Would scrappng 'mickey mouse degrees' solve the funding crisis? watch

Bannanaman · 29-09-2010 00:02

(Original post by future_hopeful_uk)
I didnt rep you??

Then they should pay for their hobby (golf)?? They should not receive a degree for playing golf and learning how to run a clubhouse.

You do pay for a degree, via student loan, the cost to the taxpayer of which is negligible. Besides, some people really do need training on how to manage a club, not everyone can pick things up by intuition, or has the time and opportunity to learn from experience.

Got negged for our argument on the politics forum, assumed it was you, if not my apologies....

future_hopeful_uk · 29-09-2010 00:03

(Original post by Bishamon)
Right so going to imperial somehow means that you are taught the fundamentals of the subject and everyone else is not.

I said if you didnt cover 2nd order differential equations then i cant see how you can be doing a serious engineering degree. Pretty much every engineering discipline requires that type of mathematics! If you do cover that, then obviously you do- but by your reaction you obviously dont. Probably get the crayons out and draw pictures of bridges?

Collingwood · 29-09-2010 00:04

(Original post by Jordan656)
You do pay for a degree, via student loan, the cost to the taxpayer of which is negligible.

lol, you pay about 1/10 that way. And it's fake debt anyway, at 0% interest, with no ultimate obligation if you don't work.

Swimmer · 29-09-2010 00:04

If one wants to go study a subject they passionate about, why cant they?. You dont know the intention of graduates, they could graduate and open up their own business which will create further jobs.

Everyone has a talent, and they should not be denied to show it.

Hylean · 29-09-2010 00:05

(Original post by future_hopeful_uk)
Thanks for the neg rep, starting to feel insecure or something?

Ive got a better question for you, if media studies is so respected, why do top companies not like it? Why does LSE and Cambridge blacklist it?

Oh i guess 2 top universities and our best companies know less than the media studies experts...

Cambridge also happens to teach Anglo-Saxon, Norse and Celtic Studies. I hardly find something like that very useful in the modern age, do you? Taking your cue from other universities is a retarded way of doing things.

babygirl110 · 29-09-2010 00:05

(Original post by RamocitoMorales)
Well I can't think of many universities who'll accept students with those grades, I mean, even Brunel ask for a BBB in my subject.

But if someone did get those grades and achieved a First at university, then that shows that they've improved and their A levels won't count for much anymore.

If you get a First from, say Kingston, and you apply to Oxford for your Masters, Oxford won't give a crap about what university you went to.

Besides, someone who gets DDD will be denied the privelage of attending prestigious institutions such as LSE, UCL, Bristol, etc.

oh, really?

Doyle&TheFourFathers · 29-09-2010 00:06

it wont happen because it helps keep unemployment figures down.

future_hopeful_uk · 29-09-2010 00:07

(Original post by Jordan656)
You do pay for a degree, via student loan, the cost to the taxpayer of which is negligible. Besides, some people really do need training on how to manage a club, not everyone can pick things up by intuition, or has the time and opportunity to learn from experience.

Not always, there arent many degrees where the tuition fees cover the whole cost of the degree.

But a degree is an academic qualification, being trained to run a club isnt academic. Otherwise every single barmaid should have a degree for managing a pub when the landlord isnt present.

(ps havent repped anyone)

plastercaster · 29-09-2010 00:07

Acording to the guardian university guide, of the 60 or so universities who offer employment data for their media studies course, around 2/3 have a graduate level employment below 50%. Basically we could shut down at least half of the country's media courses, and we'd still have enough media studies graduates to do all media studying great Britain could possibly have a use for. Why should we fund a degree costing £20,000 a head that only to leads to a career in shelf stacking?

Bishamon · 29-09-2010 00:10

(Original post by future_hopeful_uk)
lol......

I do know this (remember im the Imperial student and you're not) but in the salaries table they are clumped together.

Strange how only 'bottom' unis teach IT and 'better' unis teach Computer Science..... wonder why that is eh?

