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doesn't everyone have the right to choose what morals they want to adopt?

not necessarily. for example, ten commandments. All christians must follow these rules, no matter their personal choice, as you say

Reply 3701

medbh4805

Original post by fluteflute

Can you explain the theory of forms briefly? (For people like myself who are uneducated :wink:

)

briefly, Plato postulated that for every thing there is an absolute, perfect "form" of the thing, set apart from reality, which can only be ascertained by reason and the pursuit of philosophy.

Yeah agreed about the sources of our morals.

Do we think it's ever right to say that someone else's morals are wrong?

I don't know, but if someone did something to me I'd want them punished :fuhrer:

we're all self interested really :colonhash:

Reply 3702

punctuation

Original post by medbh4805

briefly, Plato postulated that for every thing there is an absolute, perfect "form" of the thing, set apart from reality, which can only be ascertained by reason and the pursuit of philosophy.

And these forms are ostensibly otherworldly (not the right word choice but can't think of a better one right now), and that everything in the human world is only imperfect reflections of these.

Reply 3703

medbh4805

Original post by Brand New Eyes

That's what I said...?
*if we believe in Plato* there is a perfect "idea" of morality but because we are mere copies in the eyes of the creator (I don't believe in the creator but...carrying on) we will always have the "imperfect" idea.

I didn't say it didn't exist...!

:yes:

poor mother nature, she's just getting bitchslapped in every way.

Oh, kk I misunderstood you :ashamed2:

Reply 3704

Brand New Eyes

Original post by punctuation

how has LSE been rejecting so soon?

They're erm... quick. They only do social sciences (cant remember the exact figure of courses they get). Doesn't stop them from getting 11k+ applicants a year. Alot of universities have been giving out offers, so I suppose it works the other way around aswell. LSE is quite scary really, like marmite. hit or miss.

Original post by fluteflute

The idea of having a lasting influence on someone's life is quite attractive...

Noo, for it to work, you have to be sixteen going on seventeen. Pretend? :tongue:

Life? Who said anything about life? I was talking about stationary man. pervert. :smile:

Yeaah but... I'm not. Yes. pretend :yes:

Oh oh! I sing the Liesl bit and you can sing Ralph! aha

Reply 3705

punctuation

Original post by medbh4805

we're all self interested really :colonhash:

egoism

on a different note, what's your opinion on Hobbes? (in any context)

Reply 3706

PhenolphthaleinX

Original post by punctuation

not necessarily. for example, ten commandments. All christians must follow these rules, no matter their personal choice, as you say

but one could always choose to change religion or become an atheist.

do you really follow the 10 commandments anyway? I don't.

Reply 3707

medbh4805

Original post by punctuation

egoism

on a different note, what's your opinion on Hobbes? (in any context)

I know nothing about his ideas or arguments so I have no opinion :awesome:

Reply 3708

medbh4805

Original post by desy.kris

but one could always choose to change religion or become an atheist.

do you really follow the 10 commandments anyway? I don't.

but she isn't a christian.... :K:

I suppose it depends to what extent you believe someone can be a Christian while adopting alternative interpretations of the Bible.....

Reply 3709

fluteflute

Original post by punctuation

not necessarily. for example, ten commandments. All christians must follow these rules, no matter their personal choice, as you say

But if you're not christian, you don't have to follow them...

[Let's not get into biblical matters, that's a another whole convo...]

Reply 3710

punctuation

Original post by desy.kris

but one could always choose to change religion or become an atheist.

do you really follow the 10 commandments anyway? I don't.

I'm not speaking of this from a personal perspective, but no I don't follow the 10 commandments.

That's not my point, though. Do you think devout Christians who otherwise believe in God, hell/heaven dichotomy, etc. etc. can actually convert if they do not believe in the morals God places forth? I would disagree with your opinion, and say that no, they do not have a choice.

(oho you're free will, aren't you? :mmm:

I'm not determinism, but I can see where you're going with this now :wink:

)

Reply 3711

Brand New Eyes

Original post by medbh4805

Oh, kk I misunderstood you :ashamed2:

Ah maybs i just wasn't clear :h:

Plato is one weird cookie. I mean, what with the cave, his forms, slavery, and philosophy kings :fuhrer:

You learn about him in Greek/Latin/Class Civ?

Reply 3712

punctuation

Original post by medbh4805

I know nothing about his ideas or arguments so I have no opinion :awesome:

aww...

I love his arguments for materialism though.

And you have absolutely no opinion? Not even regarding the leviathan?

Original post by fluteflute

But if you're not christian, you don't have to follow them...

[Let's not get into biblical matters, that's a another whole convo...]

Oh I was talking about only christians, at least in that particular example.

But yes, let's not

Reply 3713

fluteflute

Original post by medbh4805

The present set up works better for you - the current system brings you many benefits, education, healthcare welfare etc, whereas the dystopian system you propose would you constantly in threat of being deposed by your slaves, so you would have be on high alert constantly, and would make you hated and feared by your fellow men :colonhash:

there is also the conflict that would arise from people capturing slaves all the time...

That is all true, and explains why we have the society we do. But I don't think that says anything about whether things are "right"

Reply 3714

punctuation

Original post by fluteflute

That is all true, and explains why we have the society we do. But I don't think that says anything about whether things are "right"

Whom do you think should dictate what is right then? Do you believe that there can be one entity (e.g. God, philosopher king) or group (e.g. the government) that has the knowledge and/or power to do so, or that it is not the place of anyone to judge?

Reply 3715

fluteflute

Original post by Brand New Eyes

Life? Who said anything about life? I was talking about stationary man. pervert. :smile:

Yeaah but... I'm not. Yes. pretend :yes:

Oh oh! I sing the Liesl bit and you can sing Ralph! aha

"Your life little girl, is an empty page" :wink:

But I'd prefer for my method of writing on your page to be more meaningful than sex...

Okay! Sound of Music karaoke?

Reply 3716

Brand New Eyes

Original post by fluteflute

But if you're not christian, you don't have to follow them...

[Let's not get into biblical matters, that's a another whole convo...]

Atheist here.... *walks out of door*

We really have turned into the fb group. Must. not. get. into. random. debates.

ps howd the whole private school thing go? What was it about?

Original post by punctuation

egoism

on a different note, what's your opinion on Hobbes? (in any context)

I just read about him in the state of nature. His theory is rather... amusing. Like the whole conservation of motion. I agree with felicity, but the whole thing about power seems abit... dystopian. But then again, maybe I just have too much faith in the human race :smile:

slash against the state of war