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I will die by suicide at some point in my life. Watch

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    Erm...why would you even have these thoughts???

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    I've suffered from depression 3 years, on and off. I've had counselling and been prescribed anti-depressants and nothing really worked.

    What really worked for me, was me actually opening up and communicating, and letting myself be vulnerable with the people I cared about. I stopped being reclusive, and started taking an active role in my life.

    Too many young people claim to have depression, seriously if it is such a problem go do something proactive, inside of taking pointless anti-depressants.
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    Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. It may be bad today or tomorrow, but it won't always be that bad, there will be good days, and brilliant days. Is your life worth "solving" all your temporary problems?
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    (Original post by thru sun and rain)
    Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. It may be bad today or tomorrow, but it won't always be that bad, there will be good days, and brilliant days. Is your life worth "solving" all your temporary problems?
    I hate when people say this. How do you know anyone's problems are temporary? Let's say person A has incurable lifelong clinical depression. That's not temporary so suicide is very much a permanent solution to a lifelong unsolvable problem. That's just an example, but it's not like every problem is definitely temporary or solvable.
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    (Original post by Sabertooth)
    I hate when people say this. How do you know anyone's problems are temporary? Let's say person A has incurable lifelong clinical depression. That's not temporary so suicide is very much a permanent solution to a lifelong unsolvable problem. That's just an example, but it's not like every problem is definitely temporary or solvable.
    Because I also suffer depression. I have suffered it since i was 13/14. I am now coming up to 22. I also am at risk of post natal depression.
    I said it because it is the way I force myself to look at the situation at hand and for some reason it makes it more bearable. Depression does not necessarily have to be a long term problem. With the right treatment and help it can be beaten.
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    (Original post by Sabertooth)
    I hate when people say this. How do you know anyone's problems are temporary? Let's say person A has incurable lifelong clinical depression. That's not temporary so suicide is very much a permanent solution to a lifelong unsolvable problem. That's just an example, but it's not like every problem is definitely temporary or solvable.
    Surely that is assuming that
    a) you can never recover from depression
    b) Medicine will never make any advances in curing depression
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    (Original post by thru sun and rain)
    Because I also suffer depression. I have suffered it since i was 13/14. I am now coming up to 22. I also am at risk of post natal depression.
    I said it because it is the way I force myself to look at the situation at hand and for some reason it makes it more bearable. Depression does not necessarily have to be a long term problem. With the right treatment and help it can be beaten.
    In many cases. In others it is incurable. Just because some people do get better doesn't mean every single person with depression will. That's why I was very specific to use the example of person A not every single person with depression.


    (Original post by screenager2004)
    Surely that is assuming that
    a) you can never recover from depression
    b) Medicine will never make any advances in curing depression
    a) no I didn't assume that, I said person A has specific incurable depression. Not that all depression is incurable. It's a fact that some forms are currently incurable.

    b) great, 80 depressed years just to wait for a cure. Maybe one day, maybe tomorrow, they'll develop a cure for cancer, doesn't mean all those people suffering in pain shouldn't be allowed to use euthanasia to get out of their situation.
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    (Original post by Sabertooth)
    I hate when people say this. How do you know anyone's problems are temporary? Let's say person A has incurable lifelong clinical depression. That's not temporary so suicide is very much a permanent solution to a lifelong unsolvable problem. That's just an example, but it's not like every problem is definitely temporary or solvable.
    I agree, but the problem is you can never find out that it's incurable, because there's always the chance you'll be cured tomorrow. You can only ever find out that it's curable.
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    (Original post by Sabertooth)
    In many cases. In others it is incurable. Just because some people do get better doesn't mean every single person with depression will. That's why I was very specific to use the example of person A not every single person with depression.




    a) no I didn't assume that, I said person A has specific incurable depression. Not that all depression is incurable. It's a fact that some forms are currently incurable.

    b) great, 80 depressed years just to wait for a cure. Maybe one day, maybe tomorrow, they'll develop a cure for cancer, doesn't mean all those people suffering in pain shouldn't be allowed to use euthanasia to get out of their situation.
    Cancer is completely different to depression. the similarity to cancer and depression is that they both can be curable.

    and just because something isn't curable today doesn't necessarily mean it won't be curable in 10/20/30 years time. Progression is key.
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    (Original post by superwolf)
    I agree, but the problem is you can never find out that it's incurable, because there's always the chance you'll be cured tomorrow. You can only ever find out that it's curable.
    Absolutely, but you can make a rational decision based on your experiences. For instance, if you've tried most/all the drugs available, various different types of talking therapies as well as major lifestyle changes and a large number of years have passed I think it's pretty safe to say that you've tried everything.

