Big Uni Choice Mistake?
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Original post by River85
Even if a student is concerned with research quality and quantity, Bath can compete.
Not being in the Russell Group doesn't mean that it is poorer in research. It's still a research-focused university.
Some 1994 Group universities have a higher research income than Russell Group universities.
Not being in the Russell Group doesn't mean that it is poorer in research. It's still a research-focused university.
Some 1994 Group universities have a higher research income than Russell Group universities.
Income form research isn't the most important thing, it's the quality, and how much of a difference it actually makes. I said Bath is a good university, you're saying what you're saying as if I hate all non-Russel groups. I'm going to firm Durham and withdraw from Cardiff, even though Cardiff is in the Russel Group and Durham isn't.
Original post by Airbus.Boeing
Original post by Airbus.Boeing
River85,
I agree totally with your point below:
"It's not a collection of the "best" or most targeted universities, it's a collection of the largest research intensive universities."
However do you think employers think deifferently at all?
I agree totally with your point below:
"It's not a collection of the "best" or most targeted universities, it's a collection of the largest research intensive universities."
However do you think employers think deifferently at all?
I highly doubt an employer such as Airbus will think badly of your choice.
there are very prestigious unis in the russell group, oxbridge UCL, LSE etc etc, but there also universities like manchester, newcastle, sheffield, birmingham in the group which are good unis but certainly aren't rated higher than durham, york, bath, exeter, st andrews, uea in the 1994 group etc etc.
the russell group is a good group of universities, no doubt, but its not the be all and end all.
the russell group is a good group of universities, no doubt, but its not the be all and end all.
Original post by Airbus.Boeing
This year i applied to the University of Bath for Aerospace Eng. Only AFter did i foolishly realise it wasn't in the Russel Group of Universities and is a fairly newish university. I can't help thinking did i make a mistake in choosing Bath over Bristol? i Know Bristol is well established and a part of the Russel Group. Do you guys think....
Bath is as equally respected as Bristol?
Bath is a new university? so lacks those links an established university has?
I also have offers from Southampton and Glasgow, so should i firm one of these instead of bath?
Much help would be appreciated. I feel as if i want to rewind time and should have looked at my choices more wisely instead of happily pressing the send button :/
Bath is as equally respected as Bristol?
Bath is a new university? so lacks those links an established university has?
I also have offers from Southampton and Glasgow, so should i firm one of these instead of bath?
Much help would be appreciated. I feel as if i want to rewind time and should have looked at my choices more wisely instead of happily pressing the send button :/
Lacks links?!
Bath, Warwick and York are three of the best universities in the country, and they were all founded around the same time.
Bath is excellent.
Original post by Potally_Tissed
Do you even know what the Russell Group is? It's entirely about research. For undergraduates, it's pretty much completely irrelevant.
It's not exactly representative of every good university in the UK when it doesn't include Durham, St Andrews, Bath, York, Loughborough, Exeter, UEA, etc etc.
It's not exactly representative of every good university in the UK when it doesn't include Durham, St Andrews, Bath, York, Loughborough, Exeter, UEA, etc etc.
To be fair, I have seen gradute jobs specify a degree from a Russell group uni so it's not completely irrelevant. However those are few and far between. Bath is a power house for engineering and has excellent graduate employment prospects.
Original post by ikoghoo
Now you're just exaggerating what I said. It's true that some employers look for candidates from russel groups, i didn't just pluck that out of thin air. If you didn't go to a Russel Group, then in some cases you won't even get an interview. The point is, the reputation of the uni you went to matters.
Durham has a good reputation because it's a traditional uni, you are most likely to be turned away if you went to a Met or a Hallam.
Durham has a good reputation because it's a traditional uni, you are most likely to be turned away if you went to a Met or a Hallam.
I see you're not even at university yet. Kindly see yourself out.
Original post by hoopyfrood199
Russel Group isn't everything. I'd say Bath is better respected than Bristol anyway.
This.
Original post by Augustus Woods
Do you not think you're taking a particularly snobbish approach? Bath is still highly regarded as one of the best uni's. I think you need to take a look in the mirror, and access your attitude.
Do you mean assess?
Original post by ikoghoo
Income form research isn't the most important thing, it's the quality, and how much of a difference it actually makes.
