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gemgems89
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#781
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#781
(Original post by llama boy)
Yes...

I think, on closer examination, you might find that post not to be entirely serious.
On closer examination, nor was mine.
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thefish_uk
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#782
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#782
So is this discussion going anywhere right now?

It's at 40 pages and hasn't broken up yet really...

It's getting extremely political though, and more difficult to follow.
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gemgems89
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#783
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#783
(Original post by thefish_uk)
Well that's stupid.

I guess there are so many militant groups and independent terrorists operating that it'd be impossible to reach an agreement with all of them at once. And that's why Israel decides to clear them out forcefully.
It's all very well saying peace would solve everything. But peace isn't, I'm afraid, what the Palestinians want. There has been proof like in the post ReadMe posted that the Israelis have offered a number of peace treaties and cease fires, all of which have either been rejected or broken.
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DoctorNO
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#784
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#784
<delete>
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gemgems89
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#785
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#785
(Original post by thefish_uk)
So is this discussion going anywhere right now?

It's at 40 pages and hasn't broken up yet really...

It's getting extremely political though, and more difficult to follow.
No, I can't see it going anywhere since it's a debate with mixed views and opinions. It will never conclude. No side are going to back down, but I really don't see why people are so motivated to defend Palestine.
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DoctorNO
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#786
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#786
(Original post by thefish_uk)
Well that's stupid.

I guess there are so many militant groups and independent terrorists operating that it'd be impossible to reach an agreement with all of them at once. And that's why Israel decides to clear them out forcefully.
Thats why I think the Wall makes sense.
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thefish_uk
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#787
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#787
(Original post by gemgems89)
It's all very well saying peace would solve everything. But peace isn't, I'm afraid, what the Palestinians want. There has been proof like in the post ReadMe posted that the Israelis have offered a number of peace treaties and cease fires, all of which have either been rejected or broken.
Yes, but are these terrorist groups representitive of the views of the general Palestinian people? Or the Palestinian leadership?

Look at a lot of the terrorists that attack the West, for example. Rather than believe that Islam hates the West, we learn that there are some extremists who like to attack us and the rest of the world's Muslims are embarrassed at their actions.

But are the Palestinian people proud of what the terrorists do for them?
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thefish_uk
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#788
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#788
(Original post by DoctorNO)
Thats why I think the Wall makes sense.
Guess so...

It's an extremely difficult situation for both sides, especially if all the violence is called by extremist terrorist groups.
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DoctorNO
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#789
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#789
(Original post by thefish_uk)
But are the Palestinian people proud of what the terrorists do for them?
What do you think of the roads in Palestine where large Portraits of "martyrs" are displayed and adored?
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jammyd
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#790
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#790
(Original post by gemgems89)
It's all very well saying peace would solve everything. But peace isn't, I'm afraid, what the Palestinians want. There has been proof like in the post ReadMe posted that the Israelis have offered a number of peace treaties and cease fires, all of which have either been rejected or broken.
You think that Palestinians don't want peace?
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DoctorNO
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#791
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#791
Dear Gemgems,


Do you think its right for Jews to build settlements in Palestinian territory? Yes I know a good number of them legally bought their lands from palestinian brokers (who most likely ended up hanged by fellow palestinians).
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Jamie
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#792
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#792
(Original post by gemgems89)
There was a cease fire last July, a suicide bomber broke it.
last july you say? heres what happened last July...



first the beginning

"Chris McGreal in Jerusalem
Monday June 30, 2003

Hamas, Islamic Jihad and Yasser Arafat's Fatah movement yesterday formally declared a ceasefire in the intifada against Israeli occupation that has lasted nearly three years and claimed more than 3,000 lives.
Hours later, the Israeli army began to pull its forces out of most of the Gaza Strip under American pressure to alleviate the plight of Palestinian civilians and bolster support for the US-led road map to peace.

But within minutes of the ceasefire declaration, Israel dismissed the truce as a "trick". The foreign minister, Silvan Shalom, told the US national security adviser, Condoleezza Rice, that it was a "ticking bomb" designed to "maintain the infrastructure of terror".

A Palestinian cabinet minister, Yasser Abed Rabbo, welcomed the ceasefire and called on the Israeli government to reciprocate by "declaring an end to all violence against Palestinians as is required in the road map".
"

Next israel severed links with any news broadcasters they view as unsympathetic.

"Jason Deans and agencies
Tuesday July 1, 2003

The Israeli government has accused the BBC of competing with the "worst of Nazi propaganda" and severed ties with the corporation over a documentary broadcast internationally over the weekend.
BBC journalists will still be able to report from Israel, but the government will no longer invite corporation journalists to special briefings or grant them interviews.

