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Funny how those marching today want higher taxes and less cuts?? watch

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    (Original post by Planar)
    If he closed them all then tax would go up to 26%, and many businesses would move out(and who could blame them). He mustn't close them all.
    He says he is intent of doing so...and since he is the Chancellor we have to presume that he knows best.



    I happen to live in Northern Ireland. It is lovely in parts. A lot of it's depressingly poor and backwards, however. Spectre of the Troubles and all that.
    Indeed...'tis very sad. The Republic does not suffer from the same conditions that NI does in parts because they were relatively untouched by 'The Troubles' that dogged the six counties.

    Britain is going down a similar path, but we're not in as bad a quandary as the Irish.
    Here is Britain, we did not have the excitement of the dizzy heights of the Celtic Tiger economy. Lending was widely encouraged; people had fantastic homes built and bought properties oversees too. Social welfare was extremely generous in comparison to the UK. The socio-economic changes that came principally from the EU were remarkable - particularly in regards road infrastructure and I noticed how I went from being a relatively affluent visitor in comparison to the local people to a poor neighbour prior to the recession.

    We're doing what they should have done years ago.
    I hope for all our sakes living here that your optimism is justified. It is only time that will tell, my friend.
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    (Original post by yawn)
    He says he is intent of doing so...and since he is the Chancellor we have to presume that he knows best.

    He's a politician too, he's hardly going to come out and say, "I like it when big businesses avoid taxes!"


    Indeed...'tis very sad. The Republic does not suffer from the same conditions that NI does in parts because they were relatively untouched by 'The Troubles' that dogged the six counties.
    The Republic doesn't benefit from being part of the UK either.

    I hope for all our sakes living here that your optimism is justified. It is only time that will tell, my friend.
    My optimism is justified. If we went on as we had been doing, or engaged in a really slow deficit reduction, then future generations would be spending a lot of their lives suffering for it. I wish some other generations could deal with the huge deficit instead, but it's got to be the one before ours, and ours too. History will thank us, and praise us.
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    I wonder how many of these people complaining about tax avoidance have pensions or ISAs. These are tax avoidance schemes and, by an extension of their logic, should also be taxed the **** out of.

    No. Like all fundamental hyprocites, these people should be ignored. They possess no faculties of reason, only entitlement, and if this time next year the majority of those on the streets of London yesterday are on the breadline then we are headed in the right direction.

    Sadly, with our quisling conservative administration, it won't happen.
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    (Original post by im so academic)
    Tax avoidance is 100% legal. Tax evasion however is not.
    There's a fine line between the two. Much of the problem is that companies are using extremely contrived methods of avoiding tax which, while legal, are clearly something the public is justifiably angry about. These contrived methods are the kind of avoidance that should be clamped down upon, not the kind of tax sensible decisions that governments often encourage.
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    (Original post by yawn)
    Maybe you didn't watch all the interviews with the people marching to see that they covered a wide spectrum of society.
    Wide spectrum of society???

    The only protesters who earn over 25k were the union leaders!!
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    (Original post by london12)
    Oh boo hoo!

    EMA didnt exist when I was at school and i was from a poor background, guess what I did......... got a saturday job!
    It's not always that easy to get a saturday job, my friend was from a VERY poor background, her dad had died and her mom was a nurse and then she got made redundant, my friend relied on her ema to get her from her home to college everyday. She looked for a job from before she started college and didn't get one until half way through A2, the job combined with her ema meant she had enough for travel, books and paper etc. She didn't spend it on shoes or anything.

    I know some people do and tbf i think getting rid of it for the majority of those who recieved it is fair considering the budget deficit, but those on very low/none existent family incomes should still recieve something even if it is in the form of a bus pass etc. or they're not really getting the same opportunities as others attending their college/school and considering equality is supposed to be something this country stands for i think it's fair.

    Personally, my parents could afford to buy me what i needed and i managed to get a job aswell so i was very lucky, not everyone is so fortunate though and i'm perfectly happy with some of the tax i've paid in the past and will pay in the future going to help such people recieve an education. Most people in the area she lives in have 2 kids, a council flat and a drug addiction by her age.

    I'm sure if you hadn't been able to find a job and they offered you ema or something similar you would have taken it to be honest.
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    (Original post by london12)
    Oh boo hoo!

    EMA didnt exist when I was at school and i was from a poor background, guess what I did......... got a saturday job!
    And getting a saturday job is much much harder right now. Especially in poorer areas, and especially for people who don't have a car or have family who can get them a job.

    (Original post by ish90an)
    if anything we now know the only people who care so much as to "protest" are unions, layabout students and wannabe anarchists.
    You really are naive aren't you?
    The protest consisisted of many normal people. Normal people who are worred about losing their jobs and worried about their futures.
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    (Original post by london12)
    Wide spectrum of society???

