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B399 - Independent Schools Assisted Places Bill 2011 watch

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    B399 - Independent Schools Assisted Places Bill 2011, TSR Libertarian Party



    Independent Schools Assisted Places Act 2011

    An Act to allow those in the lower portions of the income grouping to have the choice of attending Private Schools.

    BE IT ENACTED by The Queen's most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Commons in this present Parliament assembled, in accordance with the provisions of the Parliament Acts 1911 and 1949, and by the authority of the same, as follows:

    Part I: Assisted Places
    1 Assisted Places
    (1) The Government shall provide assistance towards independent school fees according to Schedule 1.
    (2) For the purposes of this Act "household income" is defined as "total income earned by both (where applicable) parent(s) or step-parent(s) before income tax, excluding payments from the Poverty Abolition Act; in the case of a child living with each parent in separate households, the greater of the two incomes."
    (3) Assisted places shall not count as bursaries for the purposes of the Charities Commission enforcing the Charities Act 2007 with respect to independent schools.

    Part II: Miscellaneous
    2 Commencement
    (1) This Act shall come into force on 1 September 2012.
    (2) Preparation for the provisions contained within this Act shall commence on the day upon which this Act is passed.

    3 Short Title
    (1) This Act may be cited as the Assisted Places Act 2010

    Schedule 1
    (1) For the purposes of this Schedule, y is the percentage of school fees paid for by the government under the terms of this Act, x is the household income as defined in this Act.
    (2) For the case of x < 25000, the government shall pay 100% of independent school fees.
    (3) For 25000 < x < 50000, the percentage of school fees paid shall be according to the following equation: y=100-((x-25000)/250).
    (4) For x > 50000, the government shall make no contribution to independent school fees.

    Notes
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    ... the Libertarians want the Government to spend taxpayer money on interfering with privately run schools and their admission intake?

    Did I misunderstand the concept of libertarianism?
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    Someone is in the wrong party.....
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    Speaking in an entirely personal capacity, I think the point is that this turns the State from provider to commissioner of education.
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    Why not just introduce more scholarships instead?
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    Scholarships are often dependant on academic ability in addition to/rather than financial status. I am unsure on this bill, but would prefer to see either the abolition of independent schools or at least heavy regulation of their fees as well as government support.
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    If I'm reading this right then these assisted places will go to anyone who wants them. If you're earning under £25,000 the government will pay the entire cost of your child's private education. This will have the effect of making loads and loads of people want to send their kids to private schools. Loads more private schools will open up to take advantage of the new market and the number of public schools will fall. Over (a relatively short) time, the State will stop providing schools and will instead simply pay (at least part of) the bills for independent ones.
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    (Original post by CLS94)
    Scholarships are often dependant on academic ability in addition to/rather than financial status. I think I may support this bill, but would prefer to see either the abolition of independent schools or at least heavy regulation of their fees as well as government support.
    The abolition of independent schools is impractical and unrealistic.
    Furthermore it's s good thing that scholarships are for those who achieve the best grade because surely that would mean those who truly want said scholarships would work hard to strive for such a thing.
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    Plus it would make the standards if private/independent schools drop. That may sound a bit snobbish but it's not an unrealistic assumption.
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    (Original post by UniOfLife)
    If I'm reading this right then these assisted places will go to anyone who wants them. If you're earning under £25,000 the government will pay the entire cost of your child's private education. This will have the effect of making loads and loads of people want to send their kids to private schools. Loads more private schools will open up to take advantage of the new market and the number of public schools will fall. Over (a relatively short) time, the State will stop providing schools and will instead simply pay (at least part of) the bills for independent ones.
    I think that is a very good point - I think to counter this there would need to be additional legislation limiting the overall amount of independent school places available.

    (Original post by thunder_chunky)
    The abolition of independent schools is impractical and unrealistic.
    Furthermore it's s good thing that scholarships are for those who achieve the best grade because surely that would mean those who truly want said scholarships would work hard to strive for such a thing.
    I do not see it as unrealistic - why is it that resources should go towards giving the best education only to the most able in the first place, instead of those who are in more need of it such as those struggling for basic levels of literacy and numeracy (C grade at GCSE English/Maths)? And right now, it is also the reserve of the rich, although even if this was passed this would remain the case as they are more likely to have a lot of good quality help from family members as well as 1-1 tuition at home.

    In terms of it being impractical, I would suggest that it would be possible in increments - schools could generally become public sector, which would be a big help with the lack of places in many areas (although independent schools are mainly in wealthy communities, some schools in those areas could be wound down and the resources used for construction of others. Some staff would likely continue on regular public sector terms, especially given the current economic scenario, which may largely fit in with standard class sizes. I can see the difficulties behind it, but it would not be impossible.

