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Eating Disorders and life with one - Discussions, Opinions, Advice. watch

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    ^^ Inspirational, nice one Doig!

    My question: can you try and reclaim control of your life without using food or disordered behaviours in recovery? E.g. go through depression and apathy that leaves your day in disarray to a more structured, fulfilling routine? OR is aiming for control in any form harmful considering how zealously we crave it?
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    In direct response to your query, Riku, I think there are two options.

    1)Purging of behaviour. Basically, you attempt to do the COMPLETE OPPOSITE of what you've done before. So if you're incredibly controlling and neurotic about macronutrients, you then purposely pick foods you know nothing about, cannot calculate, or pick things off menus that cannot be calculated to intentionally disallow your mental disorder to subconsciously tally your actions,

    Or...

    2)Repurposing of behaviour. This is using your current neuroses to a healthier degree. For example, if you know you need to gain weight or eat more, you purposely and rather obsessively indulge your previous calculating self, but to a degree that eats, say, 2500-3000 calories per day as opposed to an amount you know would lose or maintain your weight.

    I will say I've had success with both, but I find the latter option causes less mental stress. It's also the option that offers the least mental progression though - so basically it's more of a baby step.
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    I go through phases of reading and not reading this thread, I'm not sure if it's random or down to some connection with how I'm doing at the time. I hope everyone is well though, love to you all xxxx
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    (Original post by MelissaJayne)
    I go through phases of reading and not reading this thread, I'm not sure if it's random or down to some connection with how I'm doing at the time. I hope everyone is well though, love to you all xxxx
    It's all part and parcel of the disorder and really brings to light just how immature it makes us as people, how regressed and selective we become.

    We take such odd phrases with such complimentary elation and as soon as we hear the most banal, silly thing that we take the wrong way, we totally flip out and lose the rag, ruining our day like a child on a tantrum because someone's called him a "smelly poo". It's the same kind of kneejerk defence we build up.

    In some ways what you're doing is a pre-emptive version. You only read when things are going right but regress into the bubble to avoid hearing anything negative when things aren't quite going their way, and parallel to the kid metaphor, I'm sure we've all seen a child that, when blinded by "injustice" towards them (such as bath night, etc) simply refuses to do ANYTHING. Becomes so blinkered by their own agenda and emotions that even the simplest of things becomes a chore, a nightmare, a terror to achieve.
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    (Original post by TotoMimo)
    It's all part and parcel of the disorder and really brings to light just how immature it makes us as people, how regressed and selective we become.

    We take such odd phrases with such complimentary elation and as soon as we hear the most banal, silly thing that we take the wrong way, we totally flip out and lose the rag, ruining our day like a child on a tantrum because someone's called him a "smelly poo". It's the same kind of kneejerk defence we build up.

    In some ways what you're doing is a pre-emptive version. You only read when things are going right but regress into the bubble to avoid hearing anything negative when things aren't quite going their way, and parallel to the kid metaphor, I'm sure we've all seen a child that, when blinded by "injustice" towards them (such as bath night, etc) simply refuses to do ANYTHING. Becomes so blinkered by their own agenda and emotions that even the simplest of things becomes a chore, a nightmare, a terror to achieve.
    You're very right. I think I'm aware of it myself deep down which is why I had a feeling of shame and guilt, which is why I wanted to post that. So I could get it out there! It never ceases to amaze me how quickly the switch of an ED can flick. I can have a whole week of constant happiness, casting it aside, living life to the full..then out of nowhere, snap. Though life is very much full of ups and downs so I'm not going to take it too tough. The good point about a low is you know 'THE ONLY WAY ISSSS UPPPPP' (Imagine me singing this like Yazz)
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    (Original post by MelissaJayne)
    You're very right. I think I'm aware of it myself deep down which is why I had a feeling of shame and guilt, which is why I wanted to post that. So I could get it out there! It never ceases to amaze me how quickly the switch of an ED can flick. I can have a whole week of constant happiness, casting it aside, living life to the full..then out of nowhere, snap. Though life is very much full of ups and downs so I'm not going to take it too tough. The good point about a low is you know 'THE ONLY WAY ISSSS UPPPPP' (Imagine me singing this like Yazz)
    And the fact you RECOGNISE it must be equally a massive boon to you knowing who you are as a person, and incredibly frustrating as you seek to better yourself further.

