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Harvard tops the worldwide uni league chart watch

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    y's everyone hating on the USA, just cause some uni's are rated in the tops...if it was Oxford or Cambridge we wouldn't be like ohh that's not right that's wrong la la la...get over it...its not that big of a deal, oxford and cambridge still have all their prestiage and blah....same ol same ol
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    (Original post by princessshauna)
    y's everyone hating on the USA, just cause some uni's are rated in the tops...if it was Oxford or Cambridge we wouldn't be like ohh that's not right that's wrong la la la...get over it...its not that big of a deal, oxford and cambridge still have all their prestiage and blah....same ol same ol
    It's not people hating on the U.S or even trying to 'big up' Oxbridge. A lot of people just have a problem with a list in which for example, LSE checks in somewhere in the 450s...
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    (Original post by atomic1125)
    The truth is, there are no reliable rankings out there, you Brits think that your college ranking is really all that great? Think again, I'll bet money that Oxford/Cambridge are almost constantly ranked 1-2 mostly because of their prestige...

    I'm glad Berkeley is ranked so high, Being ranked 21st by US News and world Report doesn't do it justice.

    And before u Brits ***** about this list being completely BS (which i agree to a certain extend), and how it's completely US bias, all of u should really go read this one article from the Economist a few weeks back, I was shocked to learn that Oxbridge's combine funding was 4 billion, while the rest of UK's system only has 1.7 billion in funding.... (british lb)

    Harvard alone have twice Britain's total... Let's not even start talking about Berkeley, which manages all nuclear research of the United States and all its gradurate programs are ranked top 10 in the US, if not the world. Education is like business, having money counts, money allows Berkeley to have the largest acedemic liberary in the nation, the largest acedemic building in the nation (VLSB). Money attracts star professors, allow students to publish and do research, and create incentives for both students and professors to perform.

    BTW, UCSF is a gradurate medical school only... I donno how they ranked that with other comprehensive research institutions...

    I've known professors who've taught at both berkeley and Stanford, and I've also known students that have taken classes at both universities, all of them argreed that acedemically speaking, there are absolutely no difference in the quality of the education. (Keep this in mind, and go look up the latest ranking of top US colleges at US News and World Report)

    I've rant enough, I've got a midterm tomorrow I need to hit.

    -Atomic1125
    4th year UC Berkeley Undergraduate, BA Political Science/European Studies
    You're preaching to the choir here....I'm a Berkeley grad myself, English 2001, and still work on campus in the Chancellor's Office.

    But it's a bit misleading to make it sound like Berkeley is a particularly well-funded or endowed school by US standards. In comparison to the private elites, UC is, at this point, an unfortunately underfunded system. Berkeley is having a lot of problems attracting and keeping stellar faculty, and the quality of the undergraduate program here has declined immeasurably since its peak in the 1960s. Our grasp on the lab management is tenuous at best, and it looks like we're about to lose it to U. of Texas. Funding has been cut drastically, student/faculty ratio has increased, enrollment caps have been instituted, faculty are being encouraged to retire. In short - and don't get me wrong, I love this school - Berkeley is is very much in trouble right now. We just don't have the money that schools like Stanford and Harvard do and without some substantial change in California's fiscal situation, things are about to become worse.

    Oh, and our library is not the largest academic library in the country. It's ranked fourth. And VLSB was the largest academic building when it was originally built thirty years ago, but not anymore.

    Go Bears.
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    (Original post by vienna95)
    even if the methods by which this table was compiled are flawed. it is still a reasonably accurate portrayal of how things stand.

    im interested, why do so many people thinks its BS?
    Didn't you read what I said? I had an email conversation with the guy who compiled this, and he admitted that the table was deeply flawed. Read what I wrote again..
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    (Original post by berkeley2001)
    You're preaching to the choir here....I'm a Berkeley grad myself, English 2001, and still work on campus in the Chancellor's Office.