    Unfortunately I do not think I would be able to support this bill in its current form, but if it included regulation to limit private school places I would consider it a small step in the right direction and I may reconsider.
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    This is a Thatcherite policy because you are doing exactly the same policy as SHE did in 1980 when it was established.

    I do not support the Bill in it's current form and I agree with my Right Honorable Friend Thunder_Chunky idea of scholarships.
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    (Original post by CLS94)
    I think that is a very good point - I think to counter this there would need to be additional legislation limiting the overall amount of independent school places available.
    I think you miss the point. The Bill aims to get rid of public schools. That is a good thing. So long as education is available for all it would be better for the provision to be done through private groups than through the State.
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    (Original post by UniOfLife)
    I think you miss the point. The Bill aims to get rid of public schools. That is a good thing. So long as education is available for all it would be better for the provision to be done through private groups than through the State.
    Well, I think I agree with you theory, but disagree that it is a good thing! I would rather not have a smaller public sector, but I agree this bill would be likely to make it happen.
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    This Bill is a Thatcherite Policy.

    I do not support the idea of reducing State schools. I agree with the principle of the of getting people from disadvantaged backgrounds into Private Education. Not at the expense of the public sector.

    I'd rather this was done through scholarships.
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    (Original post by CLS94)
    Well, I think I agree with you theory, but disagree that it is a good thing! I would rather not have a smaller public sector, but I agree this bill would be likely to make it happen.
    Why is it better to have the State provide schools rather than private individuals and groups?
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    I like the idea of offering some support, but this would be better in the form of scholarships based on academic merit. As stated above, by paying fees, you are effectively commissioning another school system and paying for their intake. While it is sad that many from poorer backgrounds don't have access to private education, the state can not and should not pick up the tab. Instead, I believe that we should focus on creating more scholarships based on both academic merit and family income, but primarily on academic merit with family income being taken into consideration as a secondary factor. Setting up this scheme would deter people from setting up/ rigging admissions procedures to get hold of this money, but would still provide support to the most able and the poorest.
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    (Original post by toronto353)
    I like the idea of offering some support, but this would be better in the form of scholarships based on academic merit. As stated above, by paying fees, you are effectively commissioning another school system and paying for their intake. While it is sad that many from poorer backgrounds don't have access to private education, the state can not and should not pick up the tab. Instead, I believe that we should focus on creating more scholarships based on both academic merit and family income, but primarily on academic merit with family income being taken into consideration as a secondary factor. Setting up this scheme would deter people from setting up/ rigging admissions procedures to get hold of this money, but would still provide support to the most able and the poorest.
    Except, of course, that the State already does pay for the education of almost all children in this country.
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    (Original post by CLS94)
    I do not see it as unrealistic - why is it that resources should go towards giving the best education only to the most able in the first place, instead of those who are in more need of it such as those struggling for basic levels of literacy and numeracy (C grade at GCSE English/Maths)? And right now, it is also the reserve of the rich, although even if this was passed this would remain the case as they are more likely to have a lot of good quality help from family members as well as 1-1 tuition at home.
    If scholarships existed those who would want them would work hard for them. Some would get them, others will not, however the best would get in.

    Why should an independent school take in people who are educationally inept? Ok I know I'm sounding snobbish but why should they agree to something that would lower their scores, rankings, reputation and standards.
    I'm all for allowing people who don't normally have the chance to attend to attend but I think it's wrong to expect the school to agree to it at the cost of their own standards. Just accepting anyone regardless is insanse and illogical.

    I don't see the issue with independent schools. I went to one. Part of it was paid for by my parents and part of it by the company my dad worked for. I was lucky. It gave me the opportunities to challenge my learning difficulties and to overcome them, something I'm not sure is avaliable or avaliable enough in public schools. Until each public school has learning support facilities that are good, it would be impractical to get rid of private/independent schools.

    Furthermore having money and investing it on your child's future is not that different from investing in a new car or house. And if you have a kid and the money you'll want the best no matter what. And if they have the money why shouldn't they spend it as they please? Especially when it is, quite frankly, helping to keep the levels of education up.

    Lastly if you eradicated private schools here some or many would just go to ones abroad, and the country would lose money.

    Again, impractical.

    I'm all for allowing people from poorer backgrounds getting into private schools as long as it's done right. As long as those people are hardworkers and want to be there.

    A scholarship system might, in this case, work for such a thing.
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    (Original post by UniOfLife)
    Except, of course, that the State already does pay for the education of almost all children in this country.
    I assume he means "picking up the tab" for less well off kids going to independent schools.
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    (Original post by UniOfLife)
    Except, of course, that the State already does pay for the education of almost all children in this country.

    (Original post by thunder_chunky)
    I assume he means &quot;picking up the tab&quot; for less well off kids going to independent schools.
    Yes, apologies for not being clearer
 
 
 
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