CRB Check - Has anyone had problems with a caution? Watch

Damage
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#21
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#21
(Original post by CelticSymphony67)
A Caution is classed as a conviction. The reason it is classed as a conviction, is because when one receives a caution, it is a admission of guilt. Cautions are spent, five years after one receives it, but they will show up on a CRB check for life.
Wrong! A conviction is different. Even on a crb a conviction is in a separate category to a caution

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CelticSymphony67
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#22
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#22
(Original post by Damage)
Wrong! A conviction is different. Even on a crb a conviction is in a separate category to a caution

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My brother is a Police Officer, and he has told me that a Caution is classed as a guilt plea under the law, so I think I will go with what he says. It is on your criminal record for five years.

Are you convicted in court? No. However, a caution will still give one a criminal record, and stay on a CRB check.
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David Wacks
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#23
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#23
Dear all,

Further to my reply, it may well be that a caution is now filtered off if more than 6 years old and not on the list of serious offences which will not be filtered off.
The law was changed on 29 May last. When they published a list of 700+ offences which would not be filtered off. However, without publicity, the list was reduced to about 250 offences seemingly increasing the number of people who would not be affected but, there is a further list not yet published which could mean that the caution would still be mentioned – it is vital, therefore to make specific enquiries with an experts or the DBS specifically asking if a specific offence to which you were cautions is or is not filtered off.
if it is not filtered off. However, it is possible – but not certain – that some cautions cannot be removed on individual application

Anyone with specific enquiries, please let me know and I will see if I can clarify this for you.

Regards

David Wacks
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Roy73
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#24
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#24
I would not say a Caution is classed as conviction, if you read the Gov UK Law website it does say

"A caution is not a criminal conviction, but it could be used as evidence of bad character if you go to court for another crime"

https://www.gov.uk/caution-warning-penalty


Also the Police UK website states

"Although it is not technically classed as a conviction"

https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/q562.htm

In other words its a slap on the wrist and does not need to be mentioned 99% of the time, also a police caution is spent immediately as it is given so no 5 years waiting.

Only when people ask have you been arrested and convicted, many in that situation just say No since you are not "convicted" and do not have a criminal record.

Of course during a dbs standard/enhanced check any cautions will appear, on enhanced checks even a arrest or warning will most likely appear, but you may get lucky sometimes.

Dbs checks are just in place to make sure the people who do not break the rules can be given the best jobs and life, the people that break the rules even slightly or once are condemned and maybe on minimum wages
for there entire life.

Luckily the rest of Europe no such thing exist, and there is self employment and if your lucky companies that hire a person based on skills/qualifications and abilities not ones past lessons in life.
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David Wacks
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#25
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#25
UPDATE ON OLD REPRIMANDS

Dear all,

On 29 May the law was changed so that reprimands more than 2 years old and cautions more than 6 years old would not appear on CRB checks and need not be disclosed on job applications provided they were not on a list of more serious crimes published that day

This law was rushed through and on 3 July 2013, the old list was changed for a new list with many crimes removed, but also new ones added

However, there is also a secret list so that if you're not on the July list of crimes you could be on the secret list and still be affected by old reprimands. It is an absolute scandal and pressure is being put on the government to change this, but meanwhile please contact your MP about it.

It is possible to make specific enquiries whether a particular crime is on the list at DBS but even some of them don't know about this!!

If you still remain affected by an old reprimands. however, it may still be possible to apply individually for these to be removed – each case would have to be looked at on its merits.

Regards

David Wacks
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Damage
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#26
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#26
(Original post by CRBPROBLEMS)
UPDATE ON OLD REPRIMANDS

Dear all,

On 29 May the law was changed so that reprimands more than 2 years old and cautions more than 6 years old would not appear on CRB checks and need not be disclosed on job applications provided they were not on a list of more serious crimes published that day

This law was rushed through and on 3 July 2013, the old list was changed for a new list with many crimes removed, but also new ones added

However, there is also a secret list so that if you're not on the July list of crimes you could be on the secret list and still be affected by old reprimands. It is an absolute scandal and pressure is being put on the government to change this, but meanwhile please contact your MP about it.