    But it's a bit misleading to make it sound like Berkeley is a particularly well-funded or endowed school by US standards. In comparison to the private elites, UC is, at this point, an unfortunately underfunded system. Berkeley is having a lot of problems attracting and keeping stellar faculty, and the quality of the undergraduate program here has declined immeasurably since its peak in the 1960s. Our grasp on the lab management is tenuous at best, and it looks like we're about to lose it to U. of Texas. Funding has been cut drastically, student/faculty ratio has increased, enrollment caps have been instituted, faculty are being encouraged to retire. In short - and don't get me wrong, I love this school - Berkeley is is very much in trouble right now. We just don't have the money that schools like Stanford and Harvard do and without some substantial change in California's fiscal situation, things are about to become worse.

    Oh, and our library is not the largest academic library in the country. It's ranked fourth. And VLSB was the largest academic building when it was originally built thirty years ago, but not anymore.

    Go Bears.
    I guess the orientation proparganda got a little too much in to my head, still, i find it hard to believe that VLSB was built 30 years ago. As for the budget problem... let's hope our Governator will fix the budget... although i think money will first need to pour into k-12 education first... at this rate we won't have qualify students to go to UC in 10 years...
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    (Original post by atomic1125)
    I guess the orientation proparganda got a little too much in to my head, still, i find it hard to believe that VLSB was built 30 years ago. As for the budget problem... let's hope our Governator will fix the budget... although i think money will first need to pour into k-12 education first... at this rate we won't have qualify students to go to UC in 10 years...
    Well, I looked up the history, and you may find it even harder to believe that VLSB was actually built more than 70 years ago, not thirty. See below:

    "When built in 1930, the VLSB was state of the art, and was the largest building in Berkeley, and also the largest concrete building west of the Mississippi. The interior of the building was completely gutted and rebuilt in a renovation in the early 1990s, and the building is once again state of the art. Seventy years later, although larger buldings now exist west of the Mississippi, the VLSB with a total of 400,000 square feet of space is still the largest building on campus, after Dwinelle Hall (300,000 square feet)."

    As for Arnold and the budget, well, he's already completely cut outreach programs and we're braced for another possible 10% overall cut. I wouldn't count on him to do too much for UC.
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    (Original post by berkeley2001)
    Well, I looked up the history, and you may find it even harder to believe that VLSB was actually built more than 70 years ago, not thirty. See below:

    "When built in 1930, the VLSB was state of the art, and was the largest building in Berkeley, and also the largest concrete building west of the Mississippi. The interior of the building was completely gutted and rebuilt in a renovation in the early 1990s, and the building is once again state of the art. Seventy years later, although larger buldings now exist west of the Mississippi, the VLSB with a total of 400,000 square feet of space is still the largest building on campus, after Dwinelle Hall (300,000 square feet)."
    As for Arnold and the budget, well, he's already completely cut outreach programs and we're braced for another possible 10% overall cut. I wouldn't count on him to do too much for UC.
    Berkeley's still a great and famous uni, the US News ranking is unbelievable, and tells us more about US News than about Berkeley..

    Feminism equals organised hypocrisy
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    (Original post by W.A.S Hewins)
    Berkeley's still a great and famous uni, the US News ranking is unbelievable, and tells us more about US News than about Berkeley..

    Feminism equals organised hypocrisy

    Berkeley is an incredible university, but what's really interesting is that it carries a greater reputation throughout Europe and Asia than it does here in the US. I know plenty of American academics who think that the US News ranking is, in fact, too generous and that is reflects a reputation no longer backed up by tangible institutional quality. But you go anywhere else in the world and Berkeley is always mentioned, along with Harvard and Yale, as one of the United States' finest universities. In reality, here it's all too often considered a "safety" school for those applying to the more prestigious Ivy League universities.
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    Word...

    Dwinelle hall SUX!!! So how many times have u got lost there?

    As for the famous part, it's so true, the reputation Berkeley carries with it far exceeds it's real acedemic quality. But hey better for us with (or soon with) a Berkeley degree right ?
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    (Original post by atomic1125)
    Word...

    Dwinelle hall SUX!!! So how many times have u got lost there?

    As for the famous part, it's so true, the reputation Berkeley carries with it far exceeds it's real acedemic quality. But hey better for us with (or soon with) a Berkeley degree right ?
    I got lost plenty of times in Dwinelle - the thing is an architectural monstrosity, and if you have to go to the offices on those upper floors, you may as well set aside a couple of hours to try to figure a way out!

