have used YOUR words, mainly to point out the offence it can cause.


    In 1947 a mandate was created to partition the Land of the Palestinians to create a Jewish state.
    1948 Palestinians where massacred in their thousand, in the beggining of the formation of "Medinat Israel" the state of Israel, a zionist movement - the colonial nationalist faction arising to establish a Jewish homeland in Palestine which is concerned with the support of the state of Israel.

    READ IT AGAIN. PALESTINE IS ONE OF THE GREATEST INJUSTICES ON THIS PLANET, and its biggest problem is muslims glossing over the inhumanity inflicted on Palestinians. Fair enough it you dont want to join but your a muslim and you are leaving messages critisizing the PALESTINIAN SOLIDARITY GROUP. Go and read some books because it took me hell of alot of time speaking to people reading and listening to get a slight grasp of the enormity of the situation.


    (Original post by ayaan)

    Definitions of pesce on the Web:

    [Italian] fish
    .

    I do realise what you're talking about now but I actually googled this before I'd realised. So I thought that I'd share.
    hilarious.

    (Original post by ayaan)

    Well my first proposal would be that *****ing about J-Soc isn't the way to go about it. It may shock you but:

    a)Jews are people too.
    b)J-Socs do have non-Israel related things to do and
    c)Plenty of Jewish people are anti-zionist, wouldn't it be better to join in with them rather than tarring all jews with the same brush?

    You tell me not to ***** about the JSOC but you feel free to ***** about the PSG. lol hypocracy in its greatest form maybe being an ISoc member you should print of our conversation give it to your Imaam and see what he thinks hmm? maybe you should print of our conversation and read your Hadith, no? to scared you may read about the one where there will come a day when muslims will be many but useless? maybe you should join the JSOC Im sure theyd welcome you.

    I know Jews are people but thanks for pointing that out anyway. A Jew is not just defined as religion but as a race, critisism of the JSOC is not a critique of Jews, for your information if you had actually bothered to join any PSG Soc you may have realised we do work with many Anti Zionists and refusniks and I personally know and respect many of these brave people, but once again thank you for attempting to educate me. At the end of the day 95% or more of Jews in Israel are Zionists, and the same goes for the JSOC and if you ask them they will tell you just as much


    (Original post by ayaan)
    Well the J-Soc(and I-Soc) on TSR are clearly more worthwhile than your society(based on content.
    **sigh** I give in just Join them goddamit they need your support more then the Palestinians. You have officially made me loose all hope in the world.

    (Original post by ayaan)
    Where do you live/Where's your uni? Maybe there are MORE jewish people than muslims?
    Nice try the ISOC is the biggest Society on campus with a ridiculous amount members. a free Iftar (braking of ones fast) was held and around 400 people turned up. the situation is reflected the world over with Jews holding less the 1% of the population where as muslims are 13%. If palestine is neglected on a world scale I guess it would be naive to think it wouldn't be the case on a smaller scale.



    (Original post by ayaan)
    What problem?
    My holier than thou attitude?
    Pfft...

    Im asuming your "Pfft..." is an indication that you feel I may be contradicting my self in my method of response to you. Please may remind you that is was you who came on the forum preaching of how we should make daisey chains with the JSoc, me and my peers out of our own free will spend alot of our time with very little sleep, eating sleeping and dreaming Iraq and Palestine, in more ways then you think, PEACEFUL ways so for you to come on here singing the praises of ISOC and JSOC whilst lambasting the PSG is like a kick in the stomach. Seriously you have obviously never spoken to a palestinian before or if you have Im sure you have never voiced your disdain for the PSG.

    (Original post by ayaan)
    Arrrrgggghhhh!
    I want to like you! I want to like everyone, but you're making it very difficult by responding in such a condescending and generally rude manner!
    many have told me about this apparent "condescending manner" I dont see it...
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    Lets quit all this talk and argument ok...now lets focus on something important for example the wall....What sort of events are u ppl gonna do to help fight that wall?????
    Im gonna start a campaign against motorola products coz we found out that they supply the israeli government with the tools to build that damned wall...May the holy land return to the palestinians and may we jews, muslims and christians live in peace together
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    (Original post by Navindu)
    yes thats right. every single palestinian is ompletely innocent of any crime, and every single israeli deserves what is coming to them.

    And you wonder why people won't take you seriously, and why some like myself would rather you not try to help fight our cause.
    Someone negatively repped this with a comment
    'extreme on both ends'.

    I don't think that person is very bright...
 
 
 
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