Well, I'm not getting into that sort of discussion. But my point is that the Russell Group is a collection of large universities. Due to the quantity of research these universities produce, and that much of it is often concentrated in the sciences and medicine (which receives more funding than the arts), they receive a higher proportion of research funding (I think Russell Group universities as a whole receive around two thirds of total research income).
Even so, some 1994 Group universities have a larger research income than a number of RG universities.
I said Bath is a good university, you're saying what you're saying as if I hate all non-Russel groups. I'm going to firm Durham and withdraw from Cardiff, even though Cardiff is in the Russel Group and Durham isn't.
Not at all, and I appreciate that you recognise Bath is a good university and not giving the OP incorrect information or a mistaken view. I don't mean to criticse what you said. It's just you said attending a university in the Russell Group is only important if you're interested in research. Studying at a research intensive university certainly can have its advanages (in research led teaching, facilities) but disadvantages (contact hours are often limited). But you were suggesting that Russell Group universities were therefore better in research than those outside the RG, including Bath. This isn't the case. It's just that the Russell Group universities are larger and, overall, receive a larger proportion of the funding. But they aren't necessarily better at research and you, if you do want to attend a research intensive university, there are comparable/research intensive universities outside.
I know you recognised Bath is a good university. You just seemed to suggest that the RG universities were the best if you wanted to study in a research led environment and that Bath, despite being a "good" university, isn't as rearch intensive. This isn't true. I think Bath has around the fourth largest proportion of staff submitted to the 2008 RAE (in Aero and Mech engineering).
Whether you meant this or not, I can't say, so I was only clarifying.
Original post by TheFoxBlip
To be fair, I have seen gradute jobs specify a degree from a Russell group uni so it's not completely irrelevant. However those are few and far between. Bath is a power house for engineering and has excellent graduate employment prospects.
Again, it is unlikely that these employers even know the purpose of the Russell Group and, most importantly, its members. It is used as a broad term for "good" universities (particularly medium and large size pre-1992 universities) and this will include Bath (and some universities not in the Russell or 1994 Groups - Aberdeen for example).
Original post by ikoghoo
Now you're just exaggerating what I said. It's true that some employers look for candidates from russel groups, i didn't just pluck that out of thin air. If you didn't go to a Russel Group, then in some cases you won't even get an interview.
Do you honestly think an employer is going to say, "no, your degree is from Bath/Durham/York/Aberdeen/Dundee...get lost?"
The point is, the reputation of the uni you went to matters.
Really...
We're talking graduate employment here, which is a huge, diverse area. So it's really not fair to suggest it always matters. Sometimes it can be of no importamce at all. I'm not saying that, sometimes, university name is of some importance It varies. Usually it has anything from little to a very modest amount of importance. Where it does have importance this will usually be in the initial stages of an application (pre-interview) that's true. But it is rare, perhaps practically unheard of, for the application of a non-RG graduate to be immediately binned.
Yes, I am aware of FO IB, with applications from candidates not from a semi-arbiary list of universities (usually Oxbridge, LSE, UCL, Imperial, Warwick, Durham, Nottingham and Edinburgh) being immediately binned.
Even when you just look at one sector, such as law, it's incredibly diverse. Solicitors, barristers, high street firms, Magic Circle, provincial chambers and so on.
I've "worked" (volunteered) at one major regional firm. Half of the solicitors were from Durham, Oxford or Warwick (in that order). The other half from Kent and two former polytechnics (Northumbria and Nottingham Trent). All but one partner being from Durham or Northumbria). This was a firm based in the North East, so will have a bias towards north eastern universities. But it was also clear that university name was of little importance.
Then individual employers can have their own preferences and bias, sometimes gained through their own experience of graduates they have employed in the past or show a regional bias - this does not necessarily conform to prestige or reputation.
Durham has a good reputation because it's a traditional uni, you are most likely to be turned away if you went to a Met or a Hallam.
What's a Hallam
(just say former polytechnic, it's easier).Original post by Airbus.Boeing
River85,
I agree totally with your point below:
"It's not a collection of the "best" or most targeted universities, it's a collection of the largest research intensive universities."
However do you think employers think deifferently at all?
I agree totally with your point below:
"It's not a collection of the "best" or most targeted universities, it's a collection of the largest research intensive universities."
However do you think employers think deifferently at all?
See above.
Bath has an excellent engineering department and companies within the sector will certainly recognise this (from their knowledge of the department and graduates they currently employer, or have employed in the past).
