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    http://news.students.efinancialcaree...wsItemId-31527

    This is outrageous, I'm in totally agreement with the commentator of this article. As someone, who on my S+T grad scheme at an IB had about 75% foreign grads who literally didn't know squat!!

    I did one internship at got the job, don't see why peers on my grad programme did 4-5 S+T internships?!
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    If UK students don't understand that peopel who are better educated/qualified and have more experience are more likely to get a grdauate job, they clearly don't deserve to work in IB... or any job that requires basic reasoning skills.

    Banks are not charities. Can't believe how these peopel somehow think they deserve to work in IB rather than go out and earn it.
    If you fail to get a job, its your fault, not the fault of the people who actually did get one.
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    Speaking a second language always helps.....and many foreigners speak more that two, deal with it. I can't say the same for the British, if they do, this will be the exception, not the rule.
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    Ok in my internship we had about 75% foreign grads - the average age was 28 years old, I was 20 years old and in the second year of my degree - whilst the majority of my class had finished their degree and who had done 3-4 internships previously - now I got my job - but tell me how fair is that?

    If i had unlimited money i would do degree after degree, internship after internship until i got the job - but in the UK we have to pay for our degrees unlike French/German grads
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    (Original post by worldisyours)
    Ok in my internship we had about 75% foreign grads - the average age was 28 years old, I was 20 years old and in the second year of my degree - whilst the majority of my class had finished their degree and who had done 3-4 internships previously - now I got my job - but tell me how fair is that?

    If i had unlimited money i would do degree after degree, internship after internship until i got the job - but in the UK we have to pay for our degrees unlike French/German grads
    Where the hell are people getting this idea that French and German grads don't pay fees???? To clarify this for once and for all, grad schools in France and Germany are not free. Grandes Ecoles in France cost upwards of €15,000 per year and in addition to that are frighteningly competitive to get into - we're talking 10,000 students going for 250 places on a year-to-year basis.

    Say what you like about the proportion of foreign students but at least get your facts right.
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    (Original post by worldisyours)
    Ok in my internship we had about 75% foreign grads - the average age was 28 years old, I was 20 years old and in the second year of my degree - whilst the majority of my class had finished their degree and who had done 3-4 internships previously - now I got my job - but tell me how fair is that?
    I'm not entirely unsure what unfair? Or are you sayign the foreign students are disadvantaged because they need to go throgh the hell of 5-6 years of uni and several underpaid relevant internships before gettign a job and you were able to do so after only a 3 year degree and 2 motnhs of slaving away?
    (Original post by worldisyours)
    If i had unlimited money i would do degree after degree, internship after internship until i got the job - but in the UK we have to pay for our degrees unlike French/German grads
    Uh, jsut fyi.. you can also take out a sabbatical year - without payign fees (or only minimal ones) - in the UK to do your 2 or 3 additional internships. Its not a privilige only French and Germans are entitled to.

    And about the fees... howmuch do you pay for your undergrad? 3.x a year? 10k over 3 years? The french unis (grande ecoles) that allow access to IB recruitment and many German target unis are not for free.
    Ok, most public target unis in Germany only require €1k per year (+a few hundered admin fees), thats not free either. And you forget that in Germany there is no Student Fee Loan and the Maintenace Loan system is underdeveloped.
    Other target unis, private ones such asWHU or EBS, costs over €30k for a 3 year degree.

    And do you actually know how expensive Grande ecoles are? Besides of the 3/4 year prep programme you MUST do (or a degree outside of france) grande ecoles are ridiculously expensive. HEC Paris has 13k annual tuition fees. That is for a 3 year degree. So almsot €40k.

    You're a LOT cheaper off doing a 3 year degree in Oxbridge than studying at a in the french system.

    Maybe general ignorance like yours is the reason why UK graduates are not well respected?
    This article might interest you http://news.efinancialcareers.co.uk/...wsItemId-31418

    “There is prejudice against Britons,” explains Dominic Connor of P&D Quant Recruitment. “Banks employ British people because they live down the road and they speak the language, but on the whole British people are not as smart and well educated as the French, the Germans, or the Norwegians.

    “Even most US bankers in London are better educated than the Brits,” he adds. “The American education system is atrocious, but most Americans in the City are post-grads.”
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    (Original post by worldisyours)
    Ok in my internship we had about 75% foreign grads - the average age was 28 years old, I was 20 years old and in the second year of my degree - whilst the majority of my class had finished their degree and who had done 3-4 internships previously - now I got my job - but tell me how fair is that?

    If i had unlimited money i would do degree after degree, internship after internship until i got the job - but in the UK we have to pay for our degrees unlike French/German grads
    They don't do degree after degree, in the rest of Europe undergraduate degrees have a duration of 5 years(usually) and if people want to include postgraduate studies then of course they will be much older than you with a 3 year bachelor degree......as about the internships, they get paid peanuts, they don't do it out of fun but because it is a compulsory part of their studies in most cases.
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    I know that this site is predominately is for students who are just applying for internships. But wait till you get there, I know on my S+T internship and consequent grad programme, my European friends told me if they dont get this job they'd simply get a grant and do another masters, either in UK or USA.

    I dont mind the best people getting the job, I was a second-year when I did my internship and I successfully got the job - but how can a UK graduate compete, when European grads do upwards of 5-6 internships in the london banks coz they can postpone their degree, come to london and do 4 internship back-to-back.

    I'm not ignorant as I successfully work in a FO role, with many nationalities - my MD interviewed a candidate for an associate trader for our desk - he'd completed so many internships, and he had an excuse for every internship as to why he wasn't hired - why can't HR just chuck these losers out if IB is so meritocratic?

