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    [QUOTE=jumpingjesusholycow;308180 84]It is not the role of the government to spend £182,000,000 to mop up 'stupid mistakes', which could have been spent on helping those most in need. /QUOTE]

    I beg to differ. It is the job of the department of education to a) prepare for the country a workforce with the skills it needs to compete in the current world economy and b) ensure that each child gets the education they need to succeed personally. If this means spending a relatively tiny portion of the government's money on keeping potentially brilliant people in education ready to lead the country's economy rather than throwing it in and getting a job stacking shelves then so be it.

    I'd like to point out that I didn't receive EMA and I am bloody jealous of those who did, but I won't begrudge them it. I think it should be slimmed down and targeted better (does my friend who lives a ten minute walk from college need the same amount as the friend who has to get a £5 return bus ticket every day?) but on the whole the principle isn't a bad one.
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    (Original post by Atheist Britain)
    WASTE OF MONEY AND SHOULD BE ABOLISHED.


    We did not need EMA 10 years ago and we don't need it today
    No wonder you have so many warning posts you are an idiot, times have changed there were also a lot more jobs 10 years ago for the people (which there were fewer of). Also there are other factors to take into recommendation like most universities would not accept students from certain backgrounds unlike today; which meant that most people didnt want to go to college ( plus there were fewer courses).
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    (Original post by Smilingsam)
    No wonder you have so many warning posts you are an idiot, times have changed there were also a lot more jobs 10 years ago for the people (which there were fewer of). Also there are other factors to take into recommendation like most universities would not accept students from certain backgrounds unlike today; which meant that most people didnt want to go to college ( plus there were fewer courses).
    You are waffling utter rubbish. I resent paying tax towards giving schoolkids pocket money to piss up the wall.

    Abolish EMA.
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    (Original post by BambieWambie)
    Dont brag about your middle class upbringing. I actully dont believe you now.
    dont believe that i have a job?
    imy parents work hard for what they have such as a nice car, nice home, a good holiday once or twice a year, im not working class, but im not filthy rich. but altough they have money. they couldnt necisarily fund the things that i want, which meant i had to go out there and get a job, unlike people who live off EMA and dont have to work for what they get
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    (Original post by Smilingsam)
    Well the new "system" will only be introduced in england, as wales scotland and i believe ireland now have kept the old system as they realised how many people it helped to the amount use it the wrong way.
    No I believe thats called Election winning, if you can't win an election through actual policy you attempt to bribe your way through it. Take the SNP and their policy of no Tuition Fees in Scotland, that right there is a massive vote winner among students and there parents.

    Now whether they actually carry it out on election and scrap it alongside EMA when they have to make cuts is another question entirely....
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    (Original post by leeeasa)
    people moan and say that they cant get jobs because their isnt any, i have three part time jobs so they cant be that hard to find can they..
    Well my location at the moment has the majority out of work, even though phones4u and bet365 were founded here. I have not had one job after 3 years of applying to 100's same with most of my friends as well.
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    (Original post by Smilingsam)
    Well my location at the moment has the majority out of work, even though phones4u and bet365 were founded here. I have not had one job after 3 years of applying to 100's same with most of my friends as well.
    maybe its a matter of location, but theirs alot of teenagers i know of who moan about their not being enough jobs, when they are quite easy to find if you dont want to be fussy. the company i work for recruit alot of people each season, theirs been people who i've heard moaning about their not being enough work who i've said to 'why dont you apply for work where i do' where they've then replied 'oh i cant be bothered'. most time's its more a fact of people having relied on EMA for far too long that they now cant be bothered to work for extra money
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    of course they should use it on alcohol why the hell should they miss out on a social life cause they do 5 days a weeks in school.

    its illegal for people who work two do 7 days a week working so why should you be allowed to go to school 5 days then work another 2

    there's no point doing all the school work you do if by the time your through uni and your big and successful you spent all your time getting there you have no friends or social life
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    (Original post by Rob da Mop)
    It is the job of the department of education to a) prepare for the country a workforce with the skills it needs to compete in the current world economy
    We do this through providing a world class education, not funding your drinking habit. Students can get disenfranchised for a number of reasons, but we do not seek to subsidise people for their Xbox games or Cannabis joints.

    b) ensure that each child gets the education they need to succeed personally.
    Yes, it is the duty of the state to PROVIDE that education, not to ensure that every student will use it in a certain way. What you're trying to describe, is known as state coercion. As someone who lies on the left of the political spectrum both socially and economically, what you are proposing is fundamentally incorrect and immoral.

