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Howard
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#221
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#221
(Original post by pkonline)
As I said before, you may be right. Unemployment may be at a record low. But, you were wrong to attribute this to a minimum wage policy. .
I didn't say the min wage was a cause, merely pointing out that the min wage didn't cause mass unemployment like the Tories thought it would.[/QUOTE]

That's because Labor at the last minute read a book on economics and realizing the folly of their ways backed down from the higher rate of minimum wage that they were toying with introducing and went ahead with introducing a lower one; one that approximated to what the free market would have provided in any case.
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happysunshine
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#222
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#222
(Original post by YouKnewThat!)
No not this thread, but it was to do with bad mouthing the Tories!
Well I think it is a bit ridiculous really. Everyone can have their own oppinions. I swear this Tory supporting thing is becoming like a club which instantly gives its members the impression that they are sophisticated and intelligent. But this isn't the case.
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pkonline
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#223
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#223
(Original post by Howard)
I didn't say the min wage was a cause, merely pointing out that the min wage didn't cause mass unemployment like the Tories thought it would.

That's because Labor at the last minute read a book on economics and realizing the folly of their ways backed down from the higher rate of minimum wage that they were toying with introducing and went ahead with introducing a lower one; one that approximated to what the free market would have provided in any case.
That seems sensible; to start with a lower wage to see the result, and then steadily increase it over time.

Its called careful planning.
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YouKnewThat!
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#224
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#224
(Original post by happysunshine)
Well I think it is a bit ridiculous really. Everyone can have their own oppinions. I swear this Tory supporting thing is becoming like a club which instantly gives its members the impression that they are sophisticated and intelligent. But this isn't the case.
Yep.
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Elle
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#225
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#225
(Original post by happysunshine)
Well I think it is a bit ridiculous really. Everyone can have their own oppinions. I swear this Tory supporting thing is becoming like a club which instantly gives its members the impression that they are sophisticated and intelligent. But this isn't the case.
Lol.. I think it has the opposite impression..
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Howard
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#226
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#226
(Original post by pkonline)
People are entitled to extra money if they live on a low income. I see it as everyone contributing to each and others well being .

Well, it isn't "everyone contributing to each and others well being" It's one class of people subsidizing another class of people. This is a one way street. There's no quid pro quo here.
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happysunshine
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#227
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#227
(Original post by Howard)
Well, it isn't "everyone contributing to each and others well being" It's one class of people subsidizing another class of people. This is a one way street. There's no quid pro quo here.
Most people loose out. Our country will not become better unless people are living above a certain standard.
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Howard
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#228
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#228
(Original post by pkonline)
That seems sensible; to start with a lower wage to see the result, and then steadily increase it over time.

Its called careful planning.
It's seems a waste of time. As you can never increase the minimum wage rate to beyond what the free market would provide without job losses what you call "careful planning" is just trial and error.

Minimum wages are a policy decision and not an economic one. Looks great in a manifesto (to anyone who's understanding of economics is the same as the average 3rd grader), but that's about it.
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Howard
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#229
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#229
(Original post by happysunshine)
Most people loose out. Our country will not become better unless people are living above a certain standard.
And how is this to be achieved?
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happysunshine
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#230
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#230
(Original post by Howard)
And how is this to be achieved?
By having a good rate of employment and social security. However those who are claming benefits or the dole should be forced to do community service. When people are above the suitable standard of living, then people can be as rich as they like.
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pkonline
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#231
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#231
(Original post by Howard)
Well, it isn't "everyone contributing to each and others well being" It's one class of people subsidizing another class of people. This is a one way street. There's no quid pro quo here.
It isn't a one-way thing. Most people have times in their lives where they are affluent and times of poverty. The state is there to help them when times are hard e.g. early parenthood, retired etc...

It's seems a waste of time. As you can never increase the minimum wage rate to beyond what the free market would provide without job losses what you call "careful planning" is just trial and error.

Minimum wages are a policy decision and not an economic one. Looks great in a manifesto (to anyone who's understanding of economics is the same as the average 3rd grader), but that's about it.
Not trial and error. Yes if the min wage is very high then of course there will be job losses, but a moderate wage would have a very positive impact on many of the lowest incomed families! I've seen this first hand because my mum works for min wage. If it wasn't there she'd have no choice but to work for less. The min wage sets out a clear message that there is a basic standard of living.
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preyingmantis
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#232
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#232
(Original post by pkonline)
It isn't a one-way thing. Most people have times in their lives where they are affluent and times of poverty. The state is there to help them when times are hard e.g. early parenthood, retired etc...



Not trial and error. Yes if the min wage is very high then of course there will be job losses, but a moderate wage would have a very positive impact on many of the lowest incomed families! I've seen this first hand because my mum works for min wage. If it wasn't there she'd have no choice but to work for less. The min wage sets out a clear message that there is a basic standard of living.
affluent is a relative thing
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pkonline
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#233
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#233
(Original post by preyingmantis)
affluent is a relative thing
That's very true; goes back to an earlier point I made about absolute and relative poverty.
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JSM
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#234
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#234
(Original post by pkonline)
It isn't a one-way thing. Most people have times in their lives where they are affluent and times of poverty. The state is there to help them when times are hard e.g. early parenthood, retired etc...



Not trial and error. Yes if the min wage is very high then of course there will be job losses, but a moderate wage would have a very positive impact on many of the lowest incomed families! I've seen this first hand because my mum works for min wage. If it wasn't there she'd have no choice but to work for less. The min wage sets out a clear message that there is a basic standard of living.
Min wage does not make economic sense, ill argue it 2morro


why should there be a basic standard of living? But isnt it more worrying that some people care more about animals than about people, ie their 40 cats and leave the homeless man starving.
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pkonline
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#235
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#235
(Original post by JSM)
why should there be a basic standard of living? But isnt it more worrying that some people care more about animals than about people, ie their 40 cats and leave the homeless man starving.
There should be a basic standard of living because we all belong to a society where we all have rights and responsibilties for each other.
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LH
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#236
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#236
(Original post by serendipity)
MH isn't out of touch. He has his finger on the button

Seriously, I reckon that Tony Blair will resign before the next election - he is too much of a liability for Labour - and the deputy PM will fill his shoes...God help us
no, it will be Gordon B.
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JSM
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#237
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#237
(Original post by pkonline)
There should be a basic standard of living because we all belong to a society where we all have rights and responsibilties for each other.
why should our society have basic rights and responsibilities, question it every time you have an answer. There is no reason
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deadflower1984
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#238
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#238
(Original post by Bhaal85)
Well, thats a generalisation if ever I seen one.
May be a generalisation, but aren't the conservative party awful! Not that the Labour party are much better. They're so smarmy, particularly Nigel Evans, who looks like a hamster.
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LH
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#239
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#239
(Original post by deadflower1984)
May be a generalisation, but aren't the conservative party awful! Not that the Labour party are much better. They're so smarmy, particularly Nigel Evans, who looks like a hamster.
I met Nigel Evans yesterday! He came into our school. He seemed like quite a nice man.
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Muse
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#240
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#240
(Original post by deadflower1984)
May be a generalisation, but aren't the conservative party awful! Not that the Labour party are much better. They're so smarmy, particularly Nigel Evans, who looks like a hamster.
Maybe tomorrow you'll get around to putting points across which use facts and informed opinions, not just name calling and disagreeing with everything which doesn't fall into your scope of politics - you never know.
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