Was Tony Blair one of "the greatest"? Watch

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Muffle
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#21
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#21
(Original post by Daveo)
Yes he followed the USA to war (which i agree with). However he isn't the most powerful man in the UK! Gordon Brown is! The only reason that the top up fees vote will get through is because Gordon Brown has arranged for all the people backing him, who were goin to vote against the bill, to vote for the bill as it isn't the right time for Gordon yet.
I think given that Gordon wants to be PM next I doubt he would be perticularly encouraging over this debate despite supporting tony on tv a few times.

A large number are now voting in favour because they think it might be voted down and as such are voting for it because they only wanted to vote against on principle.

The PM is definatley the most powerfull man in the country, depending on this vote and the Hutton report Blair might not be by the end of the week but he is now.
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Elle
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#22
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#22
Yes he'll be remembered because he's a war monger like Thatcher and Churchill.
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Daveo
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#23
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#23
(Original post by Muffle)
I think given that Gordon wants to be PM next I doubt he would be perticularly encouraging over this debate despite supporting tony on tv a few times.

A large number are now voting in favour because they think it might be voted down and as such are voting for it because they only wanted to vote against on principle.

The PM is definatley the most powerfull man in the country, depending on this vote and the Hutton report Blair might not be by the end of the week but he is now.
The only reason that the leading fees rebel has decided to join TB is because he was told to by GB! Thisis because it is not the right time for GB to take over!

And according to a recent survey of most powerful men in britian:
1. Gordon Brown
2. Tony Blair.

I just hope we see the back of Blair this week so Brown can lead this country properly.
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Elle
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#24
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#24
(Original post by Daveo)
The only reason that the leading fees rebel has decided to join TB is because he was told to by GB! Thisis because it is not the right time for GB to take over!

And according to a recent survey of most powerful men in britian:
1. Gordon Brown
2. Tony Blair.

I just hope we see the back of Blair this week so Brown can lead this country properly.
I hope that the other rebels stick with their principles and not follow Nick Brown's example. The "report" was crappy compromise.
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Muffle
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#25
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#25
(Original post by Daveo)
The only reason that the leading fees rebel has decided to join TB is because he was told to by GB! Thisis because it is not the right time for GB to take over!

And according to a recent survey of most powerful men in britian:
1. Gordon Brown
2. Tony Blair.

I just hope we see the back of Blair this week so Brown can lead this country properly.
Hes powerful economically and so on but has no way near the levels of power that could be used by tony blair who has far more advanced foreign and home political (and military) links.

Gordon wants to take over though and if TB wins this and the hutton report is OK he will be clean for the next election and possibly a third term. Gordon would be first on the list of tony left this week and as such why in hell would he support him? Unless Gordon just really likes Tony
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Muffle
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#26
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#26
(Original post by Elle)
I hope that the other rebels stick with their principles and not follow Nick Brown's example. The "report" was crappy compromise.
Thing is none of this rebels offer a solution to the problems, the tories dont either, the lib dems say general taxation which is completley unworkable since even under the new scheme the tax payer pays for 5/6's of a graduates education.

Also looking at the list of rebels some of them are just silly. Diane Abbot for one, promotes inner city schools in her constituncy, says children in that area will get a good education at them, then sends her kid to a stupidly overpriced private school. Now shes voting this down.
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Elle
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#27
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#27
(Original post by Muffle)
Thing is none of this rebels offer a solution to the problems, the tories dont either, the lib dems say general taxation which is completley unworkable since even under the new scheme the tax payer pays for 5/6's of a graduates education.
The Lib Dems have the right idea.. where did you get the 5/6 figure from?
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PQ
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#28
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#28
(Original post by Howard)
Oh dear.......wrong again! Apparently immigration is not an issue of consequence only to the editorial board and readership of the Sun.

"Public concerns about immigration and race relations in Britain have dramatically increased in the past five years, according to a survey just published. A total of 19% of people questioned cited the issue among the three most important problems in the UK, compared with just 3% in 1996"

"It topped economy, education, drugs or Europe in the poll "What's Worrying Britain?," commissioned by the United Nations Population Fund"

Source: BBC Home Page Thursday, 21 June, 2001, 11:54 GMT 12:54 UK
Immigration concerns multiply
Doesn't that imply that the general public are less worried about the economy, education, drugs and Europe after 7 yrs of Labour government
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Daveo
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#29
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#29
(Original post by Muffle)
Hes powerful economically and so on but has no way near the levels of power that could be used by tony blair who has far more advanced foreign and home political (and military) links.

Gordon wants to take over though and if TB wins this and the hutton report is OK he will be clean for the next election and possibly a third term. Gordon would be first on the list of tony left this week and as such why in hell would he support him? Unless Gordon just really likes Tony
Well lets just say the top-up fees vote would have gone against Blair if it wasnt for Brown therefore he clearly has power over more people than Blair.

And Brown is the most powerful man in the country:
http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_843571.html?menu=

And as for the Brown and Blair relationship - Blair fears Brown - At least thats the impression i got from Gordon.
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Muffle
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#30
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#30
(Original post by Elle)
The Lib Dems have the right idea.. where did you get the 5/6 figure from?
Its a fact, Blair pointed it out on that newsnight thingeh, also doesent it seem wrong that the taxpayer should pay more for university students rather than primary/secondary school students who are more likley to be their kids?
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Muffle
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#31
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#31
(Original post by Daveo)
Well lets just say the top-up fees vote would have gone against Blair if it wasnt for Brown therefore he clearly has power over more people than Blair.