    As I said I know you guys haven't experienced it yet, but UK graduates are just as smart and able, but many will never got a shot at an interview or AC.
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    Most of these European kids aren't from 6 year long programs in their native countries, they're european students who chose to study at british universities so they can graduate sooner.
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    it is true to say that the uk are unique in the respect that uni courses are 3 years. In most countries it take 4 years to get a degree and another 1 to obtain a masters. I know it to be true that you can get a masters in the UK for what the rest of europe would deem a undergraduate degree. That is hardly fair when the difference is not the quality of the work, but just the system of education. In the four year degree, its not the case that less work is done than the Uk degree-masters!

    At the end of the day, it is still alot of hassle for people from Europe to get to the UK and do their interviews. Its not as convenient. THe article seems very exagerated. Is it not the case that alot of people do their masters in the UK so they can get into banks? And seeing how banking is seen to be a top rated job, why should they not choose the most qualified people for it? The world isn't fair and thats that! people can complain and whatnot, but if it weren't based merit, what would be the preferred option?!
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    The main reason that you have so many Europeans in FO positions in London simply because of language requirements........ End of story.

    You dont want to hire a British lad to cover a French client..... that cannot be done as then the bank will loose business then....... French like talking to French in French..... likewise for every other country in Europe......... Scandi and Benelux is a little for neutral but the fact remains.....

    So, that leaves only UK and Ireland for the British lads........ which they have to compete with non-European UK students (from Asia, South AM, North AM, Africa).... so, I agree it is tougher for British lads to land a FO role......... but not because that they are not good enough....... just because people in London cover the whole of Europe which has many different languages and cultures........

    In my personal experience, I currently work in a large team where there are only 3 British guys out of 30......... the only reason being geographic coverage....... I am non European, therefore, I get to oversee only UK clients........ so, I have taken up a position which any British or European person could do....... whereas my colleague who covers France has only French people in his team.... he will ask me for help every now and then but will never let me talk to his clients as my french sucks
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    (Original post by worldisyours)
    I did one internship at got the job, don't see why peers on my grad programme did 4-5 S+T internships?!
    (Original post by worldisyours)
    I was 20 years old and in the second year of my degree - whilst the majority of my class had finished their degree and who had done 3-4 internships previously - now I got my job - but tell me how fair is that?
    (Original post by worldisyours)
    I dont mind the best people getting the job, I was a second-year when I did my internship and I successfully got the job
    (Original post by worldisyours)
    I'm not ignorant as I successfully work in a FO role
    We get it, you got the job! Effin ay! Well done, you are far superior to your continental much older and wiser peers.

    You know, from the sound of your whining I think you would benefit significantly from taking a few years off to mature a bit and "do degree after degree, internship after internship until i got the job". I think the main point that you seem to have forgotten about is that there is nothing stopping you from going to continental Europe to do the same thing you accuse other non-UK students for doing. You could for example go to the Nordic countries to undertake an MSc taught in English free of charge.

    The other point you make about people with many internships under their belt, yet no FT offers, really has nothing with the continental educational system to do. Trust me, they will have a hard time getting through the interview process and their "bull**** excuses" are likely to be seen through.
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    While language is a massive element and an advantage, from what I've seen, if you truly deserve the job, you'll get it. I am sure for every foreign grad at your bank, there are many other foreigners who didn't get it.

    Its very narrow minded to assume that their education system gives them a upper hand.
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    worldisyours obviously you are not ignorant, but the fact that you get a full time job in a FO position doesn't mean that you are way clever than anyone around. Investment Banking is not Rocket Science, you don't need a PhD in Physics but obviously if you have been studying longer it is very likely that you will be more prepared from a technical point of view.
    Then in S&T the languages are fundamental. At BarCap, for instance the Sales Dept. is divided in asset classes and every asset classes is then divided by regions (not by client typology, except for teams like HF or Central Banks...).
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    Breaking news: Banks choosing more qualified candidates over self-righteous UK layabouts......oh wait.
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    (Original post by Eklipz89)
    if you truly deserve the job, you'll get it.
    Couldn't say it better myself.

    Banks hire people based on:
    1. Business needs. If they need someone from a certain geographical region, they get someone from a certain geographical region.
    2. Calibre. If you're good, they hire you, non-British or not. And vice versa.
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    (Original post by worldisyours)
    I know that this site is predominately is for students who are just applying for internships. But wait till you get there, I know on my S+T internship and consequent grad programme, my European friends told me if they dont get this job they'd simply get a grant and do another masters, either in UK or USA.

    I dont mind the best people getting the job, I was a second-year when I did my internship and I successfully got the job - but how can a UK graduate compete, when European grads do upwards of 5-6 internships in the london banks coz they can postpone their degree, come to london and do 4 internship back-to-back.

    I'm not ignorant as I successfully work in a FO role, with many nationalities - my MD interviewed a candidate for an associate trader for our desk - he'd completed so many internships, and he had an excuse for every internship as to why he wasn't hired - why can't HR just chuck these losers out if IB is so meritocratic?

    As I said I know you guys haven't experienced it yet, but UK graduates are just as smart and able, but many will never got a shot at an interview or AC.
    Utter rubbish. Either your friends are totally non-typical or you're lying. I'm continental European, in my BB internship 70%+ were British, most Europeans hadn't had an internship previously and most of them had to fight very hard to get in because banks are obsessed about Oxbridge, UCL and LSE.

    Btw, you don't seem to know anything about European internships, they aren't designed to offer people a job. Noone gets offered a job after an internship in Germany (usually).
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    keep in mind that german companies like to talk to german bankers, french companies to french bankers, spanish companies to spanish bankers (you get the picture)..from this pov it would be rather unlogical to hire all uk ppl as u'd be risking to loose a lot of business..just my 2c
 
 
 
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