    Everything is a damned overthought. People are people. They do things, and that's it.

    Go for a walk. Get an ice cream. Sit on a bench in the sun. Go home, cook dinner. Have dinner in front of telly. Have a couple of drinks. Go to bed.

    With someone enduring a mental disorder that same sequence is:

    Start walking, count up the relevant amount of steps, this must be no less than three thousand in total. If it is, by the time we get to the park, then we'll walk back and forth in front of the park until we've achieved that number. Next, ice cream. Sit and look at the ice cream menu. Ice cream man is getting impatient as you google which has the lowest calories and fat. Choose whichever has the lowest calories and fat, despite it being your twelfth-favourite on the list. Next, we will sit on the bench in the sun, but become restless at the fact we are doing "nothing" and wasting time. Now, go home and cook dinner - which takes three times as long as you skin, de-fat, weigh everything to death, evict any form of carbohydrate (Stir Fry with NOODLES? Er, NO. NOPE. BIN). Next, eat dinner. This is done in solitude with nobody looking at you, split into sections which you eat in a specific order. Naturally, you do not eat it all. You forego the drinks as alcohol is needless calories. You go to bed, are edgy and unable to sleep, malnourished, unhappy and full of regret. You spend the next three hours tossing and turning, replaying the day you lived, picking fault with any action you deem as superfluous or wrong. You spend a further hour planning what you will do down to the button tomorrow.


    Quite the difference eh? But that's the thing. Instead of living life, we simply scrutinise life, chop it into research snippets and just ruin it by being unable to simply do something without there being a pre-thing, a "run up" to the thing, then the thing, then the post-thing thinking session, then the thing-rating at the end.
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    (Original post by TotoMimo)
    And the fact you RECOGNISE it must be equally a massive boon to you knowing who you are as a person, and incredibly frustrating as you seek to better yourself further.

    Everything is a damned overthought. People are people. They do things, and that's it.

    Go for a walk. Get an ice cream. Sit on a bench in the sun. Go home, cook dinner. Have dinner in front of telly. Have a couple of drinks. Go to bed.

    With someone enduring a mental disorder that same sequence is:

    Start walking, count up the relevant amount of steps, this must be no less than three thousand in total. If it is, by the time we get to the park, then we'll walk back and forth in front of the park until we've achieved that number. Next, ice cream. Sit and look at the ice cream menu. Ice cream man is getting impatient as you google which has the lowest calories and fat. Choose whichever has the lowest calories and fat, despite it being your twelfth-favourite on the list. Next, we will sit on the bench in the sun, but become restless at the fact we are doing "nothing" and wasting time. Now, go home and cook dinner - which takes three times as long as you skin, de-fat, weigh everything to death, evict any form of carbohydrate (Stir Fry with NOODLES? Er, NO. NOPE. BIN). Next, eat dinner. This is done in solitude with nobody looking at you, split into sections which you eat in a specific order. Naturally, you do not eat it all. You forego the drinks as alcohol is needless calories. You go to bed, are edgy and unable to sleep, malnourished, unhappy and full of regret. You spend the next three hours tossing and turning, replaying the day you lived, picking fault with any action you deem as superfluous or wrong. You spend a further hour planning what you will do down to the button tomorrow.


    Quite the difference eh? But that's the thing. Instead of living life, we simply scrutinise life, chop it into research snippets and just ruin it by being unable to simply do something without there being a pre-thing, a "run up" to the thing, then the thing, then the post-thing thinking session, then the thing-rating at the end.
    It just scared me how accurate that is :/
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    (Original post by MelissaJayne)
    You're very right. I think I'm aware of it myself deep down which is why I had a feeling of shame and guilt, which is why I wanted to post that. So I could get it out there! It never ceases to amaze me how quickly the switch of an ED can flick. I can have a whole week of constant happiness, casting it aside, living life to the full..then out of nowhere, snap. Though life is very much full of ups and downs so I'm not going to take it too tough. The good point about a low is you know 'THE ONLY WAY ISSSS UPPPPP' (Imagine me singing this like Yazz)
    You can do it MellyWelly! You've done so well I'm so proud! You're such an inspiration for people still suffering, don't you quit on me now missy Chin up, we're all here for you m'dear <3
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    Eating disorders are a strange beast. They rely on the person being totally susceptible to them.

