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    (Original post by badtothebone)
    why?

    What I cant take seriously is that a crisis 'rooted in the financial sector' as governer of the bank of England, Mervyn King, puts it - is being paid for by students, pensioners, workers, children and people on benefits whilst bankers are drawing million pound bonuses as normal. wheres the logic and morality in that? its a serious question that needs answering.

    if you want to listen to an alternative to cuts then i can explain it. but it does mean you have to listen and not call me a silly trade unionist (im not either) and treat the argument as a joke.
    You just said there is no alternative to cuts. There shal be NO CUTS! This proves you are just a little bit silly.
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    (Original post by crazycake93)
    The one at my house tonight.

    Bring ur own drinks.


    Nobody on TSR has ever been to a party :eyeball:
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    Basically as it goes, the tories are c*nts pure and simple, they want the rich to stay rich and the poor to stay poor, when they found outthat poor kids could get good grades through the state education system and infiltrate oxbridge something had to be done.

    The Libdems are also silly as they just wanted power they would have aggreed with labour and made a coalition if labour had more of the votes. no one will vote for them for a long time.

    Labour (tony blair is excleuded) are the best of the big three, and will win the next election, as tories become so unpopular
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    (Original post by kevR94)
    You just said there is no alternative to cuts. There shal be NO CUTS! This proves you are just a little bit silly.
    what.........?

    cuts don't HAVE to be made - why is that silly?
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    (Original post by badtothebone)
    what.........?

    cuts don't HAVE to be made - why is that silly?
    Of course cuts have to be bloody made. Can you suggest how to get out of the debt we are in WITHOUT CUTS.
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    (Original post by kevR94)
    Of course cuts have to be bloody made. Can you suggest how to get out of the debt we are in WITHOUT CUTS.
    well if you listen to the media and the politicians you will think as you do....in anycase.....

    the people who didnt create the mess should not pay for the mess.

    collect 123bn tax gap every year.

    create jobs.

    tax the rich.
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    (Original post by badtothebone)
    well if you listen to the media and the politicians you will think as you do....in anycase.....

    the people who didnt create the mess should not pay for the mess.

    collect 123bn tax gap every year.

    create jobs.

    tax the rich.
    By simply taxing the rich and creating jobs you are not going to be able to pay off the debt. There is actually no alternative to getting out of this debt than by cuts. It has to be done. Simple as. Although i do not agree with the way the ConDem government are going about their cuts, it is the only way out.
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    Definitely Labour if Red Ed were to go back to the glory days of Democratic Socialism, if not either greens or one of the smaller socialist parties.
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    (Original post by kevR94)
    By simply taxing the rich and creating jobs you are not going to be able to pay off the debt. There is actually no alternative to getting out of this debt than by cuts. It has to be done. Simple as. Although i do not agree with the way the ConDem government are going about their cuts, it is the only way out.
    the times rich list shows how last year the richest 100 people collectively got 77bn richer - the highest increase since records began.

    The government are cutting 81bn over 4 years.

    further there is a 123bn tax gap every year.

    creating jobs means you have a stable economy i.e. you have high tax revenues and low dole costs.

    so do the maths. its not looney it makes sense.
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    (Original post by badtothebone)
    the times rich list shows how last year the richest 100 people collectively got 77bn richer - the highest increase since records began.

    The government are cutting 81bn over 4 years.

    further there is a 123bn tax gap every year.

    creating jobs means you have a stable economy i.e. you have high tax revenues and low dole costs.

    so do the maths. its not looney it makes sense.
    Hear Hear!
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    It is shocking how working and middle class people are suffering at the expense of a problem that was not their fault.
    1. Nationalise/Mutualise all banks into social ownership with salary caps at 100k (in bonuses)
    2. Reindustrialise Britain and get unemployment back under 1million with in 5 years
    3. Balance deficit through cutting defence, minor efficiency savings (i.e. excessive pay) and reduced welfare bill by increased employment. In addition to cap off National Insurance contributions, permanent 50% income tax, raise coropration tax to 30%, robin hood tax and a progressive (about 1%) wealth on the richest seciton of society.
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    (Original post by joe3469)
    Hear Hear!
    Look at The Trade Union & Socialist Coalition (TUSC) they are standing on a no cuts to jobs and services platform. http://www.tusc.org.uk/policy.php happy to answer questions/critisisms
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    (Original post by badtothebone)
    the times rich list shows how last year the richest 100 people collectively got 77bn richer - the highest increase since records began.