And Brown is the most powerful man in the country:
http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_843571.html?menu=

And as for the Brown and Blair relationship - Blair fears Brown - At least thats the impression i got from Gordon.
I think the fact that ' Prince William is at number 14 as "the world's most eligible bachelor' kinda negates that survey.
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Muffle
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#32
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#32
(Original post by Howard)
Oh dear.......wrong again! Apparently immigration is not an issue of consequence only to the editorial board and readership of the Sun.

"Public concerns about immigration and race relations in Britain have dramatically increased in the past five years, according to a survey just published. A total of 19% of people questioned cited the issue among the three most important problems in the UK, compared with just 3% in 1996"

"It topped economy, education, drugs or Europe in the poll "What's Worrying Britain?," commissioned by the United Nations Population Fund"

Source: BBC Home Page Thursday, 21 June, 2001, 11:54 GMT 12:54 UK
Immigration concerns multiply
And how many people read the Sun, and how many anti-immigration articles to the Sun and the Daily Mail etc print? When its pushed into the publics face off course they says its the biggest issue even without knowing why.
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Daveo
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#33
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#33
(Original post by Muffle)
I think the fact that ' Prince William is at number 14 as "the world's most eligible bachelor' kinda negates that survey.
We'll see! But if it wasn't for Brown not only would most of the country be in tatters so would the economy!
The sooner Blair is outsed the better.
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Muffle
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#34
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#34
(Original post by Daveo)
We'll see! But if it wasn't for Brown not only would most of the country be in tatters so would the economy!
The sooner Blair is outsed the better.
But the economy is Browns job, not blairs. And why would the country be in tatters?

You should start a Brown fanclub.
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Daveo
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#35
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#35
(Original post by Muffle)
But the economy is Browns job, not blairs. And why would the country be in tatters?
The country is in tatters virtually! Well i suppose it has imporved since 1997 but its still pretty shocking!
Blair is a liar anyway! - The so called 'Agreement' between them did exist but Blair changed his mind because he is power mad.
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Muffle
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#36
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#36
(Original post by Daveo)
The country is in tatters virtually! Well i suppose it has imporved since 1997 but its still pretty shocking!
Blair is a liar anyway! - The so called 'Agreement' between them did exist but Blair changed his mind because he is power mad.
And how do you know it exsisted? Even if it did it wasnt a written conract just an agreement, times change and so that changed too. Labour wouldnt even be in power without Blair.

In tatters, HOW? Are planes falling from the sky? Are epidemics sweeping the nation? Are our children worshipping satan?

Give a reason why the country is in tatters.
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Daveo
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#37
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#37
(Original post by Muffle)
And how do you know it exsisted? Even if it did it wasnt a written conract just an agreement, times change and so that changed too. Labour wouldnt even be in power without Blair.

In tatters, HOW? Are planes falling from the sky? Are epidemics sweeping the nation? Are our children worshipping satan?

Give a reason why the country is in tatters.
Because I was told by a very reliable source the agreement existed.
And yes Labour would be in power without Blair - Brown would have lead and after the shambles the conservatives made anyone could have been elected. After all it was Brown who was a leading figure in the election campaign.

As for our country -
1. We are a heaven for asylum seekers, be they true asylum seekers or economic spongers.
2. The NHS is a complete shambles. Far Far too many managers.
thats 2 for starters - i could go on if you want.
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Muffle
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#38
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#38
(Original post by Daveo)
Because I was told by a very reliable source the agreement existed.
And yes Labour would be in power without Blair - Brown would have lead and after the shambles the conservatives made anyone could have been elected. After all it was Brown who was a leading figure in the election campaign.

As for our country -
1. We are a heaven for asylum seekers, be they true asylum seekers or economic spongers.
2. The NHS is a complete shambles. Far Far too many managers.
thats 2 for starters - i could go on if you want.
A medical student was told be a reliable source, just for the hell of it? Anyway as I understand it was only them involved, so how could a third part know?

Those are problems, the NHS works- someone high up in the French Medical system said the British System (as it is now) was the best economically and for patients.

A heaven for asylum seekers, maybe but the problem is being tackled, these things cant be solved overnight especially since you cant stop people getting here without working like the US- and even they cant.

Also what do you think Brown would have done differently, hwo do you know he would have saved the country from this apparent turmoil?
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Daveo
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#39
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#39
(Original post by Muffle)
A medical student was told be a reliable source, just for the hell of it? Anyway as I understand it was only them involved, so how could a third part know?

Those are problems, the NHS works- someone high up in the French Medical system said the British System (as it is now) was the best economically and for patients.

A heaven for asylum seekers, maybe but the problem is being tackled, these things cant be solved overnight especially since you cant stop people getting here without working like the US- and even they cant.
I asked him if their was an 'agreement' and he just said wait and see as this was before the last election. And my gran knew because she was told by Gordons parents.
The NHS works? Ok maybe it works but at a vastly overpriced rate.
And the asylum problem is being tackled? It's gettin worse where i live!
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Muffle
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#40
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#40
(Original post by Daveo)
I asked him if their was an 'agreement' and he just said wait and see as this was before the last election. And my gran knew because she was told by Gordons parents.
The NHS works? Ok maybe it works but at a vastly overpriced rate.
And the asylum problem is being tackled? It's gettin worse where i live!
It is being tackled, like I said you cant solve things overnight and often things get worse before they get better.

Anyway enough, we will see at the next election
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