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JSM
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#341
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#341
(Original post by ZJuwelH)
Don't use 'therefore' as if all non-Christians disagree with morals. That would offend us. Even atheists and agnostics do agree with morals.
morals are based on christian ideals
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TK
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#342
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#342
(Original post by JSM)
morals are based on christian ideals
aren't there any other religions they're based on?
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Juwel
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#343
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#343
(Original post by JSM)
well the public shouldnt give it the capacity, but they will and nothing canachange that apart from perception changes
Or ticket and shirt prices.
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JSM
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#344
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#344
(Original post by pkonline)
The welfare state is soo important for the proper functioning of society. By getting rid of it, how will people ever be able to better themselves?
well if the welfare state continues, look at advances in medicine and cost, eventually all the private sector will do is fund the public and that wont work because then companies have no incentive. So it all gets ****ed up
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JSM
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#345
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#345
(Original post by Tinykates)
aren't there any other religions they're based on?
there is some other input, but what most people base their morals on would be christina/ protectign the weak ideas
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Juwel
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#346
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#346
(Original post by JSM)
there is some other input, but what most people base their morals on would be christina/ protectign the weak ideas
So why do most religions have similar morals? Did they all hack Christian ideas? Hinduism is the world's oldest religion but did it take the idea of morals from Christianity?
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pkonline
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#347
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#347
(Original post by JSM)
well if the welfare state continues, look at advances in medicine and cost, eventually all the private sector will do is fund the public and that wont work because then companies have no incentive. So it all gets ****ed up
I don't understand the point; how will the private sector end up funding the public?!?!
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Hannah
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#348
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#348
(Original post by JSM)
morals are based on christian ideals
no the basic moral ideas span all religions.
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Howard
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#349
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#349
(Original post by happysunshine)
More than $50k obviously, but isn't he worth £34 million? And yet our doctors who I personally think do more for society can only earn up to £70k a year.
Well, reluctantly I disagree with you. Mr.Fuller, although I'm sure unintentionally, actually contributes a lot more to society than your local GP.

Ask yourself: What might Spice Girls record sales, concerts, promotions, mechandizing have generated in the UK alone in a one or two year peroiod? I havn't a clue but let humor me if you will and let me take a wild stab in the dark...........let's say $100million.

Well, all these goodies are luxury items aren't they? Don't we pay VAT on this? So that's a cool $16 million pouring into state coffers. Even Fuller would have to pay some tax on his massive earnnings, (although most of it probably got banked in the Grand Caymans) Let's say he got stumped for another $1million.

So there's a $17million contribution to society made by Mr.Fuller just in that short period. How many doctors, even paid at the higher rate of $70k did he pay for that year? 242. That's a mid sized hospital full of them isn't it?

OK, I admit that I'm just screwing around with numbers that I can't be bothered to research but do you see my point? Still think your local GP who sits in his clinic issuing sick notes to the same faces week after week after week gives as much to society as the likes of Fuller? I think not!
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Howard
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#350
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#350
This is a good thread people. Please don't screw it up by bringing religion into it!!
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Eru Iluvatar
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#351
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#351
(Original post by Hannah)
no the basic moral ideas span all religions.
And morals aren't always religiously based at all.
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Howard
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#352
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#352
(Original post by pkonline)
The welfare state is soo important for the proper functioning of society. By getting rid of it, how will people ever be able to better themselves?
Are you sure about this? America is legendary for tales of immigrants coming to this country with a suitcase and building up Empires (or at least doing very nicely)

These immigrants still come here because they believe they will be able to "better themselves" through hard work, guts, business acumen, (and a bit of luck) and not because America has a burgeoning welfare state.
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Vienna
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#353
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#353
(Original post by Howard)
Are you sure about this? America is legendary for tales of immigrants coming to this country with a suitcase and building up Empires (or at least doing very nicely)

These immigrants still come here because they believe they will be able to "better themselves" through hard work, guts, business acumen, (and a bit of luck) and not because America has a burgeoning welfare state.
exactly, a minimal state encourages growth, development and independence..
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Howard
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#354
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#354
(Original post by vienna95)
exactly, a minimal state encourages growth, development and independence..
Absolutely.
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happysunshine
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#355
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#355
(Original post by Howard)
Well, reluctantly I disagree with you. Mr.Fuller, although I'm sure unintentionally, actually contributes a lot more to society than your local GP.

Ask yourself: What might Spice Girls record sales, concerts, promotions, mechandizing have generated in the UK alone in a one or two year peroiod? I havn't a clue but let humor me if you will and let me take a wild stab in the dark...........let's say $100million.

Well, all these goodies are luxury items aren't they? Don't we pay VAT on this? So that's a cool $16 million pouring into state coffers. Even Fuller would have to pay some tax on his massive earnnings, (although most of it probably got banked in the Grand Caymans) Let's say he got stumped for another $1million.

So there's a $17million contribution to society made by Mr.Fuller just in that short period. How many doctors, even paid at the higher rate of $70k did he pay for that year? 242. That's a mid sized hospital full of them isn't it?

OK, I admit that I'm just screwing around with numbers that I can't be bothered to research but do you see my point? Still think your local GP who sits in his clinic issuing sick notes to the same faces week after week after week gives as much to society as the likes of Fuller? I think not!
I see your point...
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pkonline
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#356
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#356
The US still has some sort of welfare state.

Say we didn't have one. Then the rich would be the ones with access to education, health etc and will have plenty to retire on, whereas those on low incomes would have nothing.
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JSM
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#357
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#357
(Original post by ZJuwelH)
So why do most religions have similar morals? Did they all hack Christian ideas? Hinduism is the world's oldest religion but did it take the idea of morals from Christianity?
i can not state for sure, but the foundations are very similar, so probably yes although as always inspiration is gained from many ideas
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JSM
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#358
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#358
(Original post by pkonline)
I don't understand the point; how will the private sector end up funding the public?!?!
Because the public sector will get more and more expensive and as such will have to appropriate more and more funds from the private until it is total. Long before which we will have a totalitarian state.
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JSM
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#359
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#359
(Original post by Hannah)
no the basic moral ideas span all religions.
no, morals are based mainly on christian ideals, where do the modern idea of morals (tend to) first originate. In European countries, based upon christianity. But many religions share huge amounts in common (most including totalitariansim) so it would be partially true to say that.
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JSM
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#360
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#360
(Original post by Iluvatar)
And morals aren't always religiously based at all.
well what would you state as morals, they share many similar convictions to certain religions.
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