    If this means spending a relatively tiny portion of the government's money
    If you think £182 Million is something to scoff at, you really shouldn't bother assigning yourself a political ideology, and should just wear a sign saying "Give me free money, we have loadz of it ololol!!"

    keeping potentially brilliant people in education ready to lead the country's economy
    Again, it is not the role of the government to decide people's future for them, or to coerce them into making certain decisions by paying them. If these so called 'brilliant people' need to be paid to value their education, they are not brilliant. Besides, they are helping the country's economy by getting a job as opposed to seeking government aid, do you see how backwards your argument is?

    rather than throwing it in and getting a job stacking shelves then so be it.
    So your two options in life, are either higher education and a world class job, or stacking shelves? Absolutely no middle ground? Not only is that completely and utterly wrong, your notion of society is everything that Karl Marx and notable left wing economists hated.

    Here are some facts for you:

    1. There is a huge economic middle ground. The country needs British people to seek jobs across a wide range of backgrounds, including the middle.

    2. Not going to university does not equate to becoming a 'shelf stacker'. I find you utterly repulsive for making this your case. John Major PM didn't even go to university.

    3. Even if your notion was correct, people have the right to seek whatever kind of job they wish, including stacking shelves. There's no indignity in making such a choice.

    I'd like to point out that I didn't receive EMA and I am bloody jealous of those who did, but I won't begrudge them it.
    But you have fundamental misunderstandings about state responsibilities, and what it means to help those who need help.

    I think it should be slimmed down and targeted better (does my friend who lives a ten minute walk from college need the same amount as the friend who has to get a £5 return bus ticket every day?)
    As I stated in my original post, I believe all under 19s in school should be provided with free bus travel. This is not the same as arguing that the state should be paying for their tequila shots because they 'wouldn't be interested in school otherwise'.

    but on the whole the principle isn't a bad one.
    Read everything I've stated, and then grow up a bit. Clearly you're into the whole 'yeahh! I'm a left winger and it's cool!' thing but don't have the knowledge of its principals to back it up. Do some research, take some time out and come back to me when you're a little more mature.
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    (Original post by kopite493)
    of course they should use it on alcohol why the hell should they miss out on a social life cause they do 5 days a weeks in school.

    its illegal for people who work two do 7 days a week working so why should you be allowed to go to school 5 days then work another 2

    there's no point doing all the school work you do if by the time your through uni and your big and successful you spent all your time getting there you have no friends or social life
    i work, study and still have a social life
    at the end of the day EMA is a waste of tax payers money, taxes that i have to pay to fund someone's alcohol habit. if people want to get pissed every weekend then fine, but do it with their own money, not with EMA money wich to be quite frank could be spent on better things than a bunch of kids who are gonna spend it on a bottle of vodka and primark clothes, wich at the end of the day is what 90% of them do with it.
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    (Original post by leeeasa)
    i work, study and still have a social life
    at the end of the day EMA is a waste of tax payers money, taxes that i have to pay to fund someone's alcohol habit. if people want to get pissed every weekend then fine, but do it with their own money, not with EMA money wich to be quite frank could be spent on better things than a bunch of kids who are gonna spend it on a bottle of vodka and primark clothes, wich at the end of the day is what 90% of them do with it.
    yeah case we all have parents who can throw money at us to get stuff we want
    not every one is a alcoholic people who get ema work hard for that ema
    i never got ema but then again id rather wake up and go i cant be bothered going in to day
    they have to turn up 7 hours a day 5 days a week well at least in my school to get ema

    so after that you want they to then go get a job so they can have money

    so they get home at 5

    they need bto revise at home theres another what 4 hours aday (hour a subject)

    so thats 9 oclock

    then work on the week ends

    9-5

    the same 4 hours erevison means 9 oclock again

    where is the social time there exactly....
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    (Original post by Smilingsam)
    No wonder you have so many warning posts you are an idiot, times have changed there were also a lot more jobs 10 years ago for the people (which there were fewer of). Also there are other factors to take into recommendation like most universities would not accept students from certain backgrounds unlike today; which meant that most people didnt want to go to college ( plus there were fewer courses).
    Slightly off topic, but your sig is ****ing hilarious.
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    (Original post by kopite493)
    yeah case we all have parents who can throw money at us to get stuff we want
    not every one is a alcoholic people who get ema work hard for that ema
    i never got ema but then again id rather wake up and go i cant be bothered going in to day
    they have to turn up 7 hours a day 5 days a week well at least in my school to get ema

    so after that you want they to then go get a job so they can have money

    so they get home at 5

    they need bto revise at home theres another what 4 hours aday (hour a subject)

