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    (Original post by infernalcradle)
    you realise that the hijab is not compulsory...and its constant wearing by women is more of a cultural thing than religious.....

    only MUST be worn during prayer.....
    Hijab is compulsory for women that have reached purberty and must be worn in the presence of non mehram( men that the women is allowed to marry). The women does not have to wear the hijab in front of her mehram( brother dad uncle grandad etc...)

    Why the neg rep? I was simply stating a fact. I don't see how this is offensive to anyone?
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    (Original post by joytosee)
    Hijab is compulsory for women that have reached purberty and must be worn in the presence of non mehram( men that the women is allowed to marry). The women does not have to wear the hijab in front of her mehram( brother dad uncle grandad etc...)
    again....show me a passage from the Qu'ran that says this....

    and not the same cultural crap that is constantly told to me....

    (I'm assuming you are pakistani/saudi?)
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    A headscarf although advocated by Islaam, doesn't mean Non-Muslim females can't wear it, even an atheist can.
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    (Original post by infernalcradle)
    again....show me a passage from the Qu'ran that says this....

    and not the same cultural crap that is constantly told to me....

    (I'm assuming you are pakistani/saudi?)
    "And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and guard their private parts from sin and not show of their adornment except only that which is apparent, and draw their headcovers over their necks and bosoms and not reveal their adornment except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands' fathers, their sons, their husbands' sons, their brothers, or their brothers' sons, or their sisters' sons, or their women (i.e., their sisters in Islam), or their female slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants free of physical desires, or small children who have no sense of women's nakedness. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And turn unto Allah altogether, O you Believers, in order that you may attain success.[An-Nur, 24:31]

    Abu Dawood narrates that `Aishah (RAA) said: "Asmaa' the daughter of Abu Bakr (RAA) came to see the Messenger of Allah (SAAWS) wearing a thin dress; so Allah's Messenger (SAAWS) turned away from her and said: O Asmaa', once a woman reaches the age of menstruation, no part of her body should be seen but this-and he pointed to his face and hands.

    No I'm not either of those. Out of interest are you a muslim?
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    (Original post by joytosee)
    "And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and guard their private parts from sin and not show of their adornment except only that which is apparent, and draw their headcovers over their necks and bosoms and not reveal their adornment except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands' fathers, their sons, their husbands' sons, their brothers, or their brothers' sons, or their sisters' sons, or their women (i.e., their sisters in Islam), or their female slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants free of physical desires, or small children who have no sense of women's nakedness. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And turn unto Allah altogether, O you Believers, in order that you may attain success.[An-Nur, 24:31]

    Abu Dawood narrates that `Aishah (RAA) said: "Asmaa' the daughter of Abu Bakr (RAA) came to see the Messenger of Allah (SAAWS) wearing a thin dress; so Allah's Messenger (SAAWS) turned away from her and said: O Asmaa', once a woman reaches the age of menstruation, no part of her body should be seen but this-and he pointed to his face and hands.

    No I'm not either of those. Out of interest are you a muslim?
    I am muslim....

    and what you have posted is simply saying that women should dress modestly, not have breasts/loads of skin showing and to not be naked infront of people they shouldn't be naked of.....

    maybe culture has something to do with it....but I'm iraqi and I have met very very few that do wear the hijabe that aren't old women....whereas pakistani/gulf arab women wear it all the time, regardless of age....
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    (Original post by CGFPS)
    I'm a little (okay alot) concerned that wearing the hijab (Note; this only covers the hair and neck, not the face or any other parts of the body) might hinder my chances of getting into a BB investment bank in the future as dress in that field is very conservative and limited to certain styles. I know that, yes, I shouldn't go into a company that won't accept me for who I am or who discriminates, but it's hard trying to get a job in the state that we're currently in, and IB (investment banking) is a tough field to get into either way; I'll be competing with very high caliber people. Someone said to me that I should tough it out and be the best I can be, but I've seen lot's of females wearing the headscarf who are more than qualified for the jobs and who have been repeatedly rejected, regardless of whether or not they got a first in maths/economics, and if they did get accepted there was no progress up in the ranks. I really don't want to take a chance because the odds have been stacked against me most of my life...I'm not being self-deprecating, it's just that I don't want to 'take a chance' on my career. Any advice would be appreciated.
    Should I not wear it at first, and then as I establish myself within the company after a while (maybe a year or two), go back to wearing a scarf? There are many muslims but they're mostly male and so their religion is not plainly worn on their heads. Honest opinions please, no false hopes.
    Allah (swt) is the provider. Obey him first before anyone else.

