Do English Catholics Celebrate Guy Fawkes Night?

Depends how into the Catholicism you are, I suppose. It's a bit different in NI really, the identity is stronger, if you get what I mean.

I have Catholic family who see it as a party with bright lights, gingerbread and bonfires.
Mind you, if my great auntie was alive, she'd throw a hissy fit if she knew I was going to the Lewes bonfire night celebrations this weekend. They go a bit anti-Catholic crazy there, burning effigies of the Pope and the whatnot ;/

Reply 2

Kew

Woodsy

Surely, Catholics celebrating Guy Fawkes Night would lack logic?

Only if they were being particularly picky and/or were somewhere like Lewes! After all, they could still celebrate the prevention of mass-murder, which is exactly what would have happened had the Houses of Parliament actually been blown up. The vast, overwhelming majority of people celebrate Guy Fawkes Night for this reason, after all - and that's if they even stop to think about the reasons behind the celebration at all, in any case.

Reply 3

Woodsy

Just wondering, I know that here in Northern Ireland the very suggestion for Catholics would be unheard of, I'm actually not sure if Protestants here in NI celebrate 5th November either, anybody tell me?

We have bonfires on Halloween night instead of 5th Nov. Just to open this up, what do the English, Scottish, Welsh actually do on Halloween Night? Fireworks etc is it?Do you do trick or treating and then penny for the guy thing on 5th Nov?

Surely, Catholics celebrating Guy Fawkes Night would lack logic? Let's be controversial, is the celebrating of Guy Fawkes Night politically incorrect? lol

I'm Catholic and celebrated Guy Fawkes Night as a kid. I went to a Catholic school and we were never told not to celebrate it. There's the political connotation of it and there's the religious connotation and the two should not be mixed up.

At the time, we were switching from Catholic to Protestant kings and queens like people change their socks. So Guy Fawkes could have been a protestant trying to blow up a Catholic monarch (say Mary I). I think we would still celebrate it.

Reply 4

NDGAARONDI

Do the druids here celebrate Halloween? :biggrin:

Reply 5

Kew

Only if they were being particularly picky and/or were somewhere like Lewes! After all, they could still celebrate the prevention of mass-murder, which is exactly what would have happened had the Houses of Parliament actually been blown up. The vast, overwhelming majority of people celebrate Guy Fawkes Night for this reason, after all - and that's if they even stop to think about the reasons behind the celebration at all, in any case.

Exactly. If Guy Fawkes were protestant and had blown up the Houses of Parliament and the Catholic Queen with it, we'd hardly call him a hero. He'd still be as much a criminal, blowing up people. That's the good thing about common sense here...

Reply 6

Mr Brightside

OP

I suppose Catholics in NI would associate their religion with their political identity much more, i.e. a Protestant Monarch for a Protestant people and thus Guy Fawkes would be someone they would never celebrate the death of.

Sorry, but whatever way you put it, it celebrates the Protestant control of the English Establishment.

In a society were the death penalty is long abolished, people, in a macabre sort of fashion, celebrate the death of a failed revolutionary. It strikes of the Orange Order and the Battle of the Boyne.
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SamTheMan

Exactly. If Guy Fawkes were protestant and had blown up the Houses of Parliament and the Catholic Queen with it, we'd hardly call him a hero. He'd still be as much a criminal, blowing up people. That's the good thing about common sense here...

No, i'd hedge my bets you'd have a day of memorial named after the fella.

If revolutionaries succeed they get honoured - Easter 1916, America, France etc etc.

It was never about 'mass murder' it's about the keeping of the Protestant Ascendancy. I mean, for Christ sake you still can't be a Catholic and be Monarch - all it would take would be a piece of legislation transferring the head of the Church of England title to the Archbishop of Canterbury, sorted. Equality - my arse.

Reply 7

For me, Bonfire/Guy Fawkes night isn't about celebrating the death of a Catholic, the prevention of a mass murder, or anything else political like that. To me, it's a just great excuse to watch fireworks and have a party! I've loved them since I was tiny and I still get excited when i see a great display! I'd be guessing, but I reckon that's what it means to most people too.

Should people stop buying eachother presents, decorating their homes and having a big family dinner because they're not particularly religious and don't associate with the birth of Christ?

Reply 8

Johnny 5

12

I thought glorification of terrorism was illegal now?

Reply 9

Xx Tomásíona - Mháire xX

14

Now woodsy what did you bring up a topic like this for :rolleyes:

you just wanna start an argument :p:

haha xoxo

Reply 10

Woodsy

I mean, for Christ sake you still can't be a Catholic and be Monarch - all it would take would be a piece of legislation transferring the head of the Church of England title to the Archbishop of Canterbury, sorted. Equality - my arse.

