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    (Original post by Sazzle)
    Yay,

    The media are spouting a lot of nonsense about this at the moment, until you have been hunting it's hard to comment on this. By banning it the countryside will have more problems to face than just a fox problem.
    there are alternatives to hunting foxes, i see that fox populations need to be controled but to use hounds to chase them and rip them to shreds? its not about effective population control its about sport and fun...and its sick
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    (Original post by MattG)
    but do we have the right to end a persons way of life/tradition? people in the countryside must be getting pissed off at these city living animal rights protestors who have no idea of their tradition and the impact foxes can have on their living (farming etc)
    Yeah. The fluffy bunny brigade! Simpering idiots.
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    (Original post by kikzen)
    but you say nay.
    so i cant explore the other argument?
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    (Original post by MattG)
    so i cant explore the other argument?
    well its just unexpected, is all.

    most people just stick to their side and thats that.
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    As previously said there are more humane ways of controlling the problem than ripping the foxes to pieces for sport.
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    (Original post by kikzen)
    well its just unexpected, is all.

    most people just stick to their side and thats that.
    true but by exploring the other side you can strengthen your own argument, im just putting in material for people to bounce their own ideas/arguments against

    *ive had this argument hundreds of times at school and sixth form so im pretty well informed :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by viviki)
    As previously said there are more humane ways of controlling the problem than ripping the foxes to pieces for sport.
    for example?
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    (Original post by kikzen)
    for example?
    Traps, bait, shooting them outright.
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    (Original post by curryADD)
    really? how so?

    The decline of rural activities. The farmers lose the income from the hunts. Think of the number of hounds owned by the hunts - what do we do with them, what about the kennel masters employed by the hunts - unemployed.

    And do we really think Tony Blair is capable of finding a suitable alternative to control the foxes - I think not.

    I used to be anti-hunting despite being a 'horsey person' until I went a few years ago, it is a fantastic activity and a real countryside tradition.

    Anyway if you care to read a copy of Horse and Hound you may see the other problem, how are the government going to enforce this ban, each week many letters are received from people who are willing to risk jail to carry on hunting - where are they going to put the 1000s of supporters. Even non-riders are willing to take it up to defy Tony. As I sit here typing I notice the article 'Why I will saddle up for hunting' by Noel Edmonds.

    At the recent declaration day meet, 1000s of signatures in protest were received, all these people pledging to continue hunting despite a ban.

    Landowners are providing support too, pledging that hunts may use their land even if it will incriminate them - so if they still support it, there must be some good in it.


    Anyway the ban doesn't come into force here and even if it did I can still hunt in the South!
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    (Original post by viviki)
    As previously said there are more humane ways of controlling the problem than ripping the foxes to pieces for sport.
    but thats more FUN!
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    Out of interest Sazzle, do you yourself live in a rural location?
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    (Original post by Alec)
    Out of interest Sazzle, do you yourself live in a rural location?
    Not really, I live in a suburban area but keep my horse in the country - I would love to live in the countryside though.

    Why do you ask?
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    (Original post by Alec)
    Traps, bait, shooting them outright.
    Traps - so what about other animals or hell, people that could get caught in them?
    Bait - again, what about the other animals, and if it's close enough to water it could affect a much wider area
    Shooting them outright - well, what about the foxes that dont actually die. they just get hit and bleed to death.

    these are all more humane, eh?
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    (Original post by kikzen)
    Traps - so what about other animals or hell, people that could get caught in them?
    Bait - again, what about the other animals, and if it's close enough to water it could affect a much wider area
    Shooting them outright - well, what about the foxes that dont actually die. they just get hit and bleed to death.

    these are all more humane, eh?


    Yeah, and how do you catch them - I can't see a few blokes running around after endless fields trying to outwit a fox - it's not going to happen.

    Why stop an effective programme that GENERATES income and people enjoy?
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    (Original post by Sazzle)
    Yeah, and how do you catch them - I can't see a few blokes running around after endless fields trying to outwit a fox - it's not going to happen.

    Why stop an effective programme that GENERATES income and people enjoy?
    because there are bloody animal rights activists in the world, and they CARE about the foxes....
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    (Original post by Sazzle)
    Not really, I live in a suburban area but keep my horse in the country - I would love to live in the countryside though.

    Why do you ask?
    Comments like...

    (Original post by Sazzle)
    a real countryside tradition.
    and...

    (Original post by Sazzle)
    Landowners are providing support too, pledging that hunts may use their land even if it will incriminate them
    Both, for the main part are untrue.

    Fox hunting is not a country tradition, it is the preserve of the upper middle and upper classes (the type who own Range Rovers but never go off road).

    I think you'll find a majority of farmers view hunts as a nuisance when they come on to their land. Ten or so galloping horses can cause significant damage.

    I have a friend whose father is a farmer, and despite not agreeing for hunts to come on to this land, they have in the past.
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    How can any law be enforced? There are plenty of people who try to ignore the law, if they get caught they could be fined or face jail.


    In Australia they have been introducing a contraceptive vaccine for foxes, which is placed inside bait. I believe that although it is in its early stages they think that it is going to be quite an effective solution to the fox problem.

    Although it is still disputed the RSPCA survey did show that after the foxhunting ban which occured during foot and mouth, there was no significant increase in the fox population. This would indicate that foxhunting does not alter the fox population it is merely a sport.
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    (Original post by curryADD)
    because there are bloody animal rights activists in the world, and they CARE about the foxes....

    And what about the chickens, sheep and children's pets THEY kill. Until a more humane AND effective method is offered hunting is the best way.
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    (Original post by Sazzle)
    And what about the chickens, sheep and children's pets THEY kill. Until a more humane AND effective method is offered hunting is the best way.
    exactly.....
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    I agree with that I also know people who are farmers and are against the hunt but have had their land used without permission. It does create damage.

    As for the enjoyment factor, you are saying that it is fine to watch an animal suffer because it is for enjoyment. If I took your pet and smashed its head up against a wall would that be ok because I enjoyed it. I hardly think so, it is illegal I could face a prison sentence and would probably be banned from keeping animals ever again. Why is that any different?
 
 
 
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