Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
x Turn on thread page Beta

Voter Fraud caused hung parliament watch

Announcements
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by WhySoLimey)
    a quick google showed conservative members being jailed/accused/found out of fraud in 2010, 2009, 2008, 2005 on the first page..
    Ghost voting?


    Okay, Haroon Rashid in 2005.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    She said it herself, that it could have been up to 3 seats which ... wait ... isn't enough to get the Tories a majority. Besides, some evidence would be nice Ms. Warsi, tah.

    In fact, if this is the basis that these claims can be made, I may aswell point out how the Greens lost a majority (Which they were obviously going to win with 450 seats) because of ghost voters aswell :rolleyes:
    • Political Ambassador
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    Political Ambassador
    Still laugh at it if you will but for someone to make an accusation like this with out evidence? Surely no one is that stupid? She can't have thought everyone would turn on Labour because she claims voter fraud?
    • TSR Community Team
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Community Team
    So Baroness Warsi makes some claims about electoral fraud and we have headlines saying it cost the Tories a majority. The Baroness claims to have at least three seats where she knows it happen yet isn't naming it. (See here and here.)

    Let's take a look at what this means for her stance and the situation the headlines lead to about the extent of electoral fraud in the 2010 General Election.

    The Baroness says she won't name the seats as it's wrong to idenitfy them. She should either take this problem seriously and name the seats so a full investigation can be held, or retract her comments. If she's serious about this being a problem she would say where those places are - she has a public duty to do so. If she's just political point scoring, then she'll remain quite and we should ignore her as she damages democracy by making elections look bad and refusing to allow electoral reform from being properly investigated by with-holding information.

    If she claimed the fraud caused the hung Parliament (I can't find a direct quote to say she said this, but the headlines claim it), then how come she can say 'at least three seats'. If she was serious about fraud like this causing a hung Parlimant, then there would need to have been at least 19 seats where the Tories came a close second or third that were lost due to fraud and she should name them or otherwise retract her comments. The most likely candidates for these seats are:

    Hampstead and Kilburn
    Bolton West
    Solihull
    Southampton Itchen
    Dorset Mid and Poole North
    Wirral South
    Derby North
    Dudley North
    Great Grimsby
    Wells
    Telford
    Walsall North
    Morley and Outwood
    Birmingham Edgbaston
    St Austell and Newquay
    Halifax
    Newcastle-under-Lyme
    Plymouth Moor View
    Sutton and Cheam

    This is based on the seats where the Tories came closes to winning (they were in second place in all of them). Of them, 14 are held by Labour and 5 by the Lib Dems.

    The votes needed for a Tory victory in them range from 42 to 1606. This means for voter fraud to have cost the Tories a majority, a total of at least 15,943 fraud votes must have been cast. I say minimum, as there would have been more fraud votes in each constituency than the minimum needed to defeat the Tories and there's no saying that these 19 constituencies will have been the ones refering to - if they were other constituencies, then the fraud vote numbers must be higher as the majorities would have been higher. Never mind the probability of fraud votes in areas that did not stop Tory victories or in areas which resulted in stronger majorities. And never mind the fact she claims the fraud as committed by Asian communities and some of those places on the list do not have significant Asian communities. We could be taking of tens of thousands of fraud votes if we take this to the full conclusion. Maybe even over a hundred thousand. In constituencies across the country from the South West to London to the North.

    So this is no minor claim which Baroness Warsi is making. The headlines about her comments are talking of at least 15,900 fraud votes being cast across at least 19 areas. The true number would realistically be much higher and more wide spread.

    So I say she has to release the information she has to the authorities. It is her duty to do so. This is perhaps the biggest and most wide spread issue of electoral fraud the UK has seen. It is totally wrong for her to sit quiet and do nothing. The ball is in her court - will she tackle electoral fraud or sit back and do nothing?

    Personally, I think she'll do nothing as she'll have no evidence for these claims anywhere near as serious as is being made out and instead she is just poilitical point scoring. It's time she grew up and took being part of the Government seriously.


    EDIT: I do want to say that I do take electoral fraud seriously and acknowledge that is may well have happened in the last election. However, I do not believe it happened anywhere near the scale so as to be possible to have stopped the Tories getting a majority. I also feel that if someone has evidence of electoral fraud, especially wide spread fraud, and refuses to pass it on the authorities, then they are a disgrace and basically condoning the fraud by allowing it to go on without investigation.


    EDIT: I just want to add a comment that I am NOT the 'RK' who left several comments on the New Statesman article on this topic
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    Impressive RK, I am sure Warsi is overegging the pudding - she is notoriously partisan. Perhaps a Tory version of our dear Teveth
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    where's the MF evidence
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by In2deep)
    She's only there filling some quota, I find her despicable to say the least. I am curious as to why they couldn't find a better Muslim/Asian to fill her role
    I guess because she's the only high profile Asian Conservative. I can't name any of the others without using Google (then again I can't name most MPs without using Google :ahee:)

    But it still saddens me that they felt the need to have a token anything. This is the 21st Century - select people because of their talents, not because of their race or religion. Warsi is most definitely untalented in everything apart from populism and climbing the political ranks, I'm sure that there were better choices than her to be co-chair of the Conservative Party.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by RK)
    (I can't find a direct quote to say she said this, but the headlines claim it)
    It's weird, I can't work it out either. It seems they all just jumped on the horse but I can't work out if she said anything like that at all.
    • TSR Community Team
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Community Team
    (Original post by CyclopsRock)
    It's weird, I can't work it out either. It seems they all just jumped on the horse but I can't work out if she said anything like that at all.
    I can only assume that there's more which said than is appearing in the New Statesman article. I haven't looked in to their article in too much detail, but is it part of a larger interview they conducted? Perhaps more appear in a print version of NS?
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Aj12)
    Still laugh at it if you will but for someone to make an accusation like this with out evidence? Surely no one is that stupid? She can't have thought everyone would turn on Labour because she claims voter fraud?
    Well, what she's suggesting is so unbelievable that people aren't going to take her word for it just because "no one is that stupid". If you look at the statistics in RK's post you'll see the magnitude of what she is saying. Until such time as she releases the information she supposedly knows (which I would agree she has a duty to do) people just aren't going to believe her. I could say I met someone yesterday who was walking around decapitated and fully functioning, but unless I had a photo you'd just think I was weird. In my opinion, she's talking out of an orifice other than her mouth, and that opinion isn't about to change until she gives me actual facts or at least a convincing argument, instead of vague allegations and dodging any requests to tell us what she knows because it would be "wrong".
 
 
 
Poll
Do you agree with the proposed ban on plastic straws and cotton buds?
Useful resources

Groups associated with this forum:

View associated groups

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.