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    (Original post by chewwy)
    bad thread.
    pointless post.
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    I still say you can get a great 6pac by keeping things simple works for me
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    first of all try eating more frequent smaller meals during the day to speed up your metabolism. drink plenty of water. try cut out the curry. do your cardio in the morning on an empty stomach preferably but make sure your getting plenty of protein but this does risk catabolsim. do weighted crunches and lying leg lifts every other day high intensity. dont waste your money on stupid ab toner products that dont work but if you want to buy anything, buy whey protein to use post workout.
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    Is it Gavin Henson in your avatar?

    Anyway, to the point, in all honesty if you've been working out as much as you have and watching your eating and you still don't have a six-pack then its likely you aren't genetically gifted when it comes to metabolism/hormonal conditions required for low bodyfat.

    So, you basically need to educate yourself on how best to lose fat, and its far more difficult than anything I can explain here in a few paragraphs.

    Losing fat is not an easy thing to do especially as you get to lower and lower bodyfat levels.

    So get reading !

    That said - you could try a cyclical ketogenic diet for a while, see if that brings about any results!
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    Also if you're already counting cals based on the "serving" sizes etc. given on packets then I suggest you get a set of digital scales.

    Have you ever seen what the recommended 40g serving of a box of alpen is?? Its not a pretty sight..
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    (Original post by imasillynarb)
    Is it Gavin Henson in your avatar?
    not quite. henson isnt that big.

    but yeah i agree with you that for some it seems almost impossible to get a six pack. one thing that can help to lower bodyfat once it gets to a certain level is some EFA capsules and cardio on an empty stomach in the morning. and remember that the more lean muscle tissue you have the more calories you burn regardless of how active you are so dont just do ab work.
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    Not impossible, but those who have a 6-pack either have gifted genetics or lots of knowledge on the subject of fat burning, or both.

    EFA capsules before cardio is not a good idea...
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    1) i said seems almost
    2) i said cardio on an empty stomach, which implies without anything in it like EFA's. did i say take EFAs before cardio in the morning on an empty stomach then do it? i just listed 2 different things. besides, even taken before cardio it really wouldnt make a significant difference.
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    For starters bis, Emily is right, its been proven when you lose fat fast it goes to your stomach so that it can access the fat easier as its closer.

    To get a visible 6 pack you need less that 15% body fat, if you've already got less than this just increase the stomach crunchs you do every day, i think that loads of people do 600+ 3 times a week.
    Perhaps this website might help you: http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/flatstomach.htm
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    (Original post by bis432)
    1) i said seems almost
    2) i said cardio on an empty stomach, which implies without anything in it like EFA's. did i say take EFAs before cardio in the morning on an empty stomach then do it? i just listed 2 different things. besides, even taken before cardio it really wouldnt make a significant difference.
    You said "one thing that can help to lower bodyfat once it gets to a certain level is some EFA capsules and cardio on an empty stomach in the morning" which I read as 'some EFA capsules and then do cardio'

    Sorry if I'm wrong, perhaps you could punctuate a bit better in future to make it clearer.

    ps. no need for the attitude is there?
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    (Original post by Elipsis)
    For starters bis, Emily is right, its been proven when you lose fat fast it goes to your stomach so that it can access the fat easier as its closer.
    losing weight fast has many bad points to it, but i dont think that is one of them. fat isnt stored more in one place than in another by doing anything, where it is stored can hardly be changed i believe. just like you cant just lose fat off your stomach for example, it has to be lost all over. and why would it be 'closer' to access when stored in the stomach? when the body senses a need for the use in bodyfat as fuel it releases substances into the bloodstream to break down the fat to be put into the bloodstream for use, so why would it be 'closer' in the stomach than anywhere else in the body? i dont understand what you mean by that. explain and cite your 'proof'. sounds like a myth to me.

    To get a visible 6 pack you need less that 15% body fat
    secondly, this is complete crap. your generalising that everybody has the same type of bodyfat storage and that everyone stores the same ratio of fat on their stomach. some people have a bodyfat above 15% and have a six pack, others can have a bodyfat below 10% and no visual six pack. bodyfat % means little.

    lastly, doing 600+ crunches wouldnt be very effective. would you do 600 reps on bench press or on curling?
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    If you're well skinny and have a bit of stomach tone a six-pack is much easier.
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    (Original post by Elipsis)
    For starters bis, Emily is right, its been proven when you lose fat fast it goes to your stomach so that it can access the fat easier as its closer.

    To get a visible 6 pack you need less that 15% body fat, if you've already got less than this just increase the stomach crunchs you do every day, i think that loads of people do 600+ 3 times a week.
    Perhaps this website might help you: http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/flatstomach.htm
    This is complete rubbish.

    When you lose fat fast, it goes to your stomach - right, let me get this straight, if you're LOSING FAT, how can it be GOING to your stomach?

    Secondly - access fat easier as its closer?? Closer to where? This statement is wrong on soooo many levels..

    "To get a visible 6-pack you need less than 15% bodyfat" - not quite, its a completely individual figure, some people require much lower bodyfat for visible abs - lance armstrong has a bodyfat measurement of about 5% during the tour and has no visible abs, where as athletes of other sports may have visible abs at 12/13% - as said, completely individual. Of course if you're talking about women, than yes, 15% would give you a six-pack, but its likely your periods will stop and you'll experience a whole host of other complications at that sort of bodyfat level.

