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Safraaz
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#121
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#121
(Original post by jndikum)
No..on another thread she was like..yea I got 32% black..way too much and she hinted racism on other threads too..
ignore any racist comments, they're ignorant. BLACK AMBITIONS a good thing.
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JSM
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#122
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#122
(Original post by Safraaz)
ignore any racist comments, they're ignorant. BLACK AMBITIONS a good thing.
ambition is a good thing
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Vienna
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#123
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#123
(Original post by Sire)
Sorry, but I should point out jealousflesh that viena95 practially owns that avatar, and you've decided to make your first post on a thread in which she is almost single handedly defeating anyone who dares to post a controversial comment.
good point. and i look alot better, dont u think?
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Howard
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#124
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#124
(Original post by atom)
You say that 95 times out of a 100 a white person will be picked over an equally qualified black person. I doubt very much that this is the case (and I certainly hope that it is not so). I'm sure the statistics that you are reading do not take everything into account, but please post a link to the source of them.
What "mechanism" do you suggest in the case of two equally qualified people, one "black", one "white"? Just out of interest, who would you pick between two identical candidates?
Well, if there are 100 applicants, 5 black, and 95 white, but all equally qualified, then surely statistically speaking there's a 95% chance that the white person will get the job isn't there?
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Howard
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#125
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#125
(Original post by Safraaz)
ignore any racist comments, they're ignorant. BLACK AMBITIONS a good thing.
I don't see why "black ambition" should be singled out for special treatment. What next? "Blind" ambition, "Left handed ambition"?
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Vienna
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#126
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#126
(Original post by Howard)
I don't see why "black ambition" should be singled out for special treatment. What next? "Blind" ambition, "Left handed ambition"?
hehe, the permutations are endless.
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JabberJaw
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#127
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#127
(Original post by Howard)
I don't see why "black ambition" should be singled out for special treatment.

I dont think it was singled out for special treatment.The achievements of black people should be marginalized.
There are plenty of ambitious black people you just dont see them being paraded on tv programs.
As a minority at times you have to try twice as hard to get the same kind of deal as our european counterparts.


Sayin that they should do a program on "Ginga Ambition"



Its all good
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Howard
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#128
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#128
(Original post by JabberJaw)
I dont think it was singled out for special treatment.The achievements of black people should be marginalized.
There are plenty of ambitious black people you just dont see them being paraded on tv programs.
As a minority at times you have to try twice as hard to get the same kind of deal as our european counterparts.


Sayin that they should do a program on "Ginga Ambition"



Its all good
Well, two points to make here.

Firstly, I think it is nonsense to say that minorities have to try twice as hard as europeans to get the same kind of deal. It has certainly been true in the past, but just isn't true today.

More importantly though, I really find shows like "black ambition" actually insulting towards black people. What for example is this show trying to suggest......that it is so rare for a black person to have ambition that we really ought make a TV documentary about it?

And what are we the viewers supposed to conclude? "Oh look, goodness me, black people are ambitious after all"?

There are a lot of very smart, black folks. They don't need patronizing.
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yawn1
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#129
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#129
Wouldn't it be great if we could all be made to change skins for 6 months?

Perhaps then we could appreciate why we have such varying slants on this subject.
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pkonline
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#130
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#130
(Original post by Howard)
Well, two points to make here.

Firstly, I think it is nonsense to say that minorities have to try twice as hard as europeans to get the same kind of deal. It has certainly been true in the past, but just isn't true today.
Racism has certainly decreased overall, but there are still institutions and communities that are racist, some even more than ever.

There are very few non-white people in the top jobs in this country.
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Howard
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#131
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#131
(Original post by pkonline)
Racism has certainly decreased overall, but there are still institutions and communities that are racist, some even more than ever.

There are very few non-white people in the top jobs in this country.
Well there should'nt be either. If non-white people make up 3 or 4% of the population I wouldn't expect many of them to hold top jobs would you?
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pkonline
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#132
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#132
(Original post by Howard)
Well there should'nt be either. If non-white people make up 3 or 4% of the population I wouldn't expect many of them to hold top jobs would you?
No I wouldn't but minorities make up more than that therefore I'd expect at least a few.
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JabberJaw
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#133
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#133
(Original post by Howard)
Well, two points to make here.

Firstly, I think it is nonsense to say that minorities have to try twice as hard as europeans to get the same kind of deal. It has certainly been true in the past, but just isn't true today.