The Israeli government has been critical of the BBC's coverage of the three-year-old Palestinian uprising and saw the international broadcast of the documentary, Israel's Secret Weapon, on the country's alleged nuclear and chemical weapons programmes on Saturday as the last straw.

"The way the BBC is trying to portray Israel competes with the worst of Nazi propaganda," the Israeli government's press office head, Danny Seaman, told Reuters.

"In the guise of journalistic integrity it lends support to evil portrayals of Israel and the Jewish people which has been done before in the gravest circumstances," Mr Seaman added.
"

"Chris McGreal in Beit Eksa
Thursday July 3, 2003

The Israeli government has confiscated hundreds of acres of Palestinian land on the West Bank this week - for the purpose, Palestinians allege, of building settlements - in flagrant breach of commitments under the US-led road map to peace.
Yesterday, an Israeli official and soldiers were marking out swaths of olive groves and other ground outside the villages of Beit Eksa and Beit Souriq, north of Jerusalem.

"State land. Entry prohibited," read a sign erected on village land in the name of the civil administration of Judea and Samaria, the Israeli body that oversees military rule in the West Bank.

The Palestinians say the Israelis plan to build settlements to link two Jewish towns constructed on land seized from the Arab villages in the 1980s. The accusation would fit with existing Israeli plans for a "greater Jerusalem".

The new land seizure came on the day Israel handed over the West Bank city of Bethlehem to Palestinian police. Church bells pealed in celebration and Palestinian police patrolled the town with their sirens blaring. "

"4 Jul 2003
Israeli claim of victory denounced "

"Tuesday July 8, 2003

An Islamic Jihad cell today claimed responsibility for last night's suicide bombing in an Israeli village that killed a 65-year-old woman.
The suicide bombing, in the village of Kfar Yavetz, was the first since three Palestinian militant groups declared a ceasefire on June 30. The last Palestinian suicide bombing, on a bus in Jerusalem on June 11, killed 17 people.
"


I suppose you have to make your own mind up whether the land grab broke the peace, or the suicide bombing. I would say the latter was relatiation.

J
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Jamie
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#793
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#793
(Original post by gemgems89)
It's all very well saying peace would solve everything. But peace isn't, I'm afraid, what the Palestinians want. There has been proof like in the post ReadMe posted that the Israelis have offered a number of peace treaties and cease fires, all of which have either been rejected or broken.
I could offer you £5 quid for your car. It's a sh*tte offer that you'd be stupid to accept, but it's an offer.
Same with these peace treaties
J
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Jamie
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#794
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#794
(Original post by foolfarian)
but the question remains, do you support the building of these settlements because of your religion
or do you condemn them because it is pure and simple theft of land
J
Recall that many christian religions decided that America was a promised land - and stole the land from the native indians
The question still stands, and has been avoided several times already.
J
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thefish_uk
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#795
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#795
(Original post by foolfarian)
I could offer you £5 quid for your car. It's a sh*tte offer that you'd be stupid to accept, but it's an offer.
Same with these peace treaties
J
1. She doesn't have a car. She's too young for a car, but she still manages to defend herself in front of the likes of you.

2. She's gone offline for the night.

3. Who here has given Gems negative reputation?
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Jonatan
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#796
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#796
I am getting sort of tiered of arguing about the ME conflict. But I have a couple of things to say:

I think Israel has gotn a huge lot of **** mainly due to public opinion. One thing are those people who critisize Israel because they disagree with their politics, but when people are talking about propaganda in Israeli media , and at the same time insisting that Israel is a monarchy (I had quite some trouble convincing one very anti-Israel girl that Israel did not have a king as head of state) then I get annoyed. MAny of those who critisize Israel doesnt know **** about the conflict, but they criticise it because they have heard some politically correct statement on TV.
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kildare
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#797
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#797
(Original post by thefish_uk)
1. She doesn't have a car. She's too young for a car, but she still manages to defend herself in front of the likes of you.

2. She's gone offline for the night.

3. Who here has given Gems negative reputation?
great response.
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DoctorNO
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#798
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#798
Is Gems a jew? a christian?
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username9816
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#799
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#799
(Original post by thefish_uk)
3. Who here has given Gems negative reputation?
people who are jealous of her 8 gems.

btw: a while ago fish, u promised me rep for my help for your maths exam, but you 4 got to give it.
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thefish_uk
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#800
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#800
(Original post by DoctorNO)
Is Gems a jew? a christian?
What does it matter?

She is Jewish; although she isn't religious, she sees is as an important part of her identity.

And I don't want you to come up with some bull**** about indoctrination or religious brainwashing.
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