It is possible to make specific enquiries whether a particular crime is on the list at DBS but even some of them don't know about this!!

If you still remain affected by an old reprimands. however, it may still be possible to apply individually for these to be removed – each case would have to be looked at on its merits and if anyone wants further advice. please let me know and I will see if I can help further

Regards

David Wacks
Who can we contact about removal? I have one for fighting and another for position of an offensive weapon.. weapon being a darn slingshot!

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Roy73
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#27
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#27
That is some great information there regarding the list.... this list of serious offences and crimes committed should be made public but no doubt debated forever.

Also a caution is a slap on the wrist and should 100% be wiped after 6 years regardless of what it is, people arrested or falsely accused or lack of evidence or cases dropped.... petty things like this should be dropped from the police database/dbs records.

Its a great shame no company or anyone has really started to fight for real rights and law regarding the right for a 2nd chance of life again.
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Ethereal
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#28
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#28
(Original post by CRBPROBLEMS)

However, there is also a secret list so that if you're not on the July list of crimes you could be on the secret list and still be affected by old reprimands. It is an absolute scandal and pressure is being put on the government to change this, but meanwhile please contact your MP about it.
It can't be all that secret if you know about it. Is it a list of crimes or people?
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David Wacks
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#29
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#29
CHANGES TO LAW ON CAUTION/REPRIMANDS

on the 29 May the rehabilitation of offenders act was amended so that old minor cautions and reprimands (cautions to those under 18) would be filtered off criminal records checks and would not appear would not need disclosing to prospective employers (but would do so if, for instance, you applied for a visa abroad and were specifically asked that)

reprimands would not appear after 2 years and cautions after 6 years BUTthis new filtering system does not apply if you are on one of the lists of more serious crimes where filtering off does not apply

the government appears to have made a mess of these changes however, since they replaced the list published on the disclosure and barring service website on 29 May with another different list on the 3rd July and without any fanfare to explain why they changed this .

more disturbingly, there is a secret list of approximately 4000 extra offences which will not be filtered off so that if you look at the July list and your offences on that you do know your offence was more serious and is not filtered off buts, if it is not on the list, you cannot be certain, but it is not on the secret list and therefore you cannot tell whether you are still affected and most importantly, whether you should disclose a matter which may no longer be on your record – or not disclose it and be thought a lier because you thought it was off.

I have written to my MP about this and she has written to the Minister in question.the matter has been raised with the information Commissioner's office and there is to be a meeting next Thursday between one of the charitable advisers in this area and the Home Office to discuss this matter, after which hopefully there will be a change.

I will advise the forum as soon as I hear anything it until this confusion has been clarified. Please take care in what you put on job applications

Hopefully the full list will be published so if one can tell whether they do or do not have a caution/reprimand

If however you still have it on your record . Please be aware that there is a procedure for applying for this to be removed. Although it remains in the discretion of the police to remove threats.however, there have been a number of court cases giving guidelines on when cautions etc should be removed. Because the police had not followed procedures or otherwise.no. one can give you a guarantee they can remove the caution/reprimand but, it has and can be done and please do not give up hope that a minor indiscretion has irretrievably ruined your prospects
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David Wacks
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#30
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#30
in reply to the comments on my earlier blog this is a list of additional crimes which will not be filtered off – not individuals.

If you ring the disclosure and barring service customer service department. They do not know anything about this, but they put me onto someone else who did and who admitted there was the secret list

.I have also spoken with NACRO – a charity advising on rehabilitation and who confirmed that there was this list which the Home Office had told the DBS to keep private

if you check my longer blog above, you will see that there is a lot of pressure the government to come clean. Hopefully there will be news on this in a weeks time

Conspiracy or **** up? What is important is that everyone should know what is or is not on their records. There is likely to be publicity about this. Either way over the coming weeks. So please watch out,
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David Wacks
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#31
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#31
Dear Damage,

The 1st thing you can do for yourself is to find out exactly what offences you were cautioned for.they will be on the papers you receive, but if you do not have them ask your local police station for a form to apply for your record – it only costs £10