Another idiotic analogy. And going back to your previous point, when addressing degree standardization I was talking about engineering. There is no such parity in the field of information tech, probably why alot of degrees still fall under BSc. Again this is a retarded analogy as the IT field is very broad indeed and you dont actually need to have a degree at all to gain employment in certain areas. A number of my friends have qualified via distance learning or short term, 16 week training courses. Of course lumping these together with graduates will produce such varying data.

I guess one can argue that a "better" institution will offer you better graduate earning potential. No one will lie to you there, but who sets the limit on the quality of institution. Where most employers are asking for doctorates and masters I sincerly believe that the undergraduate degree is overrated. But this is a completely different discussion.

future_hopeful_uk · 29-09-2010 00:12

(Original post by Hylean)
Cambridge also happens to teach Anglo-Saxon, Norse and Celtic Studies.

Which is probably harder than a media studies degree....

(Original post by Hylean)
I hardly find something like that very useful in the modern age, do you?

You're confusing 'usefulness' with 'being qualified'. How can someone be qualified to point out the obvious? Then there is the opposite, pointing out that which is rediculously over-examined. I could examine toast landing butter-side down for 10 years, does that suddenly mean i deserve a degree for being an expert??

Should i receive a degree because i know why the colour scene in silence of the lambs wasnt b&w like the rest of the film?? How about a degree because i know why produce is put at the front of a supermarket and why sweets are put nearer the tills? Is that useful enough for a degree?

(Original post by Hylean)
Taking your cue from other universities is a retarded way of doing things.

Taking the viewpoint of two top universities about a degree subject is retarded, but basing the usefulness of a subject on the way you examine props in a hollywood film isnt?

Bishamon · 29-09-2010 00:12

(Original post by future_hopeful_uk)
I said if you didnt cover 2nd order differential equations then i cant see how you can be doing a serious engineering degree. Pretty much every engineering discipline requires that type of mathematics! If you do cover that, then obviously you do- but by your reaction you obviously dont. Probably get the crayons out and draw pictures of bridges?

LOL if you werent so obtuse you would have realized by now that I never actually answered your question.

infernalcradle · 29-09-2010 00:13

(Original post by lechaton-x)
Of course I don't believe it's the only way to manage a golf club (surprising as I'm a thick Media Studies student and all...) but if people want to do it because it interests them and it's what they want to go into then it's fine. At the end of the day, they're the one paying for it and they're the one doing it. I'd rather someone did Golf Management if than taking up a space on a History or English degree in a bid to please morons like you.

except they are not....no UK/EU student pays the full price of the degree...they only pay a fraction of the cost...the govt pays the rest and gives them the money to pay that fraction...

TheRealDarthVader · 29-09-2010 00:13

This would leave tons of art students homeless, and will leave them with the realisation that their degree choice is stupid when they are eighteen, thus saving them three years of their life and thousands of pounds.

Do I hate art? No, but you can't really get a job in art in the same way that you can in business, science or sports.

Bannanaman · 29-09-2010 00:15

(Original post by future_hopeful_uk)
Not always, there arent many degrees where the tuition fees cover the whole cost of the degree.

But a degree is an academic qualification, being trained to run a club isnt academic. Otherwise every single barmaid should have a degree for managing a pub when the landlord isnt present.

(ps havent repped anyone)

Ok, fair enough on the neg. Anyway...

Perhaps not, but you can't have a university dedicated entirely to a single or a few subjects - it would not become large enough to properly expolit its economies of scale, so all universities need to offer a wide range of subjects to attract a large number of students.

How do you distinguish between what is and is not academic? Academic just stems from the word academy or 'group'. Therefore anything that can be taught to a group can be academic.

Also:

(remember im the Imperial student and you're not)

Fail to see how that makes any difference. You could be on the verge of failing your course for all we know, and he may be about to receive a first.

Libertine · 29-09-2010 00:16

(Original post by future_hopeful_uk)
Should i receive a degree because i know why the colour scene in silence of the lambs wasnt b&w like the rest of the film??

Wasn't it all in colour?

