This discussion is now closed.
Check out other Related discussions
Do English Catholics Celebrate Guy Fawkes Night?
Scroll to see replies
bikerx23
You seem to be completely ignorant to the fact that atleast 99% of the entire of the British population would not have had a vote at this time - so comparatively the Irish catholics would have lived in a significantly more democratic environment.
Bollox. Almost like saying Stalin was better than Hitler because he didn't single out one particular group of people for persecution. Bollox.
technik
what are you on about? too much tatyskinbeer tonight?
It was pointed out that most of the UK at the time hadn't got a vote - however, an overwhelming amount of Protestants had the vote in Ireland whereas not one single Catholic had until 1829. Thus there was direct persecution of one group, perhaps an incomplete or poor analogy, for that I apologise insincerely.
bikerx23
dont worry about it - i find him quite fascinating...clinically i mean...
I'll leave you to embarrase him from now on
I'll leave you to embarrase him from now on
You embarrass yourself by actually spelling the word wrong.
--------------
bikerx23
The key to a good analysis is basing it on solid facts. Why dont you come back once you have unveiled these.
Yeah and the revelation that 99% of the British public had not got the vote is solid fact is it? Really and truly you are now actually making me giggle.
Woodsy
You embarrass yourself by actually spelling the word wrong.
not really - i'm drunk! and even with that i can see how ridiculous your posts are - whats your excuse.
--------------
I know for a fact that less than 1% of the population had the vote, so yes, it is.
Also, I reinforced this statistic by using the qualifier "atleast", signifying that, as stated less than 1% of the population were eligible to vote.
bikerx23
not really - i'm drunk! and even with that i can see how ridiculous your posts are - whats your excuse.
--------------
I know for a fact that less than 1% of the population had the vote, so yes, it is.
Also, I reinforced this statistic by using the qualifier "atleast", signifying that, as stated less than 1% of the population were eligible to vote.
--------------
I know for a fact that less than 1% of the population had the vote, so yes, it is.
Also, I reinforced this statistic by using the qualifier "atleast", signifying that, as stated less than 1% of the population were eligible to vote.
I can almost physically hear you calling for help. Make yourself a sandwich. Having studied 19th Century Britain I know for a fact that more than 1% of about 25-30million people had the vote.
--------------
technik
its the same "poor old oppressed catholics" routine seen time and again all over this forum.
Shut up, you make yourself laughable by pretending to be 'non-religious' when we all know Dr No's Free Presbyterianism is written all over you, even if you never appear at Church.
Woodsy
Shut up, you make yourself laughable by pretending to be 'non-religious' when we all know Dr No's Free Presbyterianism is written all over you, even if you never appear at Church.
sorry to disappoint but i dont have an irrational belief in some god. do you? is his rep sitting in rome at the moment?
technik
sorry to disappoint but i dont have an irrational belief in some god. do you? is his rep sitting in rome at the moment?
I believe he is to be honest. I don't even want to get into the rationality of God, i'm too tired, for another day.
Woodsy
I can almost physically hear you calling for help. Make yourself a sandwich. Having studied 19th Century Britain I know for a fact that more than 1% of about 25-30million people had the vote.
hmm...i have studied 1830's britain extensively and know from that time that the electoral roll was significantly less. An example i recall was Merthyr in south wales having an electoral roll of approximately 30 people out of a population of over 100'000 people.
Although, if you are going to make vague statements about the proportion of voters "over the last 300 years" is about as good as they come - currently everyone over the age of 18 has the vote, so if we looked at this data for the last 200 years you could claim only 50% were eligible.
Frankly - your points are ill thought out and ignorant of factual evidence - probably because this would interfere with your poor little story of persecution and hate.
Woodsy
I believe he is to be honest. I don't even want to get into the rationality of God, i'm too tired, for another day.
atheism is a better method in my opinion but if you want to believe in the great bearded one who takes his privacy even more seriously than madonna and jacko then go ahead. dont accuse me of believing in such things though.
technik
atheism is a better method in my opinion but if you want to believe in the great bearded one who takes his privacy even more seriously than madonna and jacko then go ahead. dont accuse me of believing in such things though.
I believe in something but what that is I do not now. The vagueness of that statement makes the point.
--------------
bikerx23
hmm...i have studied 1830's britain extensively and know from that time that the electoral roll was significantly less. An example i recall was Merthyr in south wales having an electoral roll of approximately 30 people out of a population of over 100'000 people.
Although, if you are going to make vague statements about the proportion of voters "over the last 300 years" is about as good as they come - currently everyone over the age of 18 has the vote, so if we looked at this data for the last 200 years you could claim only 50% were eligible.
Frankly - your points are ill thought out and ignorant of factual evidence - probably because this would interfere with your poor little story of persecution and hate.
Although, if you are going to make vague statements about the proportion of voters "over the last 300 years" is about as good as they come - currently everyone over the age of 18 has the vote, so if we looked at this data for the last 200 years you could claim only 50% were eligible.
Frankly - your points are ill thought out and ignorant of factual evidence - probably because this would interfere with your poor little story of persecution and hate.
Listen, I'm not even bothered with you anymore - poor little story? What are you talking about, Catholics as a religious group were denied the vote across the whole of the United Kingdom since the inception of Protestantism as the religion of England - Henry VIII. That is persecution i'm afraid. Grow up.
