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Difference between Analyst & Associate

what is the difference between an analyst and an associate?

Also what are the different divisions in IB?

Im guessing they all require long hours and pay well.

Reply 1

JrW

You become an analyst when you first join the bank i.e straight after your degree.

You become an associate once you have 3-5 years experience. For M&A this is normally after you have taken your MBA, whereas for a sales/trading role you tend not to take an MBA.

There are plenty of division within IB, although it can be summarised as (taken from www.ibtalk.com/forum):
- Trading
- Capital Markets
- M&A/Corporate Finance

Trading
There are three main areas in trading:
Front Office
All trading, sales & research goes on in this area. This is the "revenue generation" part of the trading operation.
Middle Office
Risk analysis, model validation, and some other more specialised activities.
Back Office
Settles trades - verifys that trades have been executed & monies transfered.

Capital Markets
A half-way house between trading and M&A. Equity Capital Markets deals with raising funds through equities (Initial Public Oofferings & further equity offerings), Debt Capital Markets deals with raising funds through Debt (bonds).

M&A/Corporate Finance
There's a buy-side (aquiring firms or divisions) & sell-side (disposing of firms or divisions) to M&A. The buy-side convices everyone the price is too high, the sell-side the price is too low - eventually everyone must agree on a correct valuation. Firms will also hire M&A teams as a defensive measure to a hostile bid from another firm if the defensive firm believes its best interestes are not in being aquired.

Reply 2

Brown Patrick Bateman

jamierwilliams

You become an associate once you have 3-5 years experience. For M&A this is normally after you have taken your MBA, whereas for a sales/trading role you tend not to take an MBA.

In training, all our new associates for sales/trading had done MBAs, and prior to that 3yrs experience normally in a different field (IBD, consultancy etc). So I think MBA is still needed if you want to start S&T at associate level, though if you've done it for 2-3yrs as an analyst then you can go straight in.

Reply 3

JrW

Chassez

Yep that's exactly what I meant (sorry for not be too clear!)

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Just out of interest, do many analyst traders do an MBA to improve thier prospects when climbing the managerial ladder in the latter stages of their career?

Reply 4

Brown Patrick Bateman

jamierwilliams

Just out of interest, do many analyst traders do an MBA to improve thier prospects when climbing the managerial ladder in the latter stages of their career?

Very few I would imagine. After 2-3 years as a trader, even if not kept on at their current bank it shouldn't be hard to gain an associate position elsewhere. For traders, the management hierarchy is near purely performance driven up to VP/Director level, and leaving the trading floor for 2yrs to do an MBA could actually do more harm than good.

Reply 5

JrW

Chassez

So do many traders make it up to the higher echelons of the bank or is this mainly for the M&A people?

By the way, how is it going at Deutsche Bank?

Reply 6

Brown Patrick Bateman

AlphaX

So do many traders make it up to the higher echelons of the bank or is this mainly for the M&A people?

By the way, how is it going at Deutsche Bank?

If you look at the structure of a bank's top-level management, it tends to be division-based, eg our Executive Committee comprises of heads of different areas of the bank. Only the very top President/CEO-level position(s) would oversee the entire business. They're not necessarily from an M&A background - it may depend on where the bank in question's key business areas are.
Work is good, really like the atmosphere of the trading floor, but still in rotations on the grad scheme and find out in February where I'll be full-time.

Reply 7

JrW

Good luck with everything...I'd like to be in your position in a few year time!

Reply 8

xBMF

Original post by Brown Patrick Bateman

And how's it going, 12 years later?! Any regrets, recommendations, advice?

Reply 9

Ladbants

Original post by xBMF

And how's it going, 12 years later?! Any regrets, recommendations, advice?

This is shocking, I just looked up his name 'Anjool Malde' which is in his profile and it turns out he died six years ago.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/stockbroker-anjool-malde-died-amid-prank-message-investigation-1901268.html

(edited 7 years ago)

Reply 10

username738914

Original post by Ladbants

this is old news. the OG IB sub-forum posters ended up in a variety of situations but Anjool's was the saddest by far.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 11

Ladbants

Original post by Princepieman

this is old news. the OG IB sub-forum posters ended up in a variety of situations but Anjool's was the saddest by far.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Wow, I had no idea
Must have been the stress of the financial crisis, tbh I can't help but wonder what those bankers and traders laid off at that time are up to nowadays