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Jamie
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#401
Report 16 years ago
#401
(Original post by Jonatan)
Just answer me one question. The PLO has repeadately ignored the terrorist groups. Arafat encouraged teh last intifada, he gave palestinian schoolchildren free from school during the worst stone throwing campaigns aganist Israeli checkpoints, and they brodcast comercials promoting suecide bombings.

Are you saying israel should sit with their arms in the lap and watch their population being blown up at restaurants and buses, because the terrorist orginisations uses civilians as human shields? If teh palestinian giovernment does not try to stop the terrorism, then what choice does Israel have but to try to defend themselves the best they can?
You seem like a smart guy, so why can't you acknowledge that this is all tit for tat.
You go for the 1 sided 'israel is defending itself'
Others go for the 'palestinians trying to be free'
Why can't anyone realise Israelis kill innocents by accident (and sometimes deliberately) Palestinians then blow themselves up

OR

Palestinians blow themselves up, then Israeli military go for more terrorists and catch a few civilians in the crossfire

Tit
Tat
J
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Jamie
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#402
Report 16 years ago
#402
(Original post by Jonatan)
No, these people deliberately act as human shields on their own accord.
What about that lad who was shot trying to pick up a child in the street. Sure the soldier is now on trial for that, but are you telling me that in an army of kidshe's the only one guilty of shooting civilians? rubbish
J
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Jamie
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#403
Report 16 years ago
#403
(Original post by DoctorNO)
hell they are ALL to blame. who takes the larger shares of the blame? first the arabs and then the europeans.

Someone oughta take that land and give it to the chinese.
I think they have more than enough already
J
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DoctorNO
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#404
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#404
(Original post by foolfarian)
Why can't anyone realise Israelis kill innocents by accident (and sometimes deliberately) Palestinians then blow themselves up

OR

Palestinians blow themselves up, then Israeli military go for more terrorists and catch a few civilians in the crossfire
Exactly, mate. Those who are extremely one-sided are just adding fuel to the fire. What a bunch of idiots.
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ThornsnRoses
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#405
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#405
(Original post by foolfarian)
What about that lad who was shot trying to pick up a child in the street. Sure the soldier is now on trial for that, but are you telling me that in an army of kidshe's the only one guilty of shooting civilians? rubbish
J

ITS TOM HURNDALL! TOM HURNDALL...and about the several americans who got shot and died, and the peurto ricans who got shot at...many cases of israeli agression!
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ThornsnRoses
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#406
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#406
(Original post by DoctorNO)
Exactly, mate. Those who are extremely one-sided are just adding fuel to the fire. What a bunch of idiots.
But you have to acknowldge that it is primarly the Israeli sides fault...looking at history and all.
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DoctorNO
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#407
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#407
(Original post by ThornsnRoses)
But you have to acknowldge that it is primarly the Israeli sides fault...looking at history and all.
Looking at history and all I see it is mostly the arabs' fault and then the europeans.

The land of Israel lie in the most strategic region on earth and was the desire of everybody around it. The arabs conquered it, and then the greeks, then the romans, then the muslims. All the while Jews were exiled, massacred, oppressed, dhimmified, you name it. The jews survived all that and played every dirty trick in the book to try to win back and resettle their land. And they wanted all of it.


Its complicated business, mate. Nobody ought to be one-sided on this issue.
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DoctorNO
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#408
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#408
The only solution here is a partitioned land. One for jews, the other for palestine. But alas the never ending cycle of violence. And the never ending cycle of those who join sides.
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ThornsnRoses
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#409
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#409
(Original post by DoctorNO)
Looking at history and all I see it is mostly the arabs' fault and then the europeans.

The land of Israel lie in the most strategic region on earth and was the desire of everybody around it. The arabs conquered it, and then the greeks, then the romans, then the muslims. All the while Jews were exiled, massacred, oppressed, dhimmified, you name it. The jews survived all that and played every dirty trick in the book to try to win back and resettle their land.


Its complicated business, mate. Nobody ought to be one-sided on this issue.
not true...philistinites were there first...these are modren day palestinians! they may have adopted a diff culture, religion and language...its still their land!
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ThornsnRoses
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#410
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#410
(Original post by DoctorNO)
The only solution here is a partitioned land. One for jews, the other for palestine. But alas the never ending cycle of violence. And the never ending cycle of those who join sides.
Its Palestinian land...no one had the right to give it away least of all the Brits. That isnt a solution its a punishment!
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DoctorNO
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#411
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#411
(Original post by ThornsnRoses)
not true...philistinites were there first...these are modren day palestinians! they may have adopted a diff culture, religion and language...its still their land!
No those are two completely different people. The ancient philistines and the rest of the Canaanites have long been ASSIMILATED into the Israelites. The palestinians you see today are but the decendants of arab migrants into that land.
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Vienna
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#412
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#412
(Original post by foolfarian)
You seem like a smart guy, so why can't you acknowledge that this is all tit for tat.
You go for the 1 sided 'israel is defending itself'
Others go for the 'palestinians trying to be free'
Why can't anyone realise Israelis kill innocents by accident (and sometimes deliberately) Palestinians then blow themselves up

OR

Palestinians blow themselves up, then Israeli military go for more terrorists and catch a few civilians in the crossfire