    I know a lot of "dieters". You know the type. Those people that are "unable to lose weight" despite being on every diet in the world.

    The problem is, they are ignorant to the means to losing weight efficiently. And yet, rather tactlessly, they assume I can assist them. When they ask "how did YOU lose all that weight?"

    I always answer with the same thing.

    "Utter stupidity."
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    I thought that by not binging I was doing better, but I was wrong.

    I've started to eat healthier again but also less and less. In order to combat this I'm not exercising as much, but in not doing so I am plagued by feelings of guilt and fatness.

    I also seem to be getting more emotional and erratic - not trusting people and such.

    I just wish I could have the happy place I had a few years ago back

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    (Original post by rubixcyoob)
    I thought that by not binging I was doing better, but I was wrong.

    I've started to eat healthier again but also less and less. In order to combat this I'm not exercising as much, but in not doing so I am plagued by feelings of guilt and fatness.

    I also seem to be getting more emotional and erratic - not trusting people and such.

    I just wish I could have the happy place I had a few years ago back

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    Don't you dare trivialise your achievement.

    Rube, you suffer from a binge-eating disorder that attributes itself to the fact that you will give in to a behaviour of excess. By abstaining you are building your tolerance to it - albeit in an unhealthy manner.

    Sweetpea, you are trying to stop one disorder by implementing another. But let us think about the positives of this - you understand your disorder and you are being really adamant about your stance on it. The binge-eating aspect comes from a deep-seeded feeling of emptiness, right? So, by totally adhering and embracing the nothingness, you are avoiding the excess, right? Well. yes, technically, you are. But you'r not underpinning the probelm.

    My sweets, you are doing so well, but you are finding new scapegoats. You ARE disordered, but you are NOT a label. You are fighting NOT the food, but the way you view food, and approach keeping your body healthy, XXX
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    Thank you for that.

    I suppose it's true but I just seem stuck in a vicious cycle - I binge, on weight and feel terrible or I starve and lose weight and feel terrible. I don't exercise so it's not as bad, but then I feel worse for not exercising.

    I think I'm like the opposite of Melissa in that when things are okay I'll stay away from the thread, maybe read it occasionally, but when things are bad it's like a life line to know people know what I'm going through. It's a little safe haven when things are tough, but it should be a place to share how well I'm doing and encourage others - building on the bad feelings and guilt.

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    (Original post by TotoMimo)
    In direct response to your query, Riku, I think there are two options.

    1)Purging of behaviour. Basically, you attempt to do the COMPLETE OPPOSITE of what you've done before. So if you're incredibly controlling and neurotic about macronutrients, you then purposely pick foods you know nothing about, cannot calculate, or pick things off menus that cannot be calculated to intentionally disallow your mental disorder to subconsciously tally your actions,

    Or...

    2)Repurposing of behaviour. This is using your current neuroses to a healthier degree. For example, if you know you need to gain weight or eat more, you purposely and rather obsessively indulge your previous calculating self, but to a degree that eats, say, 2500-3000 calories per day as opposed to an amount you know would lose or maintain your weight.

