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    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/suffolk/4462310.stm

    Anyone with a BMI of over 30 gets turned away. Personally I think they should have their NI contributions refunded if they've been under the guise of being allowed to get free healthcare only to be turned away when it comes to the clinch.
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    Its nothing new, one my old university mates was obese he needed an operation on his knee, they said it would be too risky unless he lost weight. He is now about 13-14 stone so I am sure they will do it now. He used to be about 18-20 stone though.
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    yeah but they are even admitting that its due to financial reasons! it as tho they r being punished for being fat.

    my mum is overwieght but not because of her own fault!! its beacause she has been on and of steriods for about 30 years of her life, so now as well as bing on a diet for all that time through no fault of her own, she'd be punished further!!! great!
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    Why was she on Steroids though?
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    Actually I give props to the doctor who admitted financial reasons were to do with it. Involving the truth in matters like these in a rare occurrence these days.
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    its fair enough if its the person's fault for being that much overweight, if its something they had no effect on then its unfair.
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    Whats wrong with the doctors not wanting to dispose of dead fat people left right and centre? Clearly the cons out pros and they would do the operation if it was life or death anyway, but not for something that they can live with.
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    Where do you draw the line though? Today obese patients don't get orthopedic surgery. Tomorrow, do we stop cardiothoracic surgery for patients that drink and smoke?

    IMHO the NHS is a waste of money full stop. The sooner it's scrapped and we get our taxes back the better. Hopefully Patricia Hewitt will have it run into the ground in no time like she did with Rover...
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    Whats wrong with the doctors not wanting to dispose of dead fat people left right and centre? Clearly the cons out pros and they would do the operation if it was life or death anyway, but not for something that they can live with.
    Because these people pay taxes in order to get the healthcare they require. Under a privitized system there wouldn't be an issue, but it's not. You could say that these obese people have been defrauded of their money.
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    Right so if we get rid of the NHS who is going to pay for the operations of poorer members of society? The NHS is vitial the UK and it offers very good value for money in my opinion.

    Its part of what makes the UK so great.

    Can I ask you a question Kings? Have you ever been treated by the NHS for somthing fairly major?
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    (Original post by Kingspharm)
    Where do you draw the line though? Today obese patients don't get orthopedic surgery. Tomorrow, do we stop cardiothoracic surgery for patients that drink and smoke?

    IMHO the NHS is a waste of money full stop. The sooner it's scrapped and we get our taxes back the better. Hopefully Patricia Hewitt will have it run into the ground in no time like she did with Rover...
    Yeah good plan actually... i forgot to mention that... the people who smoke shouldn't be given free treatment on the NHS for smoking related problems, they should have to contribute to the costs definitely. But drinking... that as well i guess, but only for certain operations which are definitely caused by excessive drinking.
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    (Original post by Kard)
    Because these people pay taxes in order to get the healthcare they require. Under a privitized system there wouldn't be an issue, but it's not. You could say that these obese people have been defrauded of their money.
    I sort of agree with it but I don't. I think there needs to be some kind of warning system, where by a GP will tell them they need to loose weight and refer them to a weight loss scheme. If they are still obese in a years time or so and require treatment as a result then I don't think they should get it.

    I think it all depends on the exact circumstances though. I also think they should be offered a chance to loose weight and if they do it they can then have the operation.

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    (Original post by Swinely)
    Yeah good plan actually... i forgot to mention that... the people who smoke shouldn't be given free treatment on the NHS for smoking related problems, they should have to contribute to the costs definitely. But drinking... that as well i guess, but only for certain operations which are definitely caused by excessive drinking.
    Err I hate smoking and want it banned, but I am affraid smokers pay a lot of taxes on **** which go straight to the NHS so I cannot agree with this.
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    yeah something like that would be good, but not just for overweight people, for smokers and alcoholics too. They need a final warning in all fairness.
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    (Original post by Swinely)
    yeah something like that would be good, but not just for overweight people, for smokers and alcoholics too. They need a final warning in all fairness.
    The problem is we are now talking about 80% of the country. How many people do you think don't smoke, don't drink and stick to the RDA of everything?

    I think this system should only be implemted in extreme circumstances. A deep understanding of social policy will aso be required. As poorer people are more likely to smoke and drink, its not always their fault, its a apart of their culture and it can be very very hard to change that.
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    Why not though? if less people smoked then less money for smoking related illnesses would be needed anyway, they should be in proportion in theory anyway. As tax raised from smokers goes down so too should the tax required by the NHS for smoking related operations. Obesity, smoking, and alcohol greatly increase risks for several serious illnesses, so phasing these things out would lower the costs to the NHS anyway.


    edit- yeah ok, i meant excessive drinking, something like a few % are obese now, and probably quite a few % smoke and a few % are alcoholics, so all of these people.
    Yeah it would be hard to change that, but it has to be done, it would benefit the respect issue thats really not working nowadays if poorer people could be put off smoking etc etc etc.
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    I think the solution is better education and the government are doing that. People need to be a lot more aware, for example most microwave meals are more unhealthy than fish and chips in many ways but the general public don't realise that. I tin of soup I was going to have last night contained 4 grams of salt, so if I had bread with it it would been 6 grams, that is the RDA. So I didn't have any as I realise it was just E numbers and salt.

    This issue is so complicated and has been debated for years. What we have to remember is that most alcoholics and chain smokers don't choose to be like that way, they need help to give up.
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    Yes, but a lot of people don't want to give up anyway, and addicts..certainly give them help, but they have to really want to help themselves, otherwise theres no helping them at all.

    Smoking should be banned though, in public places if nothing else for the time being.Or maybe double the taxes? Subsidise healthy foods? Tax unhealthy foods? lots of things are possible..
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    I think a public ban is the only solution, raising taxes too high just increases the amount of imports on the black market. I am certainly in favour of subsidising healthy foods and taxing unhealthy ones, that is actually a very good idea.

    The situation with a lot of junk you get from the supermarket needs to stop, a lot of bread these days is actually just animal fat, a bit of yeast and a load of salt. Its no longer very healthy.
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    urgh yeah, i saw some bread the otherday which had more fat in than chocolate?? thats not right at all.
    It would pay the government back if they were to intervine and tax unhealthy foods and subsidise healthy ones, in the long run it would cost them less due to the increase of general health, and in the short term it should ballance out because it would take a while for people to get off the now taxed unhealthy foods so they would basically end up paying for the subsidies.
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    (Original post by AT82)
    Can I ask you a question Kings? Have you ever been treated by the NHS for somthing fairly major?
    I ended up in a waiting list last year, so I went private instead. Therefore I had to pay for my surgery twice, and I ended up seeing the same consultant that I did at the NHS hospital.

    We're talking about obesity, drinking and smoking here. How about attempted suicide? Is that worthy of intervention? How about car accidents? Should blame be apportioned before someone can undergo treatment and then only the innocent parties be treated free of charge?

    Either way, rationing of access to medical treatment is purely an economic measure - regardless of the 'clinical excuses' that are given to justify it. If, as some people have said in this thread, everyone has an equal entitlement to be treated free of charge by the NHS, then there can be no rationing. But at the same time, there just isn't enough money to go around for everyone to have what they want.

    It's an unfortunate fact that the NHS is an enormous drain on our country's economy - there is no way that it's current and future necessary spending can be sustained. Now that the Government has sold off our hospitals and is renting them back on the never-never, the organisation has next to no assets left either. It's about time that people stepped up and took responsibility for their own actions and situations.
 
 
 
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