Tit
Tat
J
i understand what you are saying but as your example highlights and jonaton (repeatedly) demonstrates, there is a difference between israelis targeting palestinian militants as they did yesterday where the majority of the dead were prominent Hamas members, and the suicide bombing today where a bus load of innocent civilians were targeted by a Palestinian who wished to kill them. tit for tat is based on the simple premise that they are equal in principle and magnitude, this is not applicable to the Israeli-Palestine situation. i would also AGAIN highlight the fact that the pro-Palestinians here, almost NEVER mention, consider or discuss the actions of the Palestinian authorities. it is also hilarious how the US gets blamed, although bearing in mind the anti-Israel lobby is most definately the anti-US lobby i guess its to be expected. on that point, i find that there arguments are nothing more than leftist humanitarian whining...

ps. israel just released hundreds of prisoners in return for the safety of a business man and 3 IDF bodies. i overly generous deal if u ask me.
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Vienna
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#413
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#413
(Original post by ThornsnRoses)
Its Palestinian land...no one had the right to give it away least of all the Brits. That isnt a solution its a punishment!
and thats why views like these are politically marginalised.
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Jamie
Badges: 18
#414
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#414
(Original post by vienna95)
i understand what you are saying but as your example highlights and jonaton (repeatedly) demonstrates, there is a difference between israelis targeting palestinian militants as they did yesterday where the majority of the dead were prominent Hamas members, and the suicide bombing today where a bus load of innocent civilians were targeted by a Palestinian who wished to kill them. tit for tat is based on the simple premise that they are equal in principle and magnitude, this is not applicable to the Israeli-Palestine situation. i would also AGAIN highlight the fact that the pro-Palestinians here, almost NEVER mention, consider or discuss the actions of the Palestinian authorities. it is also hilarious how the US gets blamed, although bearing in mind the anti-Israel lobby is most definately the anti-US lobby i guess its to be expected. on that point, i find that there arguments are nothing more than leftist humanitarian whining...

ps. israel just released hundreds of prisoners in return for the safety of a business man and 3 IDF bodies. i overly generous deal if u ask me.
Perhaps overgenerous, or perhaps the people they were holding really weren't much of a threat. After all, the lebannese milita has said they are going to try to kidnap more Israelis intruding on their land as bargaining power, whats to say the Israelis haven't done the same with some petty palestinian criminals
J
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Blamps
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#415
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#415
(Original post by ThornsnRoses)
not true...philistinites were there first...these are modren day palestinians! they may have adopted a diff culture, religion and language...its still their land!
You adopt the hammer and sickle avatar yet you are debating who the land belongs to....what about the "Property is theft" and all that leftist propaganda
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Vienna
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#416
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#416
(Original post by foolfarian)
Perhaps overgenerous, or perhaps the people they were holding really weren't much of a threat. After all, the lebannese milita has said they are going to try to kidnap more Israelis intruding on their land as bargaining power, whats to say the Israelis haven't done the same with some petty palestinian criminals
J
30 of the 100 or so prisoners were leading Hamas figures. i wouldnt be too happy if i was an Israeli, but at least id know that my country is willing to do everything to protect my life and not send me to blow myself up.
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Jamie
Badges: 18
#417
Report 16 years ago
#417
(Original post by vienna95)
30 of the 100 or so prisoners were leading Hamas figures. i wouldnt be too happy if i was an Israeli, but at least id know that my country is willing to do everything to protect my life and not send me to blow myself up.
? palestine isn't sending anyone. The terrrorist organistations are
J
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Jamie
Badges: 18
#418
Report 16 years ago
#418
(Original post by vienna95)
i understand what you are saying but as your example highlights and jonaton (repeatedly) demonstrates, there is a difference between israelis targeting palestinian militants as they did yesterday where the majority of the dead were prominent Hamas members, and the suicide bombing today where a bus load of innocent civilians were targeted by a Palestinian who wished to kill them. tit for tat is based on the simple premise that they are equal in principle and magnitude, this is not applicable to the Israeli-Palestine situation. i would also AGAIN highlight the fact that the pro-Palestinians here, almost NEVER mention, consider or discuss the actions of the Palestinian authorities. it is also hilarious how the US gets blamed, although bearing in mind the anti-Israel lobby is most definately the anti-US lobby i guess its to be expected. on that point, i find that there arguments are nothing more than leftist humanitarian whining...

ps. israel just released hundreds of prisoners in return for the safety of a business man and 3 IDF bodies. i overly generous deal if u ask me.
"i find that there arguments are nothing more than leftist humanitarian whining..." Easy to say sitting in front of a computer in a free country, knowing that your building isn't about to demolished in an attempt to kill a nearby terrorist/in case there are tunnels under it/because someone who's son just blew themself up lives there/because it's in the way of a 'fence'...

J
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EI_123
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#419
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#419
(Original post by foolfarian)
"i find that there arguments are nothing more than leftist humanitarian whining..." Easy to say sitting in front of a computer in a free country, knowing that your building isn't about to demolished in an attempt to kill a nearby terrorist/in case there are tunnels under it/because someone who's son just blew themself up lives there/because it's in the way of a 'fence'...

J
You are in front of a computer too, do you have any experience of a non free country?
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UWC student
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#420
Report 16 years ago
#420
(Original post by llama boy)
I won't argue back because that post isn't really an argument to start with.
Listen up everything that was said and more is all true and you can check every book in History. Until you live through this pain, Do not dare to speak of it, as you have no clue.

If you have any questions about those alleged holes in the so called propaganda, please do not hasitate to ask me, and I promise to fill in the gap.

Hadar
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