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    (Original post by The Dynamic Uno)
    She's not a Muslim if she's willing to enter a contest where you are judged on looks alone now is she?
    ....exactly the kind of nonsense I'm objecting to.
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    (Original post by Hippysnake)
    Well, she isn't a Muslim.
    It's sort of like taking a cricket bat to a football game, hitting the ball for six and then claiming you're a pro footballer.


    Likewise, Islam says women should dress modestly. This lady does not dress modestly. So she's not a Muslim. Simple no?
    It's not so much the fact she's entered this Miss UK thing, it's the fact that she's entered and still calls herself a Muslim that's what pisses Muslims off.

    (Original post by The Dynamic Uno)
    She's not a Muslim if she's willing to enter a contest where you are judged on looks alone now is she?
    Wrong.

    Committing a sin does not take someone out of the 'fold of Islam' as I have seen it refered to.

    You can commit many sins, but as long as you are sincere, ask for forgiveness etc. it may well be accepted.

    Also - the only true conditions to be accepted as Muslim is to believe in the declaration of faith. Ofcourse there is lots of other guidance on being a 'good muslim' but just because you break a rule or two doesn't automatically make you a non-muslim.

    Further to this - modern day muslims, according to my muslim friend - make a huge deal out of things that aren't that significant in the religion.

    This is a prime example. It is more important not to abuse people, issue death threats etc. than being dressed modestly. What she is doing is no doubt a sin in Islam but not as serious as what the abusers are doing.

    Another example of this is what is referred to as 'back biting', talking **** about other people. It is considered to 'weaken their belief' and one of hte gravest sins possible. Yet you will see Muslims committing this sin left, right and centre (just like everyone else in modern society), but nobody seems to give a ****?

    Any of the above could be wrong in the finer details, but I'm fairly sure the gist of it is correct.
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    (Original post by Mujeriego)
    Apples and oranges. And it is not as "simple" as you pretend it is either. You are not permitted to declare takfir against her on such flimsy reasoning. At least have the courtesy to provide a hadith or verse stating that immodest dress reneges someone's declaration of belief. By your logic, every time someone commits a sin, they become an apostate by default and have to actively revert in front of two adults in order to become Muslim again. How awfully time consuming. :rolleyes:
    Please see my above post as you seem to know more about it than me - please correct me where I am wrong. I'm guessing you are a Muslim.
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    (Original post by Steph90)
    Wrong.

    Committing a sin does not take someone out of the 'fold of Islam' as I have seen it refered to.

    You can commit many sins, but as long as you are sincere, ask for forgiveness etc. it may well be accepted.

    Also - the only true conditions to be accepted as Muslim is to believe in the declaration of faith. Ofcourse there is lots of other guidance on being a 'good muslim' but just because you break a rule or two doesn't automatically make you a non-muslim.

    Further to this - modern day muslims, according to my muslim friend - make a huge deal out of things that aren't that significant in the religion.

    This is a prime example. It is more important not to abuse people, issue death threats etc. than being dressed modestly. What she is doing is no doubt a sin in Islam but not as serious as what the abusers are doing.

    Another example of this is what is referred to as 'back biting', talking **** about other people. It is considered to 'weaken their belief' and one of hte gravest sins possible. Yet you will see Muslims committing this sin left, right and centre (just like everyone else in modern society), but nobody seems to give a ****?

    Any of the above could be wrong in the finer details, but I'm fairly sure the gist of it is correct.
    Damn out of rep but you will get some later :top:
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    I would
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    (Original post by Steph90)
    Please see my above post as you seem to know more about it than me - please correct me where I am wrong. I'm guessing you are a Muslim.

    No. We are correct until they correct us. It's lamentable that a non-Muslim has just schooled a Muslim on his own religion.
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    In the end people may they be Muslim or not will have opinouns on this and beauty pagents in general. Sending abuse however is ****ing pathetic.
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    To be quite frank people, someone isn't really a candidate to be a Miss UK if they aren't living accordingly to the set of beliefs that they hold dearest to them.
    If you ask her what is the most important thing to her and she says religion, then it just seems like she's taking a break from the values that she should really be steadfast to.
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    (Original post by CombineHarvester)
    The current Miss USA is a Lebanese-Muslim and the press were all over her (Fox News especially) with many saying she shouldn't be allowed to represent America. There's a video on youtube of Debbie Schlussel laying into her for about 10mins and calling her a terrorist/terrorist sympathiser/Al Qaeda etc.
    Where wherrrreeee? :O
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    She's pretty fit.