    so thats 9 oclock

    then work on the week ends

    9-5

    the same 4 hours erevison means 9 oclock again

    where is the social time there exactly....
    why cant they? i got to sixthform five days a week purely because at my school they are not leniant about being absent alot and students need a doctors note if they have more than two days absent, but either way thats not the point. i go to sixthform 5 days a week, i have 3 jobs (Waitressing at my local rugby ground september - may, waitressing at my local cricket ground may- september) so that means i usually work a couple of week nights now and again and the occasional saturday afternoon, but when in the summer i usually work about three days during the week at cricket. also i have another waitressing job at a local restraunt wich i work at every Friday and Saturday night but they are very leniant about me taking days off if i want to have a night out, or if i have a shift at one of my other jobs. so all in all its fairly easy to juggle those three jobs, plus its great money considering im only Seventeen. So aswell as studying and 3 part time jobs i can still find time for a social life, usually Tuesday nights out which are student nights, sunday and also il take the odd weekend off every couple of months. If i can do it, im sure other people can
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    All I saw EMA do was fund teenage nights out, from the drink they buy to the clothes they wear.
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    (Original post by leeeasa)
    why cant they? i got to sixthform five days a week purely because at my school they are not leniant about being absent alot and students need a doctors note if they have more than two days absent, but either way thats not the point. i go to sixthform 5 days a week, i have 3 jobs (Waitressing at my local rugby ground september - may, waitressing at my local cricket ground may- september) so that means i usually work a couple of week nights now and again and the occasional saturday afternoon, but when in the summer i usually work about three days during the week at cricket. also i have another waitressing job at a local restraunt wich i work at every Friday and Saturday night but they are very leniant about me taking days off if i want to have a night out, or if i have a shift at one of my other jobs. so all in all its fairly easy to juggle those three jobs, plus its great money considering im only Seventeen. So aswell as studying and 3 part time jobs i can still find time for a social life, usually Tuesday nights out which are student nights, sunday and also il take the odd weekend off every couple of months. If i can do it, im sure other people can
    ahhh this is bull**** anyone who has ever work knows how physically impossible this would be

    anyone with basic maths skills knows how impossible this would be

    pray tell what is your hours a week for activities school/work socialising....

    allow me to show you the math

    7 x 24 = 168 (weekly hours)

    5 x 8.5=42.5(time in school to and from school for average person)
    7x 4=28(revision for week)
    7x 8=56 (basic weekly sleep for adult)
    3x8=24(job x a basic single shift)

    42.5+28+56+24=150 thats 18 spare hours a week lets be realistic people need me time so you either have no friends, have no me time or your lieing the most probably being the lieing
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    (Original post by kopite493)
    ahhh this is bull**** anyone who has ever work knows how physically impossible this would be

    anyone with basic maths skills knows how impossible this would be

    pray tell what is your hours a week for activities school/work socialising....
    okay

    My Studying -
    Sixthform 8.50 -3.10 5 days a week, i have quite a few free periods so i study in those times, i rarely study out of school, wich frees up time after school.

    My Jobs

    Northampton Saints Rugby Ground - I only work Home games wich is usually twice a month, usually a saturday afternoon, wich means i work 10.30 am - 6.00 pm, usually when its a saturday game i can go straight from that job to my other job wich is in a Indian Restraunt and is usually 7pm - 12am, this is only ever about twice a month that i have to do this though. Also Rugby Season is only ever September - May
    I also sometimes work events at Northampton Saints wich is only ever really at christmas time and if i work them its whenever i have a free evening during the week.

    Northampton County Cricket Ground- Again i only work home games. Due to Cricket usually being long matches e.g. 4 day matches these are usually say Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday (i usually dont have to work every day of the match) however, these are more than often during the summer holidays. Sometimes theirs the occasional event like at Rugby, but they are occasionaly.

    Also both Cricket and Saints catering are the same company, so its very easy fit them in

    My third job is working at an Indian restraunt wich is usually a Friday and Saturday night, usually 7pm-12am. I only took up this job to pay for my extensions and gym membership, and i do find it difficult sometimes because it restricts my social life a bit, but i was the one who wanted the money and theirs things that you have to give up when you want money

    However can i also add, that all three of my bosses are all very easygoing and aslong as i dont take advantage they are usualy leniant and if i want a night off or a weekend off they are all willing to do so aslong as they have warning so they can get someone to cover my shift

    My Social Life -

    Often because im working Friday or Saturday nights i dont go out as often as i used to unless its a big group thing, wich then il take a day off work for. Otherwise though i usually finish work at sat 11pm/12am and then go straight into town to meet my friend, or straight to a party. I dont go out as often on the weekends as im usually tired for my shift at work. But i usually go out Tuesday Nights as thats Student Night in my town, also i usually go out for lunches or shopping with my friends on a sunday afternoon/evening, so all in all i can balance my studying, socialising and work. Sometimes it can be hard, but i want money and i want to work for what i get.