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    (Original post by infernalcradle)
    I am muslim....

    and what you have posted is simply saying that women should dress modestly, not have breasts/loads of skin showing and to not be naked infront of people they shouldn't be naked of.....

    maybe culture has something to do with it....but I'm iraqi and I have met very very few that do wear the hijabe that aren't old women....whereas pakistani/gulf arab women wear it all the time, regardless of age....
    We can't simply read a passage of the qur'an and derive our own rulings. The scholars have agreed that the hijab is compulsary and this includes covering the hair. The above hadith also supports this. Also it's not really a cultural thing. I am from an asian background and the older women do not always cover their hair properly rather they wrap a shawl around their head whilst some of the hair is still showing. It is usually those that are practicing islam and have a sound understanding that observe the proper hijab i.e covering the hair and lose clothing. I have a few iraqi freinds one very close one and all of them cover their hair. What school of thought do you follow?
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    (Original post by loling909)
    You do know you can't do Investment banking as a Muslim?
    sorry, why not?
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    (Original post by CGFPS)
    I'm a little (okay alot) concerned that wearing the hijab (Note; this only covers the hair and neck, not the face or any other parts of the body) might hinder my chances of getting into a BB investment bank in the future as dress in that field is very conservative and limited to certain styles. I know that, yes, I shouldn't go into a company that won't accept me for who I am or who discriminates, but it's hard trying to get a job in the state that we're currently in, and IB (investment banking) is a tough field to get into either way; I'll be competing with very high caliber people. Someone said to me that I should tough it out and be the best I can be, but I've seen lot's of females wearing the headscarf who are more than qualified for the jobs and who have been repeatedly rejected, regardless of whether or not they got a first in maths/economics, and if they did get accepted there was no progress up in the ranks. I really don't want to take a chance because the odds have been stacked against me most of my life...I'm not being self-deprecating, it's just that I don't want to 'take a chance' on my career. Any advice would be appreciated.
    Should I not wear it at first, and then as I establish myself within the company after a while (maybe a year or two), go back to wearing a scarf? There are many muslims but they're mostly male and so their religion is not plainly worn on their heads. Honest opinions please, no false hopes.
    To be honest, you shouldn't give up your faith simply because you can't get a job. I would say you should keep trying constanly, if you can't have you thought about Sharia banking , like its a booming industry, plus IB is very stressful and money isn't everything. As a muslim you should know that having a family is important and it will interfere, trust i was thinking about it myself And have you thought about a graduate IB programme.
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    (Original post by infernalcradle)
    please show me the passages in the Qu'ran that says the Hijab must be worn at all times and that working in banking is haraam.....cos I've never heard of them....

    and don't bother giving me anything from the Hadiths....cos whilst they are teachings of the Prophet (pbuh), they are still only the teachings of a man, and thus do not have the infalliable nature the Qu'ran does....hence I follow what the Qu'ran says, and not the hadiths so much

    and I'm gonna be a doctor (hopefully)
    I know making money off interest is illegal in islam, so therefore working in IB is quite a nono...
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    (Original post by Straight up G)
    sorry, why not?
    This is because some parts of Banking deal with interest. Interest in haram( forbidden) in islam. Therefore any earnings you gain through a job that deals in haram is unlawful. It's the same as selling alcohol.
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    (Original post by joytosee)
    We can't simply read a passage of the qur'an and derive our own rulings. The scholars have agreed that the hijab is compulsary and this includes covering the hair. The above hadith also supports this. Also it's not really a cultural thing. I am from an asian background and the older women do not always cover their hair properly rather they wrap a shawl around their head whilst some of the hair is still showing. It is usually those that are practicing islam and have a sound understanding that observe the proper hijab i.e covering the hair and lose clothing. I have a few iraqi freinds one very close one and all of them cover their hair. What school of thought do you follow?
    There are scholars who do not believe the hijaab (with respect to simply the head covering) is compulsory. Also, as far as older women go, from my understanding those who have reached menopause no longer have to wear the hijaab.
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    (Original post by joytosee)
    This is because some parts of Banking deal with interest. Interest in haram( forbidden) in islam. Therefore any earnings you gain through a job that deals in haram is unlawful. It's the same as selling alcohol.
    Though of course any job in the banking sector will have some link to interest, investment banking in itself is not directly related to interest.

    Different scholars will say different things, some will say technically investment banking is not haram, and so it is allowed, others will say that it is wrong (perhaps irrationally at times). Most scholars will definitely recommend that working in the banking industry is a no-go though.

