Turn on thread page Beta
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Jools)
    At the end of the day I would consider Law as vocational rather than academic - the vast vast majority of people doing Law at Oxford or Cambridge are doing it to become a good solicitor or barrister, many of whom are targetting the Magic Circle or the prestigious Inns. For this, it matters not a jot which uni has more 5*A RAE ratings. Cambridge getting more 1sts however is something that prospective applicants may want to take note of; I'd assume here its more down to the individual. If someone is prepared to work consistently hard for 3yrs they should be able to get a 1st in their Prelims and Finals - it seems more down to the ability to memorise multiple cases and terms than raw intelligence. A lot of people I know who got 1sts in Prelims and were looking at achieving a 1st in finals have now completely slacked off because their Magic Circle TC's have popped through the letterbox...
    You sound like you are describing the CPE! At Oxbridge, law is not vocational. You certainly don't get a first by learning cases and terms. Learning the law at Oxbridge means learning how to approach law, how to reason with law, the context in which law operates, socio-legal / jurisprudential theory, etc.

    This is why research matters - you are so much better off being taught by a person who is actively looking at the direction of law, how it might develop and where it fits into the bigger picture. Research-active tutors also impart a way of thinking about the law rather than just the substane of the law.

    When it comes to practice, especially as a barrister, you need to go further than answering the simple question 'what does the law say about X' and be able to reason around difficult cases, constructing a persuasive argument about the general direction of the law and why the law should develop in a particular way.

    Cambridge has been out-performing Oxford in terms of firsts for a few years, so I think it is more a trend rather than inviduals (although the difference is quite small: Avg firsts for 2000-3 (%) Cam 18% Ox 14%). I can't see any reason why 'slacking off' after offers would affect Oxford more than Cambridge, so I don't see that that is a relevant factor in explaining the difference in performance.

    But, anyway, I'll reiterate my point: Oxford cannot be said to be better than Cambridge at Law (as was suggested in this thread seemingly because law is a 'non-science' and therefore can't be a Cambridge speciality).

    Just in passing - people would be aiming for a prestigious chambers, not a prestigious Inn of Court. The four Inns admit anyone of good character who passes the appropriate exams.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by jcw)
    You sound like you are describing the CPE! At Oxbridge, law is not vocational. You certainly don't get a first by learning cases and terms. Learning the law at Oxbridge means learning how to approach law, how to reason with law, the context in which law operates, socio-legal / jurisprudential theory, etc.
    Hmm, people's revision for Law Prelims seemed to be focussed a lot more around memorising cases. When I was helping with revision it was often me naming a case and them parrot-fashion reiterating what happened in it, or in Roman Law explaining a term. I suppose how to approach and reason in an essay is something more fundamental.
    (Original post by jcw)
    I can't see any reason why 'slacking off' after offers would affect Oxford more than Cambridge, so I don't see that that is a relevant factor in explaining the difference in performance.
    The 'slacking off' thing was a side-comment; I was trying to suggest, though don't have evidence for this, that at Oxford it's a lot more down to the individual than Cambridge. If you want to get a 1st you'll get one. But outside the most academic colleges where they'll threaten to kick you out if you're not up to scratch, if you can't be bothered then it's viewed as your problem, not the tutor's. At the end of the day one's own prospects are a lot more important than a college's Norrington table position going up or down one as a result. Would I be correct in assuming at Cambridge if someone's not up to scratch the tutors will be more ready to make them get their finger out?
    (Original post by jcw)
    But, anyway, I'll reiterate my point: Oxford cannot be said to be better than Cambridge at Law
    Has anyone tried to say it is? Except The Guardian, whose tables are an absolute joke that have resulted in Middlesex Uni, ranked 80th everywhere else, splash "We're A Top 20 University!" posters across London. At the end of the day all of the differences that have been highlighted are minimal - like in that Worldwide Uni League Table, the top 10 are as good as each other. Regarding prospects the two places are identical if you put in the same amount of work.
    (Original post by jcw)
    Just in passing - people would be aiming for a prestigious chambers, not a prestigious Inn of Court. The four Inns admit anyone of good character who passes the appropriate exams.
    Sorry - I'm not a lawyer, I got confused as someone I know who's started their BVC course was saying how they'd been accepted by the Grays Inn -Society-.
 
 
 

University open days

  1. University of Oxford
    All undergraduate colleges and departments Undergraduate
    Fri, 14 Sep '18
Poll
How are you feeling in the run-up to Results Day 2018?

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.