Woodsy
I believe in something but what that is I do not now. The vagueness of that statement makes the point.
and what point is that?
Woodsy
Listen, I'm not even bothered with you anymore - poor little story? What are you talking about, Catholics as a religious group were denied the vote across the whole of the United Kingdom since the inception of Protestantism as the religion of England - Henry VIII. That is persecution i'm afraid. Grow up.
being a catholic puts a bit of a ******* on any aspirations to be in line for the throne too. best write to the queen to protest about the persecution in the here and now!
Woodsy
Having studied 19th Century Britain I know for a fact that more than 1% of about 25-30million people had the vote.
Studying History at 3rd-year degree level (and specialising in British history), I know that what you're talking about is irrelevant to the topic of debate, ie. Guy Fawkes Night.
Kew
Studying History at 3rd-year degree level (and specialising in British history), I know that what you're talking about is irrelevant to the topic of debate, ie. Guy Fawkes Night.
It's my thread.
The OP evidently had a political and sectarian axe to grind when he started this thread. I have no desire to fuel his little tribalist rant against a perfectly normal, pleasant and traditional festival - therefore, I am ducking out of this thread now.
Please grow up and perhaps drop the bigotry down a notch.
Please grow up and perhaps drop the bigotry down a notch.
The political situation was different then, but it is still interesting to compare / contrast with now.
The rhyme tells how one side saw it then . . .
Remember, remember the Fifth of November,
The Gunpowder Treason and Plot,
I know of no reason
Why Gunpowder Treason
Should ever be forgot.
Guy Fawkes, Guy Fawkes, t'was his intent
To blow up King and Parliament.
Three-score barrels of powder below
To prove old England's overthrow;
By God's providence he was catch'd
With a dark lantern and burning match.
Holloa boys, holloa boys, let the bells ring.
Holloa boys, holloa boys, God save the King!
A penny loaf to feed the Pope
A farthing o' cheese to choke him.
A pint of beer to rinse it down.
A (bonfire) of sticks to burn him.
Burn him in a tub of tar.
Burn him like a blazing star.
Burn his body from his head.
Then we'll say ol' Pope is dead.
Hip hip hoorah!Hip hip hoorah hoorah!
The plot involved a terrorist cell of 13 aided by Jesuits. It was re-enacted for television a couple of years ago.
They showed that the 2.5 tonnes of gunpowder would have raised the Houses of Parliament to the ground, killing most of the English government, including the King, and be of greater effect than 9/11.
The terrorist cell numbered 13, aided by the Jesuits.
An Act of Parliament was passed to make 5th November a Day of Thanksgiving. This lasted a further 254 years.
Should we be thankful?
Well, what would this country have been like if it had succeeded?
A month before, King James had decreed that the bible should be translated into English so that the common man could read the truth for himself / herself.
The Pope knew that this would do what military might had failed to do and overthrow his political power over people because of their ignorance.
Further details here
http://www.parliament.uk/documents/upload/g08.pdf
But to many people, religion is irrelevant so perhaps the best / only way to guage what difference it made is to compare British society with a more Catholic Spain, France & Portugal.
How did each of us develop our society, industry and dependencies abroad?
The rhyme tells how one side saw it then . . .
Remember, remember the Fifth of November,
The Gunpowder Treason and Plot,
I know of no reason
Why Gunpowder Treason
Should ever be forgot.
Guy Fawkes, Guy Fawkes, t'was his intent
To blow up King and Parliament.
Three-score barrels of powder below
To prove old England's overthrow;
By God's providence he was catch'd
With a dark lantern and burning match.
Holloa boys, holloa boys, let the bells ring.
Holloa boys, holloa boys, God save the King!
A penny loaf to feed the Pope
A farthing o' cheese to choke him.
A pint of beer to rinse it down.
A (bonfire) of sticks to burn him.
Burn him in a tub of tar.
Burn him like a blazing star.
Burn his body from his head.
Then we'll say ol' Pope is dead.
Hip hip hoorah!Hip hip hoorah hoorah!
The plot involved a terrorist cell of 13 aided by Jesuits. It was re-enacted for television a couple of years ago.
They showed that the 2.5 tonnes of gunpowder would have raised the Houses of Parliament to the ground, killing most of the English government, including the King, and be of greater effect than 9/11.
The terrorist cell numbered 13, aided by the Jesuits.
An Act of Parliament was passed to make 5th November a Day of Thanksgiving. This lasted a further 254 years.
Should we be thankful?
Well, what would this country have been like if it had succeeded?
A month before, King James had decreed that the bible should be translated into English so that the common man could read the truth for himself / herself.
The Pope knew that this would do what military might had failed to do and overthrow his political power over people because of their ignorance.
Further details here
http://www.parliament.uk/documents/upload/g08.pdf
But to many people, religion is irrelevant so perhaps the best / only way to guage what difference it made is to compare British society with a more Catholic Spain, France & Portugal.
How did each of us develop our society, industry and dependencies abroad?
Latest
Trending
Last reply 2 weeks ago
Rachel Reeves did the right thing in ending winter fuel paymentsLast reply 1 month ago
Should the UK introduce a mandatory working gap year for 18-year olds?Last reply 1 month ago
Russell Group universities are actually very good. We should stop dismissing them.