    Having said that, I know a young muslim very well, in recent years he's developed to become quite pious, he's 21, he's been on Hajj already and he's Pakistani (usually they go 35-50, his father is a doctor so he's not unusually rich), and he's recently done two internships at investment banks, saying his contact with usury is minimal and that he doesn't consider what he's doing as wrong.
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    (Original post by infernalcradle)
    please show me the passages in the Qu'ran that says the Hijab must be worn at all times and that working in banking is haraam.....cos I've never heard of them....

    and don't bother giving me anything from the Hadiths....cos whilst they are teachings of the Prophet (pbuh), they are still only the teachings of a man, and thus do not have the infalliable nature the Qu'ran does....hence I follow what the Qu'ran says, and not the hadiths so much

    and I'm gonna be a doctor (hopefully)
    This is the biggest load of crap I've ever heard.
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    (Original post by Mask Of Sanity)
    There are scholars who do not believe the hijaab (with respect to simply the head covering) is compulsory. Also, as far as older women go, from my understanding those who have reached menopause no longer have to wear the hijaab.
    Yes But they are an extremely small minority and the general ( correct ) ruling is that the hijab is compulsary. To be honest I have never come across anyone that has said that the hijab. Out of interest do you know which scholar specifically say that it is not compulsary?
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    (Original post by Straight up G)
    Though of course any job in the banking sector will have some link to interest, investment banking in itself is not directly related to interest.

    Different scholars will say different things, some will say technically investment banking is not haram, and so it is allowed, others will say that it is wrong (perhaps irrationally at times). Most scholars will definitely recommend that working in the banking industry is a no-go though.

    Having said that, I know a young muslim very well, in recent years he's developed to become quite pious, he's 21, he's been on Hajj already and he's Pakistani (usually they go 35-50, his father is a doctor so he's not unusually rich), and he's recently done two internships at investment banks, saying his contact with usury is minimal and that he doesn't consider what he's doing as wrong.
    It depends whether you are directly dealing with interest yourself. Although some scholars say it permissable some also say that if it can be avoided it should be. If you fear that your income is not halal or that you may fall into haram ( dealing with interest ) then you should leave it. With regards to your freind it does not matter how much contact with usuary he has, any contact is haram. If you consume interest you are sinful whether it is 1p or 1 million.
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    (Original post by joytosee)
    It depends whether you are directly dealing with interest yourself. Although some scholars say it permissable some also say that if it can be avoided it should be. If you fear that your income is not halal or that you may fall into haram ( dealing with interest ) then you should leave it. With regards to your freind it does not matter how much contact with usuary he has, any contact is haram. If you consume interest you are sinful whether it is 1p or 1 million.
    When he says minimal, I'm sure he means 0. He's a share trader, he flopped his A levels (got CCB, after getting 7A*s 3As GCSE), but traded shares, starting with one thousand and working his way to £800,000+, which is why he got the placements, after going to a very modest university, certainly nowhere near IB target unis. He worked for Merryl Lynch and Citigroup.
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    (Original post by infernalcradle)
    please show me the passages in the Qu'ran that says the Hijab must be worn at all times and that working in banking is haraam.....cos I've never heard of them....

    and don't bother giving me anything from the Hadiths....cos whilst they are teachings of the Prophet (pbuh), they are still only the teachings of a man, and thus do not have the infalliable nature the Qu'ran does....hence I follow what the Qu'ran says, and not the hadiths so much

    and I'm gonna be a doctor (hopefully)
    You are very quick to disregard the hadiths, when in fact they ar very important. They are the teachings of the greatest man to ever walk the earth the messenger of god. Also I am intrested how do you pray? I mean the qur'an does not tell how to pray, so if you don't take account of hadith how do you fufill your five compulsary prayers everyday?
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    (Original post by Straight up G)
    When he says minimal, I'm sure he means 0. He's a share trader, he flopped his A levels (got CCB, after getting 7A*s 3As GCSE), but traded shares, starting with one thousand and working his way to £800,000+, which is why he got the placements, after going to a very modest university, certainly nowhere near IB target unis. He worked for Merryl Lynch and Citigroup.
    If it's 0 then he has nothing to be concerned about, however I would advise that he consults a knowlegable and reliable sheikh with regard to this matter, after all we are all still students learning about islam and don't have the authority to hand out fatwas!
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    (Original post by joytosee)
    Yes But they are an extremely small minority and the general ( correct ) ruling is that the hijab is compulsary. To be honest I have never come across anyone that has said that the hijab. Out of interest do you know which scholar specifically say that it is not compulsary?
    Yep, definitely a minority in my experience. I can't remember which scholar specifically, but it's mentioned time and time again that some don't believe it's compulsory. There was a documentary a while ago with an Egyptian woman naming some of them but their names are beyond me. The authenticity of hadiths which refer to hijaab tends to also be questioned, or just completely disregarded as it isn't mentioned in the Quran specifically.
 
 
 
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