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fishpaste
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#201
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#201
(Original post by amexblack)
then why bring up the ****ing surgeon in the first place?! You originally tried to use it as yet another frivolous argument against public schools. Now you say all you meant by it is that money should not be able to buy the right to live. hahaha.
Okay fine.

The majority of people are in the state sector for healthcare, if you're poaching surgeons, you're depriving the state sector of its experienced and talented surgeons. This, like depriving the state sector of its teachers, leads to inequity.

All of society should not be denied access to the best surgeons. This is where your "but time is limited so somebody has to be" argument came in, and this is why I said the basis of selection should not be money."
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innercitylife
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#202
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#202
Seems that what fishpaste is actually saying is that money shouldn't be a defining factor when deciding who benefits from socially desirable services. There is a reason why in this country they're funded by the state, afterall - it's partly to try and stop the inequality that the free market gives, since it doesn't take into account anything other than economic factors.
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Jonatan
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#203
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#203
(Original post by Nafisa)
The labour government is so hypocritical if we believe in equality in education surely we should abolish independant schools, does this not make sense?
Its bloody nonsense, thats what it is. Independent schools show better results than state schools. Ergo, we prohibit independent schools. Equaility of education my ass. If you do not watch yourself you will end up in the same situation as we have here in Norway, were everyone have to study visrtually the same subjects and where you are accepted to upper secondary school on basis of where you live rather than what grades you obtain.

Btw: The norwegian school system shows so poor results that the British top universities do not accept the Norwegian diploma as a qaulification.
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Howard
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#204
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#204
(Original post by fishpaste)
Okay fine.

The majority of people are in the state sector for healthcare, if you're poaching surgeons, you're depriving the state sector of its experienced and talented surgeons. This, like depriving the state sector of its teachers, leads to inequity.

All of society should not be denied access to the best surgeons. This is where your "but time is limited so somebody has to be" argument came in, and this is why I said the basis of selection should not be money."
So, you presume that surgeons should be the property of the State as well as teachers.

Interesting to note you've all but abandoned the argument that surgeons "damage society" by performing private surgery.
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Joey_Johns
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#205
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#205
(Original post by Howard)
So, you presume that surgeons should be the property of the State as well as teachers.

Interesting to note you've all but abandoned the argument that surgeons "damage society" by performing private surgery.
If fishpaste had his way every privately owned property in the country would have to open its doors for the general public.

Dont worry about finding a hotel for the night, just knock on somones door and they will put you up. Social equality rules.
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me!
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#206
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#206
Isn't this thread getting to be on the brink of communism? everyone is equal and all that, people should have the same opportunites and be equal, it never works...
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Joey_Johns
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#207
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#207
(Original post by me!)
Isn't this thread getting to be on the brink of communsim? everyone is equal and all that, people should have the same opportunites and be equal, it never works...
Exactly what I pointed out earlier but apparently I was wrong.
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me!
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#208
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#208
(Original post by Joey_Johns)
Exactly what I pointed out earlier but apparently I was wrong.
I'm not against grammar schools or public schools, it really doesn't bother me because like people have said so many times before it really depends on who you are and if you're going to do well you'll do it anywhere just some people might have more of an advantage, but that's life however harsh it sounds...
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Joey_Johns
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#209
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#209
(Original post by me!)
I'm not against grammar schools or public schools, it really doesn't bother me because like people have said so many times before it really depends on who you are and if you're going to do well you'll do it anywhere just some people might have more of an advantage, but that's life however harsh it sounds...
I think this quote from Peter Kays Pheonix nights sums it up rather well:

''I wanna do the moon-walk son, but lifes a ****house''. Brian Potter.
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Howard
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#210
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#210
(Original post by me!)
I'm not against grammar schools or public schools, it really doesn't bother me because like people have said so many times before it really depends on who you are and if you're going to do well you'll do it anywhere just some people might have more of an advantage, but that's life however harsh it sounds...
Some people will always have a greater advantage than others.

Let's assume fishpaste is right and private schools are as evil as she says. So, everyone goes to a state school/sausage factory right? Is everybody going to come out equally qualified?

Of course not! Some will do well, go to med school, and become surgeons. Most won't.

Now what do we do? It looks like we're back to "square 1" and still have an elite!

There will always be an elite amongst us. That's a good thing and no amount of social engineering is going to alter that fact.

The point is this. We can't all be Generals. A lot of us have to be content if we reach Company Seargent Major, and more still just have to accept the fact they won't advance beyond Private.
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Howard
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#211
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#211
(Original post by Joey_Johns)
I think this quote from Peter Kays Pheonix nights sums it up rather well:

''I wanna do the moon-walk son, but lifes a ****house''. Brian Potter.
And I always wanted to be an astronaut but some elitist ******* ensured my NASA application went in the bin. Life sucks!
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me!
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#212
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#212
(Original post by Howard)
Some people will always have a greater advantage than others.

Let's assume fishpaste is right and private schools are as evil as she says. So, everyone goes to a state school/sausage factory right? Is everybody going to come out equally qualified?

Of course not! Some will do well, go to med school, and become surgeons. Most won't.

Now what do we do? It looks like we're back to "square 1" and still have an elite!

There will always be an elite amongst us. That's a good thing and no amount of social engineering is going to alter that fact.

The point is this. We can't all be Generals. A lot of us have to be content if we reach Company Seargent Major, and more still just have to accept the fact they won't advance beyond Private.
I really don't like the terms 'elite' and 'social engineering'... people just do what they do and in life "sh** happens" instead of arguing about education people might as well just do their revision or something because arguing or debating or whatever you want to call it, on an internet forum isn't going to change anything... and everything happens for a reason. And I make no sense
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Joey_Johns
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#213
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#213
(Original post by me!)
I really don't like the terms 'elite' and 'social engineering'... people just do what they do and in life "sh** happens" instead of arguing about education people might as well just do their revision or something because arguing or debating or whatever you want to call it, on an internet forum isn't going to change anything... and everything happens for a reason. And I make no sense
You make more sense than fishpaste. Quite a lot more infact.
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PQ
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#214
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#214
(Original post by Howard)
And I always wanted to be an astronaut but some elitist ******* ensured my NASA application went in the bin. Life sucks!
http://www.despair.com/potential.html


(note - I'm not implying anything about you...your post just reminded me of the poster)
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Sire
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#215
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#215
(Original post by Howard)
And I always wanted to be an astronaut but some elitist ******* ensured my NASA application went in the bin. Life sucks!
What made you unsuitable exactly?
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Howard
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#216
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#216
(Original post by Sire)
What made you unsuitable exactly?
Scared of heights.
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Joey_Johns
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#217
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#217
(Original post by Howard)
Scared of heights.
Life sucks.
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Sire
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#218
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#218
(Original post by Howard)
Scared of heights.
And people as smart as those at NASA couldn't convince you that you were on the bottom side of the world?
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Tek
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#219
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#219
(Original post by fishpaste)
So I'm right?
No, you're wrong, you fool:

Smoking damages society.
Chewing gum, when spat out onto the pavement, damages society.
Cars damage society.
Television damages society.
Alcohol damages society.
Since when has smoking ever been controlled by the Government? Yes, there are taxes, but there are taxes on lots of things. Taxes won't discourage the rich either, will they? I can smoke 500 cigarettes a day, and the Government won't care.

And since when has chewing gum consumption ever been regulated by the Government then??

Car consumption isn't regulated by the Government either. I can buy 50 cars if I can afford it.

Television has already been dealt with, and you admitted defeat on that one.

And as for alcohol, well as long as you don't drive, you can consume as much as you can afford.

So be quiet now.
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