    So basically i work at Northampton Sants in the autum/winter and cricket in the spring/summer, and then the Indian restraunt i work at inbetween. Sometimes it can be really really tireing, but i've always been brought up to think if i want something then i should work for it

    Hopefully this clears it up for you?
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    (Original post by leeeasa)
    okay

    My Studying -
    Sixthform 8.50 -3.10 5 days a week, i have quite a few free periods so i study in those times, i rarely study out of school, wich frees up time after school.

    My Jobs

    Northampton Saints Rugby Ground - I only work Home games wich is usually twice a month, usually a saturday afternoon, wich means i work 10.30 am - 6.00 pm, usually when its a saturday game i can go straight from that job to my other job wich is in a Indian Restraunt and is usually 7pm - 12am, this is only ever about twice a month that i have to do this though. Also Rugby Season is only ever September - May
    I also sometimes work events at Northampton Saints wich is only ever really at christmas time and if i work them its whenever i have a free evening during the week.

    Northampton County Cricket Ground- Again i only work home games. Due to Cricket usually being long matches e.g. 4 day matches these are usually say Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday (i usually dont have to work every day of the match) however, these are more than often during the summer holidays. Sometimes theirs the occasional event like at Rugby, but they are occasionaly.

    Also both Cricket and Saints catering are the same company, so its very easy fit them in

    My third job is working at an Indian restraunt wich is usually a Friday and Saturday night, usually 7pm-12am. I only took up this job to pay for my extensions and gym membership, and i do find it difficult sometimes because it restricts my social life a bit, but i was the one who wanted the money and theirs things that you have to give up when you want money

    However can i also add, that all three of my bosses are all very easygoing and aslong as i dont take advantage they are usualy leniant and if i want a night off or a weekend off they are all willing to do so aslong as they have warning so they can get someone to cover my shift

    My Social Life -

    Often because im working Friday or Saturday nights i dont go out as often as i used to unless its a big group thing, wich then il take a day off work for. Otherwise though i usually finish work at sat 11pm/12am and then go straight into town to meet my friend, or straight to a party. I dont go out as often on the weekends as im usually tired for my shift at work. But i usually go out Tuesday Nights as thats Student Night in my town, also i usually go out for lunches or shopping with my friends on a sunday afternoon/evening, so all in all i can balance my studying, socialising and work. Sometimes it can be hard, but i want money and i want to work for what i get

    Hopefully this clears it up for you?
    for all the above this would not usually happen in the majority of part time jobs and my time table in my previous post would be more realistic

    and yes 18 hours may seem good but when you divide that between the 7 days like it would be and realise its not one lump of 18 hours but 2.5 hours a day which is obviously not enough time for a decent time its obvious that people with normal part time jobs can not pull of doing both this and a social life...

    not to include that other people have jobs too and organising a day for all peoples friends to go out is incredible difficult as it is balancing this around others jobs is near impossible...
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    Wich is fair enough, even i know what i have isnt the easiest and come September i know that i probably will have to drop one, also most of my friends dont have jobs wich makes it easier to fit social time, i guess i dont really need a job, i just have them to pay for things such extra luxuries my parents arnt prepared to fork out for. But, what im trying to state is that their is jobs out there, if i can find three jobs then im sure someone could fine ONE job
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    (Original post by leeeasa)
    Wich is fair enough, even i know what i have isnt the easiest and come September i know that i probably will have to drop one, also most of my friends dont have jobs wich makes it easier to fit social time, i guess i dont really need a job, i just have them to pay for things such extra luxuries my parents arnt prepared to fork out for. But, what im trying to state is that their is jobs out there, if i can find three jobs then im sure someone could fine ONE job
    i have been looking for a job for 2 years and im still looking havnt even got an interview

    i have 14 gcse's ranged between A*-C

    i know have to al levels 1 at A and another a C

    and i still cant get a job

    no there is not jobs out there not in the north any way we are in a RECESSION

    there are no jobs do you not see the news

    there are millions of people out of work if it was just a matter of going im getting a job they wouldnt be out of work know would they?
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    where i live their are ALWAYS jobs in catering/hospitality, not that many in retail and a fair few in logistics. Maybe its who you know, not what you know.. ive always found that saying very fitting
 
 
 
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