    The only protesters who earn over 25k were the union leaders!!
    Absolute rubbish. I know personally of many people on the protest march who fulfil the descriptions of those I wrote about.

    Maybe your field of representative members of society doesn't expand as widely as mine and thus your knowledge of the participants is somewhat limited because of this.


    Originally Posted by WelshBluebird
    And getting a saturday job is much much harder right now. Especially in poorer areas, and especially for people who don't have a car or have family who can get them a job.

    This is so true. The congregation at my Parish church regularly contribute to food parcels for the poor and needy. Our Parish Priest asked us yesterday if we could check our cupboards and see if there was more we could provide as there has been an increasing number of callers at the church, now approaching an average of one hundred a week. There is no casual work for them anymore and they are desperate.

    We have no idea of how some people have to eke out an existence because of circumstances beyond their control and it incenses me to read some of the off-hand comments of those whose lives are more comfortable than those they appear to despise. They need to live in the shoes of these unfortunate people for a few months to give them a different perspective.
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    (Original post by EdwardCurrent)
    I wonder how many of these people complaining about tax avoidance have pensions or ISAs. These are tax avoidance schemes and, by an extension of their logic, should also be taxed the **** out of.

    No. Like all fundamental hyprocites, these people should be ignored. They possess no faculties of reason, only entitlement, and if this time next year the majority of those on the streets of London yesterday are on the breadline then we are headed in the right direction.

    Sadly, with our quisling conservative administration, it won't happen.
    Pensions and ISA's are actively encouraged since they create employment...whereas putting your business in the name of your wife who lives offshore does not - and is an illustration of what a tax loophole actually is. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by yawn)
    Pensions and ISA's are actively encouraged since they create employment...whereas putting your business in the name of your wife who lives offshore does not - and is an illustration of what a tax loophole actually is. :rolleyes:
    Hang on, tax loopholes are ok if they create jobs? So if Philip Green's putting some of those tax savings into his business and opening more stores(i.e. more jobs) it is ok yes?
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    (Original post by WelshBluebird)
    And getting a saturday job is much much harder right now. Especially in poorer areas, and especially for people who don't have a car or have family who can get them a job.



    You really are naive aren't you?
    The protest consisisted of many normal people. Normal people who are worred about losing their jobs and worried about their futures.
    500k out of 62m. More people turned up at the Iraq war protests and there wasn't even a Facebook then to publicize it. I am sure the coalition trembled in its boots at the sight of "so many"(or a small %age as it actually was) of the normal people.
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    (Original post by ish90an)
    500k out of 62m. More people turned up at the Iraq war protests and there wasn't even a Facebook then to publicize it. I am sure the coalition trembled in its boots at the sight of "so many"(or a small %age as it actually was) of the normal people.
    I wasn't saying anything about the size of the protest. Just correcting your wrong ideas about the people who made up the protest.
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    (Original post by yawn)
    Pensions and ISA's are actively encouraged since they create employment...whereas putting your business in the name of your wife who lives offshore does not - and is an illustration of what a tax loophole actually is. :rolleyes:
    So tax avoidance is okay if it happens to fit in with your personal prejudices? This is hypocrisy of the highest order.

    In any case, tell me how pensions and ISAs create employment. And then tell me how taxation creates employment.

    You can't have your cake and eat it too.
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    (Original post by yawn)
    Pensions and ISA's are actively encouraged since they create employment...whereas putting your business in the name of your wife who lives offshore does not - and is an illustration of what a tax loophole actually is. :rolleyes:
    How do they create employment?
    Have you not come across the concept of opportunity cost?
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    (Original post by Quady)
    How do they create employment?
    Have you not come across the concept of opportunity cost?
    Presumably she meant through investment. Pension funds and ISAs are invariably invested in equity in some proportion, and so encourage growth and eventually jobs. If the tax benefits were removed, then it would be bad for growth and jobs -- true enough. There is no opportunity cost because the capital otherwise goes into a government black hole.

    But the same is true of any taxation.

    She can't have her cake and eat it too.
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    (Original post by EdwardCurrent)
    Presumably she meant through investment. Pension funds and ISAs are invariably invested in equity in some proportion, and so encourage growth and eventually jobs. If the tax benefits were removed, then it would be bad for growth and jobs -- true enough. There is no opportunity cost because the capital otherwise goes into a government black hole.

    But the same is true of any taxation.

    She can't have her cake and eat it too.
    The black hole that goes back into the UK economy.
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    (Original post by Quady)
    How do they create employment?
    A demand for a product (ISA's etc) creates employment via the need to have personnel to operate that product.

    The same is true of taxation, although you wouldn't think so going by the intention of the current government to cut staffing. :rolleyes:
 
 
 
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