    As for the degree, yeah, I'll take reputation and perceived quality over reality any day! The fact remains that a Berkeley degree will always sound better than a degree from Cornell, Columbia, Brown, or any of those other supposedly superior schools. That's why Berkeley actually ranks 4th in the US News overall "academic reputation" rankings. Plus, how many schools have an element on the periodic table named after it??
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    ucl? why aint lse on there?
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    (Original post by berkeley2001)
    Berkeley is an incredible university, but what's really interesting is that it carries a greater reputation throughout Europe and Asia than it does here in the US. I know plenty of American academics who think that the US News ranking is, in fact, too generous and that is reflects a reputation no longer backed up by tangible institutional quality. But you go anywhere else in the world and Berkeley is always mentioned, along with Harvard and Yale, as one of the United States' finest universities. In reality, here it's all too often considered a "safety" school for those applying to the more prestigious Ivy League universities.
    Doesn't this tell us more about the social psychology of US academic/public life than about Berkeley as an academic institution?. Maybe the 60s 'radical' rep triggered some complex reactions. It's a bit like LSE in the Uk (although LSE is usually very high in the league tables)-there's a palpable resentment in certain quarters, partly because it's too high profile and 'newsy' and the feeling that it's only fully appreciated abroad.....
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    (Original post by W.A.S Hewins)
    Doesn't this tell us more about the social psychology of US academic/public life than about Berkeley as an academic institution?. Maybe the 60s 'radical' rep triggered some complex reactions. It's a bit like LSE in the Uk (although LSE is usually very high in the league tables)-there's a palpable resentment in certain quarters, partly because it's too high profile and 'newsy' and the feeling that it's only fully appreciated abroad.....
    Perhaps that's some part of it, but what I think it mostly boils down to is money: Berkeley just doesn't have the same access to the vast financial resources and funding that the privates do. It's amazing, really, that Berkeley even manages to compete with schools like Stanford and Harvard, given their enormous endowments and revenue from exorbitant tuition fees. Berkeley survives on a pittance of state support and a miniscule amount of fee revenue from students. But it's just not able to continously construct huge new research centers and fund new chairs and professorships like the privates do.

    Oh, and a note about your point regarding LSE: what's really ironic about people in the UK feeling that LSE is only fully appreciated abroad is that I'd estimate 75% of the people in the United States have never heard of it. When I got into the MSc program, I had to explain to 90% of my friends what it was because they had no idea. And they were Berkeley students, too! So I'd say that, outside of the closely knit academic circle, LSE certainly does not have an extremely high profile in the US.
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    (Original post by berkeley2001)
    Perhaps that's some part of it, but what I think it mostly boils down to is money: Berkeley just doesn't have the same access to the vast financial resources and funding that the privates do. It's amazing, really, that Berkeley even manages to compete with schools like Stanford and Harvard, given their enormous endowments and revenue from exorbitant tuition fees. Berkeley survives on a pittance of state support and a miniscule amount of fee revenue from students. But it's just not able to continously construct huge new research centers and fund new chairs and professorships like the privates do.