Thanks for the replies, especially River85. Its opened my eyes a bit to see the bigger picture and accept the fact that not being in the RG is not the be all and end all! 
Original post by felixtang
there are very prestigious unis in the russell group, oxbridge UCL, LSE etc etc, but there also universities like manchester, newcastle, sheffield, birmingham in the group which are good unis but certainly aren't rated higher than durham, york, bath, exeter, st andrews, uea in the 1994 group etc etc.
the russell group is a good group of universities, no doubt, but its not the be all and end all.
the russell group is a good group of universities, no doubt, but its not the be all and end all.
UEA is questionnable, i'm just throwing that out there. I know its good for the likes of Creative Writing I recall and English courses but overall I personally don't think its better than Sheff,Newcastle, Manchester & Birmingham..
Manchester has a very good international reputation..just throwing that out there too.
Original post by VansHalfCabs
UEA is questionnable, i'm just throwing that out there. I know its good for the likes of Creative Writing I recall and English courses but overall I personally don't think its better than Sheff,Newcastle, Manchester & Birmingham..
Manchester has a very good international reputation..just throwing that out there too.
Manchester has a very good international reputation..just throwing that out there too.
Agreed, only annoying thing at the Manchester open day was that they kept pushing that aspect of one of the benefits of coming to Manchester. Like repeating it a stupid amount of times. -__-
Nevertheless a good uni. Birmingham's nice too..not known as much internationally but they have done the collab with KPMG (I recall) for their Accounting & Finance degree which is really good.
Original post by Airbus.Boeing
I am ssure it was created in the 1960's along with Loughborough? That is fairly new
New Universities generally mean ones that were formed into unis in 1992 or since then.
Original post by River85
Again, it is unlikely that these employers even know the purpose of the Russell Group and, most importantly, its members. It is used as a broad term for "good" universities (particularly medium and large size pre-1992 universities) and this will include Bath (and some universities not in the Russell or 1994 Groups - Aberdeen for example).
Again, it is unlikely that these employers even know the purpose of the Russell Group and, most importantly, its members. It is used as a broad term for "good" universities (particularly medium and large size pre-1992 universities) and this will include Bath (and some universities not in the Russell or 1994 Groups - Aberdeen for example).
This times a million.
You ask these employers what the RG is and they won't actually have a clue.
Original post by ikoghoo
Now you're just exaggerating what I said. It's true that some employers look for candidates from russel groups, i didn't just pluck that out of thin air. If you didn't go to a Russel Group, then in some cases you won't even get an interview. The point is, the reputation of the uni you went to matters.
Durham has a good reputation because it's a traditional uni, you are most likely to be turned away if you went to a Met or a Hallam.
Durham has a good reputation because it's a traditional uni, you are most likely to be turned away if you went to a Met or a Hallam.
As said above, most of these employers won't know what the RG actually is, and would probably think Bath is in it.
(edited 13 years ago)
Original post by Vitamin D
Bath is a good university. There's no use only concerning yourself with those unis perceived as "respected" on here, go to Bath if you want to.
Original post by hoopyfrood199
Russel Group isn't everything. I'd say Bath is better respected than Bristol anyway.
All of this jazz...
Original post by Airbus.Boeing
This year i applied to the University of Bath for Aerospace Eng. Only AFter did i foolishly realise it wasn't in the Russel Group of Universities and is a fairly newish university. I can't help thinking did i make a mistake in choosing Bath over Bristol? i Know Bristol is well established and a part of the Russel Group. Do you guys think....
Bath is as equally respected as Bristol?
Bath is a new university? so lacks those links an established university has?
I also have offers from Southampton and Glasgow, so should i firm one of these instead of bath?
Much help would be appreciated. I feel as if i want to rewind time and should have looked at my choices more wisely instead of happily pressing the send button :/
EDIT: Bit harsh on the negs guys
Bath is as equally respected as Bristol?
Bath is a new university? so lacks those links an established university has?
I also have offers from Southampton and Glasgow, so should i firm one of these instead of bath?
Much help would be appreciated. I feel as if i want to rewind time and should have looked at my choices more wisely instead of happily pressing the send button :/
EDIT: Bit harsh on the negs guys
I would personally go to Southampton (it is my insurance btw). Bath is very well respected among industries. However if anybody would ask you in the future "Hey where do you study?, In the BATH . No dude I meant which uni?" a bit awkward situation xD
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