..because otherwise EVERY Catholic in Britain would have an equal chance of getting their bum on the throne :rolleyes:

No, it's not equality, but then very little about the line of succession is equal..

Reply 11

Kew

Woodsy

all it would take would be a piece of legislation transferring the head of the Church of England title to the Archbishop of Canterbury, sorted. Equality - my arse.

Nonsense - apart from anything else, the Archbishop of Canterbury is Church of England already anyway. :rolleyes:

'All it would take'? As if it would be that simple! :p:

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dogtanian

Bonfire/Guy Fawkes night isn't about celebrating the death of a Catholic, the prevention of a mass murder, or anything else political like that.

If you know anything about the history behind the celebration, then it is.

Reply 12

Kew

If you know anything about the history behind the celebration, then it is.

I do know, I just missed a vital part of my post out there! *edits*

Reply 13

Mr Brightside

OP

The Queen is head of the Church of England i'm afraid, when really that title should rest with the Archbishop of Canterbury. Yes it would be that simple, is the Queen going to go against the wishes of Parliament?

It would mean that any person, of any faith, could become Queen. The fact that if a woman heir marries someone he can't become 'King' is also unqual but that's for another day.

So under the Government's new incitement to religious hatred bill, will Guy Fawkes Night be included? Seriously though, it does incite hatred against Catholics - the only religion stemming directly from the moment of Christ's death. I can only hope that Fawkes prayers to Our Lady as he was executed by the heretics were answered - now that is controversial.

Reply 14

Woodsy

No, i'd hedge my bets you'd have a day of memorial named after the fella.

If revolutionaries succeed they get honoured - Easter 1916, America, France etc etc.

It was never about 'mass murder' it's about the keeping of the Protestant Ascendancy. I mean, for Christ sake you still can't be a Catholic and be Monarch - all it would take would be a piece of legislation transferring the head of the Church of England title to the Archbishop of Canterbury, sorted. Equality - my arse.

Even though people were backward everywhere in the 17th century, and not open-minded, we have something called common sense and values here.

It's not because I'm Catholic that I applaud other Catholics blowing up people. I like to think of myself as having a brain a bit more evolved than that.

The Church of England/The Episcopalian Church isn't even a proper Protestant Church. The only thing the CoE did was adopt a few ideas from Lutheranism, remove the authority of the Pope in Rome (many Catholics did the same in history). It has little to do with religious beliefs and it was all about politics.

For the past centuries, being Catholic was equivalent to not pledging allegiance to the monarch. What do you expect, show two fingers to a country then expect them to treat you as royalty (literally, in what you're saying)?

That piece of legislation is a minor detail. Common sense and values prevail. The day it needs to be changed, it probably will. The fact you're having a hissy fit because you can't be a monarch is a bit ridiculous.

Guy Fawkes was a criminal who wanted to blow up people. That's why the whole thing was celebrated in the first place. These days, noone cares and the only thing that remains is that he wanted to kill the King (I personally wasn't sure whether Guy Fawkes was Catholic or Protestant the other day as I thought James I was Catholic) If you can find me some CoE criminal (since you're so hell bent on the little detail: whether they recognise the Pope or not) who blew up a monarch or important politician and who is considered a hero...

Reply 15

While going 'oooh' at a firework, I'm not thinking about how we got one over on them silly Catholics. I'm just going 'oooh' at a firework.

Very very few celebrations of Bonfire Night are related in any real way to the original anti-Catholic celebrations. Admittedly, places such as Lewes, where i'm going this year, do have a more traditional celebration. But I don't think they all hate Catholics and are celebrating the fact that we don't have a Catholic royal family, more the town's traditions.

Sorry, I'm not making much sense in my posts today.

Reply 16

Woodsy

Catholics - the only religion stemming directly from the moment of Christ's death. I can only hope that Fawkes prayers to Our Lady as he was executed by the heretics were answered - now that is controversial.

Oh dear... some people never learn. In which century do you live?

2 5 +

I thought glorification of terrorism was illegal now?

Hmmm well no, according to Woodsy, if he has the same love for the Pope as you do, it makes it alright. I'd like to see how much Woodsy actually follows what the Pope says :rolleyes:

(the recognition of the Pope being the main difference between the two religions, amongst other things). Hypocrisy prevails...

Reply 17

Kew

Woodsy

So under the Government's new incitement to religious hatred bill, will Guy Fawkes Night be included? Seriously though, it does incite hatred against Catholics - the only religion stemming directly from the moment of Christ's death. I can only hope that Fawkes prayers to Our Lady as he was executed by the heretics were answered - now that is controversial.

You are exaggerating the religious element of the matter; in fact I wouldn't be surprised if you called Fawkes a martyr next! :biggrin:

At the end of the day, blowing up the Head of State and Parliament, the representative assembly of the nation, would have been an action against the political structure of power.

Reply 18

yawn