More importantly though, I really find shows like "black ambition" actually insulting towards black people. What for example is this show trying to suggest......that it is so rare for a black person to have ambition that we really ought make a TV documentary about it?

And what are we the viewers supposed to conclude? "Oh look, goodness me, black people are ambitious after all"?

There are a lot of very smart, black folks. They don't need patronizing.
Howard its not nonsense,flair play i mite not b as bad as it was 20yrs ago but situations like this occur everyday.

I kinda find these kind of programs mite not set out but do
marginalize the achievements of black people.


And what are we the viewers supposed to conclude? "Oh look, goodness me, black people are ambitious after all"?
There are alot of people who still think this way.depending on what part of the globe or england you live.

You never know in another 20-30yrs time we will all be thinking what all the fuss was about.
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yawn1
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#134
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#134
(Original post by Howard)
Well there should'nt be either. If non-white people make up 3 or 4% of the population I wouldn't expect many of them to hold top jobs would you?
But in the US blacks are in a much bigger percentage of the population and are still grossly under-represented in the higher echalons of the business and political spheres.

So where does that leave your reasoning?
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Vienna
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#135
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#135
(Original post by yawn1)
But in the US blacks are in a much bigger percentage of the population and are still grossly under-represented in the higher echalons of the business and political spheres.

So where does that leave your reasoning?
with the socio-economic demographic.
the only black candidate to run for the democrat presidential campaign dropped out before the first primary, because of lack of support.
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Vienna
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#136
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#136
(Original post by pkonline)
No I wouldn't but minorities make up more than that therefore I'd expect at least a few.
the BBC has a 10% minority employment target(everybody else calls it a quota) and they are trying to increase it to 12.5% and beyond. this is over-representative of the nation where minorities represent around 8% of the popn. of course, instead of representing the diversity of the British Isles, the BBC claim that the increasing targets is because they now reflect London-only where the minority popn is around 30%.
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yawn1
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#137
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#137
(Original post by vienna95)
with the socio-economic demographic.
the only black candidate to run for the democrat presidential campaign dropped out before the first primary, because of lack of support.
I'm sure Howard can answer for himself!
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Howard
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#138
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#138
(Original post by yawn1)
But in the US blacks are in a much bigger percentage of the population and are still grossly under-represented in the higher echalons of the business and political spheres.

So where does that leave your reasoning?
My reasoning is simple. If a minority forms 10% we might, all things being equal, expect them to hold roughly 10% of the top jobs.

The fact is, all things are not equal. But this has nothing to do with racism and frankly hasn't for a long time.

Black kids go to the same schools as white kids in the US (and have done since Brown v Board of Education way back when) as they do in the UK. The fact is, in both countries they underperform. Period.

Why? I don't know. But what I do know is that their term papers are NOT deliberately marked down by evil white teachers. They are NOT excluded from the educational feast that is now available to everyone.

Both governments take steps to encourage black participation, set up watchdogs to monitor racism, make anti-discrimination laws, fix quotas for black employment and go even beyond this by introducing affirmative action programs.

So why do blacks do so badly? You tell me.
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yawn1
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#139
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#139
(Original post by Howard)
My reasoning is simple. If a minority forms 10% we might, all things being equal, expect them to hold roughly 10% of the top jobs.

The fact is, all things are not equal. But this has nothing to do with racism and frankly hasn't for a long time.

Black kids go to the same schools as white kids in the US (and have done since Brown v Board of Education way back when) as they do in the UK. The fact is, in both countries they underperform. Period.

Why? I don't know. But what I do know is that their term papers are NOT deliberately marked down by evil white teachers. They are NOT excluded from the educational feast that is now available to everyone.

Both governments take steps to encourage black participation, set up watchdogs to monitor racism, make anti-discrimination laws, fix quotas for black employment and go even beyond this by introducing affirmative action programs.

So why do blacks do so badly? You tell me.
Perhaps because they have been disenfrachised from the electoral procedures in the past on the flimiest of reasons?
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Howard
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#140
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#140
(Original post by yawn1)
Perhaps because they have been disenfrachised from the electoral procedures in the past on the flimiest of reasons?
Yes, but Freedom Summer was way back in 1964 and I don't see how disenfanchisement from the electoral process in the deep South 40 years ago has anything to do with how black kids are underperforming in today's schools.

And that's what we're talking about here. Underperformance in early years that perpetuates itself through adult life. Now tell me. Why?
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