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Do English Catholics Celebrate Guy Fawkes Night?
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dogtanian
Depends how into the Catholicism you are, I suppose. It's a bit different in NI really, the identity is stronger, if you get what I mean.
I have Catholic family who see it as a party with bright lights, gingerbread and bonfires.
Mind you, if my great auntie was alive, she'd throw a hissy fit if she knew I was going to the Lewes bonfire night celebrations this weekend. They go a bit anti-Catholic crazy there, burning effigies of the Pope and the whatnot ;/
I have Catholic family who see it as a party with bright lights, gingerbread and bonfires.
Mind you, if my great auntie was alive, she'd throw a hissy fit if she knew I was going to the Lewes bonfire night celebrations this weekend. They go a bit anti-Catholic crazy there, burning effigies of the Pope and the whatnot ;/
Oh you're going to Lewes! I went last year - they do it in style there!
Unfortunately I'm now a Northerner so won't be able to go. Hopefully something will be going on here though.
Woodsy
Just wondering, I know that here in Northern Ireland the very suggestion for Catholics would be unheard of, I'm actually not sure if Protestants here in NI celebrate 5th November either, anybody tell me?
I believe Protestants in NI don't celebrate the 5th of November, which makes them something of a bizarre exception in the Crown Commonwealth. They do however make a far bigger deal out of Hallowe'en than we do - there are no fireworks and bonfires in GB on Hallowe'en, just costumes and decorations.
I can't really tell you what British catholics do on Guy Fawkes night. I've never thought to ask the few catholics that I know.
dogtanian
burning effigies of the Pope and the whatnot ;/
What do you think the Guy on top of almost every bonfire was before the proto-PC brigade got to it? After all, Mr Fawkes was hung, drawn and quartered... not burned.
Anyway, Lewes has its own reasons for this. The bonfire there is also celebration of some 16th c. protestant martyrs, so really Pope-burning is slightly more justified.
Woodsy
The Queen is head of the Church of England i'm afraid
I believe the head of the Church of England is actually Jesus Christ...
The Queen is merely a governor.
Yes it would be that simple, is the Queen going to go against the wishes of Parliament?
It's an entrenched part of our constitution, it's a little more significant than a bit of disapproval by Elizabeth.
And in fact, Parliament could not legislate the Queen's Protestant role out of existence. She has a role within the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland too - and the Church of Scotland is the one body within the United Kingdom that Parliament has limited sovereignty over.
It would mean that any person, of any faith, could become Queen. The fact that if a woman heir marries someone he can't become 'King' is also unqual but that's for another day.
As for your other point, perhaps we should ban people from calling their children after their father alone!
So under the Government's new incitement to religious hatred bill, will Guy Fawkes Night be included? Seriously though, it does incite hatred against Catholics - the only religion stemming directly from the moment of Christ's death. I can only hope that Fawkes prayers to Our Lady as he was executed by the heretics were answered - now that is controversial.
The Church of England has as much claim to be the one true holy catholic church as the Vatican does. That would imply that both were conceived at the same date.
No Catholic has ever suffered violence as a result of GF Night celebrations - and significantly, his religion and motives for his attempted crime are irrelevant to the celebration for most people, the point is that he tried to kill our monarch and failed, who cares what he was doing it for?
In a society were the death penalty is long abolished, people, in a macabre sort of fashion, celebrate the death of a failed revolutionary. It strikes of the Orange Order and the Battle of the Boyne.
Actually, we're not celebrating his death - as per proclamation of the King, we're celebrating the failure of the plot. Guy Fawkes was not hung on the 5th of November, but on the 31st of January.
And as for the Battle of the Boyne, didn't the revolutionary win that particular little battle?
Hehe.. I'm Catholic and have never even really thought about the implications of celebrating Guy Fawkes night. Guess I'm a bit simple
But.. I did go to a strict Catholic school which didn't seem to have any problem with it, since I remember, around Nov 5th.. having lessons where we'd draw fireworks and bonfires and stuff
But.. I did go to a strict Catholic school which didn't seem to have any problem with it, since I remember, around Nov 5th.. having lessons where we'd draw fireworks and bonfires and stuff
Can 5th November be labelled as a rememberance day rather than a celebration day as such?
to me, being from northern ireland, the time for fireworks is halloween (even though fireworks are illegal for public purchase), and for bonfires is 12th july.
what actually is the point of celebrating some nutcase catholics trying to blow up parliament? glorifying the effort? taking the piss out of their failure?
what actually is the point of celebrating some nutcase catholics trying to blow up parliament? glorifying the effort? taking the piss out of their failure?
technik
what actually is the point of celebrating some nutcase catholics trying to blow up parliament? glorifying the effort? taking the piss out of their failure?
what actually is the point of celebrating some nutcase catholics trying to blow up parliament? glorifying the effort? taking the piss out of their failure?
I think the idea is more celebrating the fact that he got caught before anyone did get killed.
Apart from him and the rest of the plotters, I guess.
Yeah, but like I said, for me (and I suspect many others) bonfire night is far removed from the religious and political origins, at least in my mind.
It's a chance to watch fireworks for me, not remembering the gunpowder plot.
And my Catholic relatives are, for the most part, the same.
It's a chance to watch fireworks for me, not remembering the gunpowder plot.
And my Catholic relatives are, for the most part, the same.
technik
what actually is the point of celebrating some nutcase catholics trying to blow up parliament? glorifying the effort? taking the piss out of their failure?
The latter probably.
And, as they say, treason should never be forgot....
NDGAARONDI
Can 5th November be labelled as a rememberance day rather than a celebration day as such?
I can't remember of find a source, but I seem to recall at the time King James said specificly that the 5th was to be a day of celebration, or that it was at least implied, forever more.
Syntax
Hehe.. I'm Catholic and have never even really thought about the implications of celebrating Guy Fawkes night. Guess I'm a bit simple
But.. I did go to a strict Catholic school which didn't seem to have any problem with it, since I remember, around Nov 5th.. having lessons where we'd draw fireworks and bonfires and stuff
Hehe.. I'm Catholic and have never even really thought about the implications of celebrating Guy Fawkes night. Guess I'm a bit simple
But.. I did go to a strict Catholic school which didn't seem to have any problem with it, since I remember, around Nov 5th.. having lessons where we'd draw fireworks and bonfires and stuff
Same here. I went to a Catholic school and never thought about it. Most people don't know what they're celebrating anyway and what people remember is that he tried to kill the king.
LibertineNorth
I believe Protestants in NI don't celebrate the 5th of November, which makes them something of a bizarre exception in the Crown Commonwealth.
I was going to mention this. For some reason, Newfoundland (a Canadian province, independent till 1949) takes bonfire night very seriously and it's part of their traditions. I think after Britain, that's probably the place where it's most celebrated.
I just read something about New Zealanders celebrating Guy Fawkes Night and in New England, they celebrated it as Pope Day until independence.
I think this closes the debate because Newfoundland, which is a rather Catholic province (people of Irish origin represent a sizeable proportion of the population, after people of British origin), actively celebrates Guy Fawkes Night.
http://www.infonet.st-johns.nf.ca/providers/green/guyfawkes.html
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King of England who was first the King of Scotland!
http://www.infonet.st-johns.nf.ca/providers/green/guyfawkes.html
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bikerx23
You'd think the unionists would be pro- since its seen as a british tradition and the rest for it because it involves killing the (at the time) king of England!
King of England who was first the King of Scotland!
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