    I'd definitely give her one but I'd probably be assaulted by her brothers and father :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by ajp100688)
    This kind of nonsense is why Islam really needs to undergo a reformation like Christianity did and strip itself of the conservative sexist elements that seem to be attracted to it. I mean really sending abuse to someone because they want to enter a beauty pageant, what nonsense.
    You clearly have minimal knowledge about Islam.
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    (Original post by agolati)
    To be quite frank people, someone isn't really a candidate to be a Miss UK if they aren't living accordingly to the set of beliefs that they hold dearest to them.
    If you ask her what is the most important thing to her and she says religion, then it just seems like she's taking a break from the values that she should really be steadfast to.
    This.

    It would be hypocritical for her to claim she is religious and a good Muslim. She had a choice and if she really wanted to be a good Muslim she could do it in other ways. You can't just pick and choose aspects of your belief/religion and ignore the rest.


    Having said that she did state that she is not representing Islam. Anyway I doubt she would say that Islamic beliefs are dear to her.
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    (Original post by CombineHarvester)
    The current Miss USA is a Lebanese-Muslim and the press were all over her (Fox News especially) with many saying she shouldn't be allowed to represent America. There's a video on youtube of Debbie Schlussel laying into her for about 10mins and calling her a terrorist/terrorist sympathiser/Al Qaeda etc.
    http://www.debbieschlussel.com/21805...tyr-relatives/

    Hahaha!!!

    Surprise surprise, Israeli and a regular on FOX.
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    "Rumena Begum, 18 said: "It goes against our morals and our religion.
    "But it's her life - she can do whatever she wants really.""

    Agreed ^ I'm a Muslim but I wouldn't send any hurtful comments to the model as it's 100% her choice
    And no, Islam does not need a reform thanks. I mostly see the extremists on the news :| and we all know by now, they don't represent the majority
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    I agree with women covering up on moral grounds. The over sexualization of todays society really disgusts and upsets me. I really respect girls that don't feel the need to flaunt themselves to men provocatively in public.

    Islam doesn't need a reform, if anything its conservative values are right and need to be deployed more. Straight away after the watershed people like me find that they cannot watch TV without being confronted with ridiculous crap such as "The Joys of Teen Sex" and "Sexcetera." It's disgusting really...
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    (Original post by Mujeriego)
    Apples and oranges. And it is not as "simple" as you pretend it is either. You are not permitted to declare takfir against her on such flimsy reasoning. At least have the courtesy to provide a hadith or verse stating that immodest dress reneges someone's declaration of belief. By your logic, every time someone commits a sin, they become an apostate by default and have to actively revert in front of two adults in order to become Muslim again. How awfully time consuming. :rolleyes:
    Erm, she isn't a Muslim though.

    Has Allah prohibited her from wearing such clothes? Yes
    Does she believe Allah has allowed her to wear such clothes? Yes

    Ergo, she's just committed Kufrul-Istihaal.

    http://www.sunnahonline.com/ilm/aqeedah/0038.htm
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    (Original post by planetearth)
    You clearly have minimal knowledge about Islam.
    No I clearly dislike and find sexist numerous elements of Islam, which belong in the Medieval period when the Qur'an was written and not modern day. I'd rather listen to J.S Mill:
    That the only purpose for which power can be rightfully exercised over any member of a civilized community, against his will, is to prevent harm to others. His own good, either physical or moral, is not sufficient warrant. He cannot rightfully be compelled to do or forbear because it will be better for him to do so, because it will make him happier, because, in the opinion of others, to do so would be wise, or even right... The only part of the conduct of anyone, for which he is amenable to society, is that which concerns others. In the part which merely concerns himself, his independence is, of right, absolute. Over himself, over his own body and mind, the individual is sovereign.
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    (Original post by jakemittle)
    Where wherrrreeee? :O
    I think the video has been taken down from Youtube for being threatening but her articles are bad enough:

    http://www.debbieschlussel.com/22000...ration-answer/
    http://www.debbieschlussel.com/21971...n-usa-pageant/
    http://www.debbieschlussel.com/21805...tyr-relatives/
    http://www.debbieschlussel.com/21757...llows-bikinis/

    http://www.loonwatch.com/2010/05/mis...-islamophobes/
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    Why doesn't she leave Islam if it's against their values/morales?
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    (Original post by itsamemario666)
    I respect what she is doing there... but how is she good looking enough to represent the UK in miss universe?
    Agreed with the second part of the statement!

    And for the first part, I, personally, don't agree with beauty pageants, but it's her body-her choice.
 
 
 
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