    However, obviously there's always the small "what if tomorrow x happens" but you can say that for everything in life, you have to draw a line somewhere. E.g. I'm not going to sell my computer to pay my bill because tomorrow I may win millions. I may win millions, but I probably won't.
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    (Original post by superwolf)
    I agree, but the problem is you can never find out that it's incurable, because there's always the chance you'll be cured tomorrow. You can only ever find out that it's curable.
    However that is the same for many illnesses. Cancer an example used by Sabertooth.
    Cancer has an higher death rate than depression. Cancer can kill the person afflicted by it, but the person can also be cured with extensive treatment. Depression does not itself kill the person it affects. The affected person is what "terminates" the life.
    Many cancer sufferers hold on to that tiny glimpse of hope that somehow they will be cured. So why is it wrong to say that suicide is a permanent solution?

    Someone who suffers with depression may not see the light through all their troubles (hell I know how hard it can be) but there is always someone out there who is willing to help pull them through no matter what.
    Not many people want to grasp at that hook though.
    Why should people tiptoe around a problem and say suicide is surely the way for me to go.?

    Suicide is permanent, and with death you will never know what good things could have come by pulling through it?
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    (Original post by thru sun and rain)
    Cancer is completely different to depression. the similarity to cancer and depression is that they both can be curable.

    and just because something isn't curable today doesn't necessarily mean it won't be curable in 10/20/30 years time. Progression is key.
    See post above.

    You've also got to consider whether life is going to be worth living after waiting 30 years with depression for a cure (which, I remind you, may never come). Life would have to be pretty ****ing awesome to make up for 30+ years of depression, and, let's be honest, life is rarely ever that awesome.

    You're going to be over 50, you'll probably be dying from some disease or another, you'll have no friends left as depression has driven them a way, most your family will be dead, you'll be stuck in a crap job as depression robbed your ability to get decent qualifications, you have a crap house because of your crap job, you may have self harm scars all over you, you may have side effects from 30 years of taking crappy drugs to try control your depression. Worth it? No.
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    (Original post by Sabertooth)
    See post above.

    You've also got to consider whether life is going to be worth living after waiting 30 years with depression for a cure (which, I remind you, may never come). Life would have to be pretty ****ing awesome to make up for 30+ years of depression, and, let's be honest, life is rarely ever that awesome.

    You're going to be over 50, you'll probably be dying from some disease or another, you'll have no friends left as depression has driven them a way, most your family will be dead, you'll be stuck in a crap job as depression robbed your ability to get decent qualifications, you have a crap house because of your crap job, you may have self harm scars all over you, you may have side effects from 30 years of taking crappy drugs to try control your depression. Worth it? No.
    Ok,
    What if things are going so bad you do not want to go on, you feel suicide is the answer feel like its the cure to all your problems you attempt and fail. Lets say you attempt to hang yourself. What if that fails? You end up severely physically disabled living a worse off life because you didn't want to carry on with the life you were living previously?
    What if you take an overdose? But it doesn't work efficiently, your liver will take a beating your body will slowly die off bit by bit in severe pain possibly hospitalised, your quality of life will continue to deteriorate. You'd be under constant watch therefore unable to replicate what you had done.
    These are just scenarios of what could happen if someone attempts and doesn't succeed. Is any of that pain worth it all for the want of ending something which could possibly get better?
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    (Original post by thru sun and rain)
    However that is the same for many illnesses. Cancer an example used by Sabertooth.
    Cancer has an higher death rate than depression. Cancer can kill the person afflicted by it, but the person can also be cured with extensive treatment. Depression does not itself kill the person it affects. The affected person is what "terminates" the life.
    Many cancer sufferers hold on to that tiny glimpse of hope that somehow they will be cured. So why is it wrong to say that suicide is a permanent solution?

    Someone who suffers with depression may not see the light through all their troubles (hell I know how hard it can be) but there is always someone out there who is willing to help pull them through no matter what.
    Not many people want to grasp at that hook though.
    Why should people tiptoe around a problem and say suicide is surely the way for me to go.?