    I will say I've had success with both, but I find the latter option causes less mental stress. It's also the option that offers the least mental progression though - so basically it's more of a baby step.
    Thanks for the suggestions, Toto Well today I tried 1)
    I had a breakfast which although I enjoyed I became aware I felt I 'had' to have (Special K because I never do and then a peanut butter toastie for extra protein...no-one would ever argue against that but still grr)

    Then I went to my mate's barbecue and tried what I think of now as a 'cheat' day. Basically I could have everything and I wouldn't even bother calculating it or weighing its merits.
    Spoiler:
    Show

    That meant Penguin bars, Pringles (sour cream+onion mmm), grapes, little cocktail sausages, Wagon Wheels, grapes cos I love them, cookies, some damn fine chicken fillets and idek I had 2 bacon cheeseburgers,
    plus a few drinks (which is a different issue because I'm mainly not drinking much due to fear of some non-specifically ED lapse in wellbeing, that's a concern for my mental as much as physical health)

    I did hit a point where I stopped because I was genuinely very full/started feeling queasy but I think that's reasonable, any more and I wouldn't have enjoyed it

    I also noticed that the presence of junk food I'm not a big fan of (e.g. pork pies) due to the taste wasn't and isn't really threatening because it's as simple as not having it. If I'm genuinely not bothered and opt instead for e.g. Pringles, that's part of the personal preferences which make me unique and interesting It's a different matter if the avoidance is fear-based

    Anyway food was there but I had fun, caught up with mates and really that was the best part-the marshmallow fight was good mind :P

    When my mood did slip I noticed it was social anxiety. It's good to keep in shape but at the same time compensating for feelings of inadequate relationships with my body isn't healthy -and by that I of course really mean isn't conducive to my growth as a person or perceived life satisfaction

    We walked back a couple of miles and I walked to and from shops this morning so I have been fairly active, but I hardly see that as being specifically disordered. I walked to the shops to get party food for one sunlight helps my mood, and I was walking back with my mate so that's not the same to me as compulsive exercise

    My only regret is I didn't have a slice of cake...they forgot to cut it

    Pleased to say I might have learned quite a bit from tonight


    Woo a night of normality and fun!
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    I will certainly say that I want certain ED-sufferers to feel guilt as I did a few years back. It gives perspective.

    I did the comparison game. I started trying to be the "best anorexic". What a ****ing stupid contest that was.

    I started feeding off the grief and failure of others in order to better benefit my own demise. That's all being a "good anorexic" is, by the way - it's being really efficient at making your life end quickly and making it obvious to others. It's Bieber Fever for the underweight. "Look at me!" I cried. " I am incredibly underweight!!" -

    Wow. Nice one, bro. You're the coolest...er....right?

    No, you're a ****ing tool, you're not attractive, look like a skeleton with some skin added, nobody fancies you, you're running at about 40% mental capacity, and you spend three quarters of your day devoted to some stupid arbitrary goals.

    Who would POSSIBLY fancy that?! Now, I'm a 28 year old man who has been physically FORCED to put on weight to be ALIVE. Havine been given zero option because gaining weight is not a luxury nor a flaw, I gained a great deal of weight - less than seven stones up to nine stones - and yet, no girl wil date me.

    The difference? I have to confidence to now. I am no slave to an idiotic mindset. I can go on a date. I can do anything the girl wants, and enjoy it.

    Rubix, losing weight is something I have done a crapload of. I have literally lost enough weight to kill myself on. And yet, I found no happiness there. Now when I see some daft 17 year old girl desperate to be 8 stones, I want to slap her. Yet, I am a gentleman, and I only metaphor-slap girls now :P
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    (Original post by dani_1991)
    You can do it MellyWelly! You've done so well I'm so proud! You're such an inspiration for people still suffering, don't you quit on me now missy Chin up, we're all here for you m'dear <3
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    [QUOTE=Riku;43555861]Thanks for the suggestions, Toto Well today I tried 1)
    I had a breakfast which although I enjoyed I became aware I felt I 'had' to have (Special K because I never do and then a peanut butter toastie for extra protein...no-one would ever argue against that but still grr)

    Then I went to my mate's barbecue and tried what I think of now as a 'cheat' day. Basically I could have everything and I wouldn't even bother calculating it or weighing its merits.
    Spoiler:
    Show

    That meant Penguin bars, Pringles (sour cream+onion mmm), grapes, little cocktail sausages, Wagon Wheels, grapes cos I love them, cookies, some damn fine chicken fillets and idek I had 2 bacon cheeseburgers,
    plus a few drinks (which is a different issue because I'm mainly not drinking much due to fear of some non-specifically ED lapse in wellbeing, that's a concern for my mental as much as physical health)