    Oh, and a note about your point regarding LSE: what's really ironic about people in the UK feeling that LSE is only fully appreciated abroad is that I'd estimate 75% of the people in the United States have never heard of it. When I got into the MSc program, I had to explain to 90% of my friends what it was because they had no idea. And they were Berkeley students, too! So I'd say that, outside of the closely knit academic circle, LSE certainly does not have an extremely high profile in the US.
    That's odd given the huge numbers of US and Canadian students who attend 600-700 in a student roll of 7-8000, and that's only a fraction of those who apply. And then the American alumni groups are really active, there are loads of them, and then you get people like Bill Clinton turning up and saying 'the world always turns to LSE for answers', and there's all the famous US alumni, and then the formal partnerships with places like Columbia and Stern New York-on the other hand of course it depends on who you talk to: the Americans I know at LSE all say it's very well known-I don't imagine however that that means people are talking about it every day in the street-'fame' and 'well known' are relative terms...Only the Pope, the current Us President, and maybe Saddam Hussein are truly recognised by virtually everybody-I've even met people in the UK who've never heard of Oxford-that doesn't mean Oxford isn't famous...
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    (Original post by W.A.S Hewins)
    That's odd given the huge numbers of US and Canadian students who attend 600-700 in a student roll of 7-8000, and that's only a fraction of those who apply. And then the American alumni groups are really active, there are loads of them, and then you get people like Bill Clinton turning up and saying 'the world always turns to LSE for answers', and there's all the famous US alumni, and then the formal partnerships with places like Columbia and Stern New York-on the other hand of course it depends on who you talk to: the Americans I know at LSE all say it's very well known-I don't imagine however that that means people are talking about it every day in the street-'fame' and 'well known' are relative terms...Only the Pope, the current Us President, and maybe Saddam Hussein are truly recognised by virtually everybody-I've even met people in the UK who've never heard of Oxford-that doesn't mean Oxford isn't famous...
    I certainly didn't mean to disparage LSE, which I will be attending myself beginning this September. It's just that I am usually met with blank, unkowing stares by people when I tell them I'm going there to study. On the other hand, if I were to say "Oxford" or "Cambridge" they would immediately congratulate me heartily and be very much impressed.
    However, most of my friends and the people I work with are in the liberal arts (I was in English as an undergraduate myself), so that's likely why it seems to me that no one is familiar with it. Of course, in the business and economic sector, most people know LSE; outside of those areas, though, it maintains what I percieve to be as an extremely low profile among the general populace.
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    (Original post by integral_neo)
    Top 20 Universities Worldwide:

    According to a chinese institute, who carried out a 2 year research.

    1. Harvard USA
    2. Stanford USA
    3. Caltech USA
    4. California Berkley USA
    5. Cambridge UK
    6. MIT USA
    7. Princeton USA
    8. Yale USA
    9. Oxford UK
    10. Columbia USA
    11. Chicago USA
    12. Cornell USA
    13. California Sans Francisco USA
    14. California San Diego USA
    15. California Los Angeles USA
    16. Washington Seattle USA
    17. Imperial UK
    18. Pennsylvania USA
    19. Tokyo Japan
    20. UCL UK

    Do you agree with this??

    http://ed.sjtu.edu.cn/ranking.htm

    site for reference, where this list is obtained from.
    how many times have we had this post
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    (Original post by italianmark)
    how many times have we had this post
    Dio solo lo sa
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    (Original post by italianmark)
    how many times have we had this post
    If the fanatic who keeps posting this crazy table wants, I can dig out the emails from the Chinese prof who ran it up, the emails in which the poor devil admits it's riddled with flaws...
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    (Original post by berkeley2001)
    I certainly didn't mean to disparage LSE, which I will be attending myself beginning this September. It's just that I am usually met with blank, unkowing stares by people when I tell them I'm going there to study. On the other hand, if I were to say "Oxford" or "Cambridge" they would immediately congratulate me heartily and be very much impressed.
    However, most of my friends and the people I work with are in the liberal arts (I was in English as an undergraduate myself), so that's likely why it seems to me that no one is familiar with it. Of course, in the business and economic sector, most people know LSE; outside of those areas, though, it maintains what I percieve to be as an extremely low profile among the general populace.
    I get your point-LSE is a small specialist college, of relatively recent origin, compared to the large multi-faculty and ancient Oxford and Cambridge set ups- they undoubtedly are very famous...I still think you're a bit over-concerned about Berkeley-that kind of quality doesn't go down the tubes overnight, mind you the same thing could be said about the complexity of Berkeley's fame-in boardrooms and senior common rooms it's abig deal, but the regular middle-class joe in the street outside the US won't really recognise the name..but so what, the movers and shakers will have heard about it, and their view counts...
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    (Original post by berkeley2001)
    Dio solo lo sa

    For the guy who keeps posting the crazy league table: I've still got the emails somewhere from the Shanghai prof who cobbled the thing together, the emails in which he admits it's riddled with methodological holes...if you ask nicely I'll dig them out for you..
 
 
 
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