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Distrustful of Politicians watch

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    You're not alone...
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    If you want to get a crash course in politics tune in to any of Newsnight on BBC2 at 22:30, PM on Radio 4 at 17:00 and The Today Program on Radio 4 in the mornings. There are a lot of good, honest people in politics, mostly in the backbenches of Parliament where they do great work scrutinising government policy and much more as part of the select committees, but a lot of rotten eggs, too. The Lords get a lot of flak, and there are undoubtedly some right berks on the benches in the upper house, but listening to a debate in the Lords can be well worth the time if it's on an issue that you personally care about.

    You will never be able to change anything about the way this country is run unless you put the effort into understanding national, and possibly local and European, politics. As for AV, the Electoral Reform Society, although they campaign for the STV system, have produced a relatively unbiased and informative guide to the various different systems, including AV, that is easy to comprehend. Have a look at it here.
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    Problem is, politics is an impossible job. As an MP for one of the main parties you've basically got to try and please everybody at the same time. Not everybody thinks the same thing. So you're going to have to lie to some people...

    I'm with you, for the few good ones out there who genuinely want to serve and help people, there are others who seem out for nothing more than personal gain. I would have quite liked to be an MP, the idea of serving others and helping those appeals, but I don't really want my name associated with the current crop of fools. [And I don't feel strong - or any - allegiance with any of the parties]
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    Yes, you are being moronic.
    Do you understand how hard of a job they have? They can't please everyone all the time.
    Just with every aspect in life we only tend to hear about the bad things some of them do, never the good, and that's what 'sticks'.
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    Don't look down at the politicians. They are only seizing opportunities and applying the power of the Will. Instead look down on those who vote for them, the herd, because they don't cease to be insipid.
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    And I don't feel strong - or any - allegiance with any of the parties]
    So do you abstain from voting? Will you vote in the Referendum?

    (Original post by NyLonEd)
    Yes, you are being moronic.
    Do you understand how hard of a job they have? They can't please everyone all the time.
    You cannot justify lying to voters or faulting on party policy because your job is 'difficult'.
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    (Original post by 21stcenturyphantom)
    So do you abstain from voting? Will you vote in the Referendum?
    No, I don't abstain, and yes, I will vote.

    I don't abstain because while the various parties don't appeal to me on spec, every candidate has the chance to do something which does appeal. I take it on an election by election basis, I don't blindly follow one party over another.
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    Name somebody who works harder than the average MP, and I'll be surprised. The work ethic and general integrity of the vast majority of elected representatives ought not to be undercut by a small minority of the corrupt or lazy.
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    (Original post by Acerbic)
    Name somebody who works harder than the average MP, and I'll be surprised. The work ethic and general integrity of the vast majority of elected representatives ought not to be undercut by a small minority of the corrupt or lazy.
    Any GP. Nurses. [The better] Teachers.

    When there's 50 or more out of 600 who are caught doing wrong, it's too much of a coincidence.
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    Any GP. Nurses. [The better] Teachers.

    When there's 50 or more out of 600 who are caught doing wrong, it's too much of a coincidence.
    MPs work 12+ hours a day, 7 days a week, travelling between different parts of the country and constantly either working on casework or in the chamber of parliament, or visiting parts of their constituencies and running advice surgeries. I know of no GP, nurse, or teacher who works those answers or suffers the sort of sanctimonious scrutiny which the press subject MPs to. Expenses was overhyped, and whilst I don't think that we should expect any less than what we currently get from MPs, to say that they are lazy or totally uncaring is plain false. If you'd ever had any experience with an MP or working in parliament, you'd know that.
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    (Original post by Acerbic)
    MPs work 12+ hours a day, 7 days a week, travelling between different parts of the country and constantly either working on casework or in the chamber of parliament, or visiting parts of their constituencies and running advice surgeries. I know of no GP, nurse, or teacher who works those answers or suffers the sort of sanctimonious scrutiny which the press subject MPs to. Expenses was overhyped, and whilst I don't think that we should expect any less than what we currently get from MPs, to say that they are lazy or totally uncaring is plain false. If you'd ever had any experience with an MP or working in parliament, you'd know that.
    I know of several GPs and nurses who work 12+hr shifts. Indeed, in my last job I was regularly working shifts in excess of 12hrs and on exercises found my working 18hr days for weeks on end.

    To say that GPs and teachers aren't subjected to scrutiny is laughable. Snap OFSTED inspections [my old school has had 3 within the past 2 months - I know because my mother still works there], constant review of exam results and all of that while the budget for their department is being cut and they're having to deal with less and less. For the doctors, constant reviews by the GMC, the prospect that, if they do make a mistake they'll get sued, impatient patients who expect miracle cures for anything and everything and who expect to be seen the instant they've got a sniffle...

    I'm not saying that the MP's job is easy, or that they're all criminals, but it is by no means the only tough job going. And they get considerably well compensated for their time. Yes, there are honourable men and women in parliament and their actions should not be discounted, they had to work hard to get chosen as a candidate, and then work hard to get elected and then work hard to get re-elected. Along the way, however, they will inevitably annoy the crap out of people. There are good people out there. But there are also bad ones - and they get the recognition.
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    I know of several GPs and nurses who work 12+hr shifts. Indeed, in my last job I was regularly working shifts in excess of 12hrs and on exercises found my working 18hr days for weeks on end.