    I did hit a point where I stopped because I was genuinely very full/started feeling queasy but I think that's reasonable, any more and I wouldn't have enjoyed it

    I also noticed that the presence of junk food I'm not a big fan of (e.g. pork pies) due to the taste wasn't and isn't really threatening because it's as simple as not having it. If I'm genuinely not bothered and opt instead for e.g. Pringles, that's part of the personal preferences which make me unique and interesting It's a different matter if the avoidance is fear-based

    Anyway food was there but I had fun, caught up with mates and really that was the best part-the marshmallow fight was good mind :P

    When my mood did slip I noticed it was social anxiety. It's good to keep in shape but at the same time compensating for feelings of inadequate relationships with my body isn't healthy -and by that I of course really mean isn't conducive to my growth as a person or perceived life satisfaction

    We walked back a couple of miles and I walked to and from shops this morning so I have been fairly active, but I hardly see that as being specifically disordered. I walked to the shops to get party food for one sunlight helps my mood, and I was walking back with my mate so that's not the same to me as compulsive exercise

    My only regret is I didn't have a slice of cake...they forgot to cut it

    Pleased to say I might have learned quite a bit from tonight


    As long as you didn't feel obliged to go those long walks and so forth - Well freaking done, Riku. You have come a LONG way.

    One of the most effective and powerful notions that I get is that when I have a "day off" from being neurotic, that's what a normal person feels just doing regular stuff. The ironic thing is the only dilemma they face is where they'll take their guests, ie, YOU, the problem candidate!

    You did well, Riku, so long as you didn't feel obliged to exercise any of it off as you ingested, you did very, very well. Having fun is - crazily - all about having fun! Having a laugh! Well done you, mister man. I think your efforts are very valiant and well-founded. x
    Woo a night of normality and fun!
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    (Original post by TotoMimo)
    Rubix, losing weight is something I have done a crapload of. I have literally lost enough weight to kill myself on. And yet, I found no happiness there. Now when I see some daft 17 year old girl desperate to be 8 stones, I want to slap her. Yet, I am a gentleman, and I only metaphor-slap girls now :P
    I think that's the kicker for me. I'm not suffering because I "want to lose weight", I know damn well what I want my body to look like - I want an ass grown from squats, I want visible abs and obliques, I want to have nice muscle definition - I want to be toned and I know that the scale doesn't reflect those changes in inches.

    I restrict and binge because of x, y and z. I enjoy being healthy, eating as clean as o can and I love weighted circuits for exercise. I know how to get where I want but I can't get over all these other issues to allow myself to do so.
    • #171
    #171

    I don't know whether you've seen this or not - it's 30 minutes long but worth every second - especially after 16.00 xx
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    #171

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFuOEA0oKWY
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    It's weigh-in day tomorrow!

    Spoiler:
    Show


    After my mad crazy super-gain week where I was on a 3500-a-day diet, nobody could've predicted a 4.5lb hard gain, so when I was put on a 3000-a-day follow up, it was still daunting, but I am now in the mindset of "be healthy, no matter what......"

    Basically I was to get to 9 stones. This was the base amount for them to up my dosage to help me heal my utterly decimated bones. They will only give me the relevant dose of medicine if I am capable of handling it - which my body apparently cannot - at the current weight.

    However I know I haven't gained enough. This week I am about 8 stone 12 - which isn't enough to start the program. I feel like all I've done is FORTISIP EAT FORTISIP EAT FORTISIP and yet, I haven't seen quite enough gain, which hurts a little - partially because I am doing the opposite of what my stupid head tells me, and partially because I realise I was never in full control. I can't fully control how much weight I lose, nor can I fully control the gain.

    It seems our mental demons affect us no matter which directions we go in.



    On a hilarious sidenote, my gran today said, "How much do you weigh, Thomas?" and I said, "Nearly 9 stone now, Gran."

    Her response?

    "Oh, you're just about half a man now eh son?"
 
 
 
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