Bishamon · 29-09-2010 00:17

(Original post by future_hopeful_uk)
You're confusing 'usefulness' with 'being qualified'. How can someone be qualified to point out the obvious? Then there is the opposite, pointing out that which is rediculously over-examined. I could examine toast landing butter-side down for 10 years, does that suddenly mean i deserve a degree for being an expert??

Should i receive a degree because i know why the colour scene in silence of the lambs wasnt b&w like the rest of the film?? How about a degree because i know why produce is put at the front of a supermarket and why sweets are put nearer the tills? Is that useful enough for a degree?

LOL "usefulness" is highly subjective? How can someone not be qualified to point out the obvious? Who determines what is the "obvious". Once again your gross oversimplification of fields you quite visibly display no understanding of does nothing but highlight your own immaturity. If that degree no matter how "mickey mouse" ensures one has qualified and can satisfy the criteria for relevent employment, how are we to tell them otherwise? As your argument unravels all that appears to be left is an unmitigated bias for subjects which dont fall into your rather narrow view of academic merit.

Hylean · 29-09-2010 00:17

(Original post by future_hopeful_uk)
Which is probably harder than a media studies degree....

You're confusing 'usefulness' with 'being qualified'. How can someone be qualified to point out the obvious? Then there is the opposite, pointing out that which is rediculously over-examined. I could examine toast landing butter-side down for 10 years, does that suddenly mean i deserve a degree for being an expert??

Should i receive a degree because i know why the colour scene in silence of the lambs wasnt b&w like the rest of the film?? How about a degree because i know why produce is put at the front of a supermarket and why sweets are put nearer the tills? Is that useful enough for a degree?

Taking the viewpoint of two top universities about a degree subject is retarded, but basing the usefulness of a subject on the way you examine props in a hollywood film isnt?

Then, really, if we are going to remove degrees on the basis of pointing out the obvious, we should remove: engineering cause it's bloody obvious where you put what; maths, cause 1+1 is pretty easy; english lit, cause the meaning of books is pretty obvious; history, we already know what happened; law, cause you don't even need that for the career; physics, cause we can already see gravity and whatnot at work; psychology cause i already know my own neuroses, phobias and philias; psychiatry cause you can just treat that **** with a good whack to the head; politics, cause it's obvious they're all liars; anthropology, sociology, and ********* more.

If you really don't see the point of Film Studies, then you shouldn't see the point of most degrees, really.

I also never stated that it was useful cause you study props. I was drawing a comparison to English Lit. Learn to read.

jj193 · 29-09-2010 00:17

(Original post by future_hopeful_uk)
We've got 120 universities, probably only ~50 or so who produce graduates who enter actual graduate jobs. Whilst i acknowledge some of the 70 others produce nurses and teachers which we need, should the non-essential degrees at the bottom universities be scrapped?

Do we really need Portsmouth 'Mathematics' graduates studying A Level Maths and getting a degree from it?

In a world where money grows on trees it would be great if everyone had a degree (except it would defeat the point of a qualification), but not only do we not live in this world, but we also have NO MONEY.

If the tories are going to cut defence, they may as well get some balls and stop teenagers from wasting 3 years of their lives and getting 20k atleast, in debt.

Somebody with no GCSEs and a couple of E grade A Levels in Media Studies and Film Studies isnt suddenly going to set the world on fire with his BSc Animation Studies from Greenwich.

EDIT This could either save the country money, or even lead to greater subsidies for poorer students.

I think a Maths degrees from all Universities have a worth.

Edit: OP is a medic, no surprise he's an idiot.

infernalcradle · 29-09-2010 00:18

(Original post by lechaton-x)
No. Most Media teachers have English Language degrees, and aren't very well versed in the subject- now schools want their teachers to have their degrees in Media.

I study it because I enjoy it, it has no relevance to what I want to do- but it is NOT pointless if you want to go on to do film and TV production, design or teaching for example..

I think you will find most of those people will not actually have a degree..but a shed load of experience...or talent...the actual degree itself isn't relavent...its their ability and exp in those fields that matters...

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