    Suicide is permanent, and with death you will never know what good things could have come by pulling through it?
    Well they're not quite the same, because with cancer it's impossible (or at least highly unlikely) that it'll just disappear overnight for no apparent reason. Whereas with depression that can happen, even if it's still not likely.

    But what Sabertooth's saying (I think) is that once you've ruled out all the other solutions, and it's very unlikely that your depression will ever leave you, suicide is rationally the only solution you have left. And part of its attraction is that it is a permanent solution, because by taking it you're guaranteed to end your suffering forever (unless if it turns out hell exists after all, then you're really screwed).
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    (Original post by superwolf)
    (unless if it turns out hell exists after all, then you're really screwed).
    Unless you fail and would then basically be living hell on earth (as I so morbidly described in my previous post) I may actually delete that. It is quite of a :wtf: moment where I don't even know why i wrote it :/
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    (Original post by thru sun and rain)
    Ok,
    What if things are going so bad you do not want to go on, you feel suicide is the answer feel like its the cure to all your problems you attempt and fail. Lets say you attempt to hang yourself. What if that fails? You end up severely physically disabled living a worse off life because you didn't want to carry on with the life you were living previously?
    What if you take an overdose? But it doesn't work efficiently, your liver will take a beating your body will slowly die off bit by bit in severe pain possibly hospitalised, your quality of life will continue to deteriorate. You'd be under constant watch therefore unable to replicate what you had done.
    These are just scenarios of what could happen if someone attempts and doesn't succeed. Is any of that pain worth it all for the want of ending something which could possibly get better?
    Since when has the worst scenario/your own incompetence ever been a catch-all excuse not to do something? I take it you never get in a car in case it crashes? or a plane? or play football in case a tackle breaks your leg?

    Is taking the chance of anything you mentioned happening worth ending the pain of a lifetime of depression? Obviously yes, that chance is worth it to a great many people, otherwise not one single person in the world would attempt suicide.
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    (Original post by thru sun and rain)
    Unless you fail and would then basically be living hell on earth (as I so morbidly described in my previous post) I may actually delete that. It is quite of a :wtf: moment where I don't even know why i wrote it :/
    Yes, but if you've been depressed and suicidal for years, by that point you've probably come up with a pretty foolproof plan. I know I have (not gonna say what it is though :ninja:), the only way it could fail is if I chickened out, in which case fine, or if someone found me, which could easily be avoided by locking the door/staying in a hotel. I don't have any statistics to back this up, but I expect the reason why a lot of suicides fail is because the person hasn't thought it through completely.
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    (Original post by Sabertooth)
    Since when has the worst scenario/your own incompetence ever been a catch-all excuse not to do something? I take it you never get in a car in case it crashes? or a plane? or play football in case a tackle breaks your leg?

    Is taking the chance of anything you mentioned happening worth ending the pain of a lifetime of depression? Obviously yes, that chance is worth it to a great many people, otherwise not one single person in the world would attempt suicide.
    (admittedly I get very paranoid in a car but thats not fear of my life :o:) Paranoia has indeed gotten the worst of me.

    However, if you asked all the people who tried and failed they would say it was the worst thing they had ever done.
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    (Original post by superwolf)
    Yes, but if you've been depressed and suicidal for years, by that point you've probably come up with a pretty foolproof plan. I know I have (not gonna say what it is though :ninja:), the only way it could fail is if I chickened out, in which case fine, or if someone found me, which could easily be avoided by locking the door/staying in a hotel. I don't have any statistics to back this up, but I expect the reason why a lot of suicides fail is because the person hasn't thought it through completely.
    Unfortunately that isn't always the case with everyone.
    I have heard of an case where a woman tried to hang herself, (in front of her you child) I can't remember the specifics, but paramedics got her to hospital, and she survived, as a vegetable. (dont like the term vegetable) They said she would never talk or do anything again, but she has been a very lucky person where her body healed and with in 2 weeks she was walking again talking, back to how she was before. She was very lucky because not everyone who attempts and fails is that lucky.

    Life is a very valuable thing, and though whilst depressed many people cannot see that. There are many people around the world dying from incurable diseases that wish just to have that little longer, but will never get it. and unfortunately there are many people suffering from depression that want it over. That find nothing worth fighting for, and I see it as a shame. One person can achieve so much, but choose to throw it away for fear of never being cured.
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    Someone once said that suicide is the worst sort of murder because the offender has no time to repent. Think about it.
 
 
 
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