    To say that GPs and teachers aren't subjected to scrutiny is laughable. Snap OFSTED inspections [my old school has had 3 within the past 2 months - I know because my mother still works there], constant review of exam results and all of that while the budget for their department is being cut and they're having to deal with less and less. For the doctors, constant reviews by the GMC, the prospect that, if they do make a mistake they'll get sued, impatient patients who expect miracle cures for anything and everything and who expect to be seen the instant they've got a sniffle...

    I'm not saying that the MP's job is easy, or that they're all criminals, but it is by no means the only tough job going. And they get considerably well compensated for their time. Yes, there are honourable men and women in parliament and their actions should not be discounted, they had to work hard to get chosen as a candidate, and then work hard to get elected and then work hard to get re-elected. Along the way, however, they will inevitably annoy the crap out of people. There are good people out there. But there are also bad ones - and they get the recognition.
    1) I think you'll find an MPs life is tougher than a GPs
    2) GPs are far better paid than MPs
    3) This isn't all about equivalence. Don't discredit MPs because of a few bad eggs, is my point. They (by and large) work bloody hard and aren't appreciated.
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    (Original post by Acerbic)
    1) I think you'll find an MPs life is tougher than a GPs
    2) GPs are far better paid than MPs
    3) This isn't all about equivalence. Don't discredit MPs because of a few bad eggs, is my point. They (by and large) work bloody hard and aren't appreciated.
    1- purely subjective.
    2- actually, just looked, both have an average wage of about £118k, though the MP is entitled to more perks and expenses than the doctor as the NHS' budget has been cut, while the parliamentary one has been increased...
    3- I don't knock all, but it's harder to get away from the fact that there is a larger percentage of these 'bad eggs' in politics than there are elsewhere.
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    1- purely subjective.
    2- actually, just looked, both have an average wage of about £118k, though the MP is entitled to more perks and expenses than the doctor as the NHS' budget has been cut, while the parliamentary one has been increased...
    3- I don't knock all, but it's harder to get away from the fact that there is a larger percentage of these 'bad eggs' in politics than there are elsewhere.
    1) Everything is. My judgement is based on knowing several GPs, and having done work experience with my local MP, so it's not totally uninformed.
    2) The basic wage of an MP is something like 60k. They can earn more, but they take up more responsibility for doing so.
    3) I think that's a perception formed through a consistent campaign to undermine trust in politics. It strikes me that at the top of any profession (and MP is at the top of the 'political profession'), you get corruption to a great degree. Whether you like it or not, MPs are accountable to those they serve, and so are compelled to serve consistently while in office, and perform all the duties (casework, surgeries, etc.) consistently and well.
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    (Original post by Acerbic)
    Whether you like it or not, MPs are accountable to those they serve, and so are compelled to serve consistently while in office, and perform all the duties (casework, surgeries, etc.) consistently and well.
    If I may interject here. Do you think this is true? Do you think they really perform consistently and well with what their communities want or need, for the people that elected them?
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    (Original post by 21stcenturyphantom)
    If I may interject here. Do you think this is true? Do you think they really perform consistently and well with what their communities want or need, for the people that elected them?
    The majority, yes. I don't mean to eulogise MPs, but they're unduly ****ged off much of the time.
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    (Original post by 21stcenturyphantom)
    I'm trying to do some basic reading on Politics and understand it better but all the while I am reading I keep reminding myself how much I distrust Politicians in general. I know that means I am generalizing terribly, but I just can't help but view them as power hungry two-faced liars who will do anything to line their own pockets
    In brief, your view is a little lazy. You aren't prepared to look at politicians individually or move past the spin so you lump them together in a group.

    but what does it matter when I don't trust who is in power anyway? Am I being moronic in my assumptions? Does anybody else share the same opinion?
    RE: the referendum, you are voting on the voting system, not on politicians. Politicians have only been able to act the way some did because of apathy.
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    (Original post by jacketpotato)
    In brief, your view is a little lazy. You aren't prepared to look at politicians individually or move past the spin so you lump them together in a group.
    That is because I know nothing about the way Politics in the UK work, I don't know the system by which it operates or the way in which power is used or distributed across the different levels of government.

    (Original post by jacketpotato)
    RE: the referendum, you are voting on the voting system, not on politicians.
    I am aware of that. I thought my question was obvious, if somebody didn't trust MP's, then why would they bother taking part in a referendum dealing with elections when they wouldn't have any trust or confidence in whoever was elected anyway?

    (Original post by jacketpotato)
    Politicians have only been able to act the way some did because of apathy.
    I am curious about this statement. Apathy in what sense? From which group? MP's? The electorate?

    After some deliberating I think I am being too foolish in my dismissal of all of Politicians because of a bad few. I'm currently reading an Introduction to Political Ideologies, is this a good place to look at the core values and ideas on which modern government parties have been built or based, such as Libertarianism?

    I also have another question for those who have posted in here, are you active politically in your local area? Do you take part in local politics and council decisions, or campaign for anything?
 
 
 
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