    600+ crunches 3 times a week will do absolutely bugger all I'm afraid.
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    (Original post by imasillynarb)
    You said "one thing that can help to lower bodyfat once it gets to a certain level is some EFA capsules and cardio on an empty stomach in the morning" which I read as 'some EFA capsules and then do cardio'

    Sorry if I'm wrong, perhaps you could punctuate a bit better in future to make it clearer.

    ps. no need for the attitude is there?
    yeah you read what i put wrong. i was just listing a few things that i have done to cut down in the past, i wasnt putting them in chronological order or anything. and sorry if i come across with a bit of an attitude, just stressed out at the moment.

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    (Original post by imasillynarb)
    This is complete rubbish.

    When you lose fat fast, it goes to your stomach - right, let me get this straight, if you're LOSING FAT, how can it be GOING to your stomach?

    Secondly - access fat easier as its closer?? Closer to where? This statement is wrong on soooo many levels..

    "To get a visible 6-pack you need less than 15% bodyfat" - not quite, its a completely individual figure, some people require much lower bodyfat for visible abs - lance armstrong has a bodyfat measurement of about 5% during the tour and has no visible abs, where as athletes of other sports may have visible abs at 12/13% - as said, completely individual. Of course if you're talking about women, than yes, 15% would give you a six-pack, but its likely your periods will stop and you'll experience a whole host of other complications at that sort of bodyfat level.

    600+ crunches 3 times a week will do absolutely bugger all I'm afraid.

    wow. for once we agree on something!
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    (Original post by imasillynarb)
    This is complete rubbish.

    Secondly - access fat easier as its closer?? Closer to where? This statement is wrong on soooo many levels..
    Don't argue with me argue with mens health magazine - im sure they no a tad more than yourself. Its relatively new research.

    (Original post by imasillynarb)
    "To get a visible 6-pack you need less than 15% bodyfat" - not quite, its a completely individual figure, some people require much lower bodyfat for visible abs - lance armstrong has a bodyfat measurement of about 5% during the tour and has no visible abs, where as athletes of other sports may have visible abs at 12/13% - as said, completely individual. Of course if you're talking about women, than yes, 15% would give you a six-pack, but its likely your periods will stop and you'll experience a whole host of other complications at that sort of bodyfat level.
    Its called an average, obviously everybody doesn't conform to the average.

    (Original post by imasillynarb)
    600+ crunches 3 times a week will do absolutely bugger all I'm afraid.
    I guess that you know more than me He asked for advice so i gave him something i had heard to be correct.
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    (Original post by Elipsis)
    Don't argue with me argue with mens health magazine - im sure they no a tad more than yourself. Its relatively new research.



    Its called an average, obviously everybody doesn't conform to the average.


    I guess that you know more than me He asked for advice so i gave him something i had heard to be correct.
    Mens health is full of crap - this is well established amongst everyone who knows anything about diet and exercise.

    If you had to fill a magazine with 150pages every month on a subject like diet and exercise you would struggle to find anything worthwhile, hence they fill it with **** like "what do women want from a man?"

    "big shoulders"

    "do these exercises for big shoulders"

    etc.

    Not much of it is actually completely wrong but none of it is particularly sound either. They might also publish a few "scientific" studies to make it look like a credible publication when infact these studies could also be complete rubbish.

    Yes- you're right, an average, however the average is nearer the 10-12% mark than the 15% mark.

    How did you hear it to be correct? Where did you read it/find it out? What gives you any indication what-so-ever that the information you received was correct/sound? Was it based on studies, experience, sound reasoning? I imagine none of the above.
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    Well i got all of the figures out of 1 issue of mens health based on scientific studies. What makes you so sure that what you heard was correct? I would like to see where you are getting your info from, i would say a well published magazine might win hands down to your common knowledge? A complete rubbish scientific study is better than your own self belief. How did you hear it to be correct? Where did you read it/find it out? What gives you any indication what-so-ever that the information you received was correct/sound? Was it based on studies, experience, sound reasoning? I imagine none of the above.
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    (Original post by imasillynarb)
    Mens health is full of crap - this is well established amongst everyone who knows anything about diet and exercise.
    so true. ive glimpsed inside the odd issue but found it hard not to laugh at some of the content.

    --------------

    (Original post by Elipsis)
    Well i got all of the figures out of 1 issue of mens health based on scientific studies. What makes you so sure that what you heard was correct? I would like to see where you are getting your info from, i would say a well published magazine might win hands down to your common knowledge? A complete rubbish scientific study is better than your own self belief. How did you hear it to be correct? Where did you read it/find it out? What gives you any indication what-so-ever that the information you received was correct/sound? Was it based on studies, experience, sound reasoning? I imagine none of the above.
    it isnt 'common knowledge' or 'self belief' its scientific facts. stop trying to argue over things you have no idea what your talking about.
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    How would you suggest that i found out about diet and excercise? Listen to the folk lore that you have had handed down from body builder to body builder? I can clearly see the scientific facts in print in mens health but not in your posts . I guess everybody should just take your word for it.
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    I would suggest listening to experts in the field of bodybuilding as well as diet and nutrition. I've read many a book and scientific study, as well as the acounts and experiences of people.

    Just because mens health contains a study doesn't mean its correct - read about the details of that study - was it actually carried out on humans or animals for a start? What were the conditions of the study, how many subjects was it carried out on etc.

    For example, there could be a study to see if a certain cardio training regimen works on a group of 10 obese individuals over a 4 week period by doing 1000 situps a day.

    *Shock find* the obese group on average lose 5 lbs - this must mean its the best way to lose bodyfat!!

    I don't think I have to explain further as to why you shouldn't just believe what you've read in mens health..

    Also its ironic that you take the piss out of "folklore" handed down form bodybuilder to bodybuilder - as most of the content of mens health is EXACTLY that!
 
 
 
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