    The government are cutting 81bn over 4 years.

    further there is a 123bn tax gap every year.

    creating jobs means you have a stable economy i.e. you have high tax revenues and low dole costs.

    so do the maths. its not looney it makes sense.
    I totally agree that the rich should have to pay more however, it should be aimed more at the bankers i.e. those who created the debt should pay for it, not people who have become rich through their own hardwork.

    Where are the jobs going to come from?
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    (Original post by badtothebone)
    Look at The Trade Union & Socialist Coalition (TUSC) they are standing on a no cuts to jobs and services platform. http://www.tusc.org.uk/policy.php happy to answer questions/critisisms
    I heard of them at the general election. They have great ideas but were probably seen as a wasted vote, as just to keep the tories out people would vote for Labour.
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    (Original post by kevR94)
    I totally agree that the rich should have to pay more however, it should be aimed more at the bankers i.e. those who created the debt should pay for it, not people who have become rich through their own hardwork.

    Where are the jobs going to come from?
    We need to reverse the policy of deindustrialisation since Mrs Thatcher. State investment in steel, coal, shipbuilding, automobile construction etc
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    None, they are all puppets of a shadowy organisation that is using mind control through a consumerist culture to make us passive and defenceless for the eventual coming of the reptile people.

    U GET ME?
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    (Original post by joe3469)
    We need to reverse the policy of deindustrialisation since Mrs Thatcher. State investment in steel, coal, shipbuilding, automobile construction etc
    Would be an ideal world if we could just fix the financial state of the country with a flick of a wand. However, it just isnt realistic. It cant happen without cuts.

    Unlike people who can afford to have things cut this bad, i do not agree with the ConDem governments idea of fair cuts.
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    (Original post by kevR94)
    I totally agree that the rich should have to pay more however, it should be aimed more at the bankers i.e. those who created the debt should pay for it, not people who have become rich through their own hardwork.

    Where are the jobs going to come from?
    that is a very fair point regarding the bankers.

    As for people becoming rich through their own hard work....some of the wealth is inheritance (no work) and the rest is earned from owning capital (money, means of production etc.). Essentially money makes money - the money does the work for you in a sense.

    So you have some money (M) and you buy means of production and labour power , say a clothes shop, stock and shop assistants, team leaders and a manager(C) and that is sold for money plus a profit (M+)

    M > C > M+

    thats the cycle you need to produce to make money. you don't need to do any work as such - just own things and watch the money come rolling in.

    that make sense or does it sound like a load of theoretical ****e.lol.


    What sort of jobs

    its a fair question...

    what jobs do we need doing?

    do we need more nurses? doctors?

    there are 5m people on the council house waiting list.....wouldn't creating a mass affordable housing project create jobs for builders and tradesmen, for architechts, for the suppliers, for people who sell furniture, kitchens etc.

    could we invest in renewable technology - create jobs in research, construction.

    could we invest in art - film, theatre etc.

    could we invest in science and technology

    could we invest in high end manufacturing products?

    think of it like that i.e. what jobs do we need and you can think of lots of examples. more people in work means more tax revenue and less welfare and so overtime you can really invest more and more and build a stable economy - not to mention a nicer place to live.
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    (Original post by kevR94)
    Would be an ideal world if we could just fix the financial state of the country with a flick of a wand. However, it just isnt realistic. It cant happen without cuts.

    Unlike people who can afford to have things cut this bad, i do not agree with the ConDem governments idea of fair cuts.
    Go and up and you will see my suggested deficit reducing measures
 
 
 
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