It will take a few weeks buts, nothing can return without knowing the exact offences and to see whether you are on the published – all the secret list – and hopefully by the time you get information of your offences. The secret list will no longer be secret and you can tell whether you are on the list – and will not be filtered out – or are not on the list and will not have this disclosed on your criminal records check

could I suggest that in the absence of a personal referral to someone with expertise, that you initially check the Internet for those specialising in this area but,whoever you go to please ask for free initial confidential advice as to your prospects before you go any further.
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Gillybop
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#32
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#32
I have had lots of Advanced CRB checks done, I work in finance, and have a criminal record that shows up every time, the company take several things into consideration, nature of the offence v nature of the work, so had it been fraud or theft etc, then working in finance would have been a non starter. They also look at when it was committed, sentence received, and most importantly, did you learn a lesson and never commit another crime. One company received my CRB, never even asked me any questions about it and I started without any problems.

mine was 16 years ago, received a community service order, yet it shows up every time and will continue to do so for ever, cautions and even full acquittals also show up on the CRB check. The only saving grace is that it was for violence, and believe it or not, people don't really think much of a 17 year old getting into a fight.

It is a disgrace that you repay your debt to society, never commit another crime, yet it will always show up on the CRB.
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bigrog
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#33
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#33
a caution is spent the moment you get it. look it up and you will see
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David Wacks
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#34
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#34
dear all,


the law on disclosure of old minor convictions/caution/reprimands was changed in May – reprimands will not come up, even on enhanced disclosure after 2 years and cautions after 6 years provided they are not on government lists and more serious matters – common-law assaults would be filtered off but not section 47 assault. Possession will be filtered off but not supply. Specific enquiry needs doing. Based upon the specific offence committed but quite a few people should now be in the clear and it is possible, if not in the clear that application can be made to clear those off – no 1 can promise this, but it can times be done-

If you have one conviction – not on the list of serious crimes – and were not sent to prison even for one day, then after 11 years, this will be filtered off or if you got it when, under 18. After 5.5 years. However, if you have more than one conviction both stay on

This change was brought in quickly after a few adverse court cases but was not clearly thought through, so there are further review is ongoing and the law could change yet again in detail if not in principle.

All the best to all of you
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meganmollymax
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#35
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#35
Hi David,

I received a caution for theft of an aftershave tester (so daft now but obviously embarrassing and doesn't look great on my record considering I am a successful teacher of 11 years) when I was 18 back in 1995. On every CRB check so far it has shown up but now I hear the law has changed and that if I apply for new teaching jobs from September 2013 it will not show. Is this information correct? I would be very happy if it was as I always fear it has prevented me making speedier progress than I have made.

Many thanks

D
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cathiehullah
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#36
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#36
Hi I have recently started a degree course in Social Work and I admitted a caution i accepted over 2 years ago for slapping my then, 14 year old son, after a great deal of provocation - I admitted my mistake and submitted a full explanation of the caution on 3 seperate occasions through the admission process. I am now 3 weeks into my course and I have been told I may lose my place on the course because I may not be able to secure a placement in my 2nd and 3rd year of study! I am at a loss to know where to turn - I had a feeling it would be an issue, which is why i was so adamant to declare the details of the caution and explain it as honestly as I could. If anyone has any advice or experience to offer me on this I would be so grateful - I am a mature student and my future is on the line here - my whole life is now geared up around my degree and struggling to learn and absorb everything I need to be studying until my fate is revealed
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Hay15
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#37
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#37
I've got a domestic caution, years ago aged 19 & want to get internships in Investment Banking & Investment Management. Any help please?


I hit my girlfriend on the lip whilst we were in a room with no light & she was screaming. Her mum ordered her nephew to call the police, I stayed to convince her to come outside the room but she was crying. It wasn't deliberate, we were arguing when I swung my hand & told her not to get close to me. There was no light in the room. She was bleeding and I even held her eventually but didn't realise she was bleeding until she agreed to come out with me. By then the police had arrived. I explained the situation, but the police said since we were arguing and there was blood on my jumper they had no choice but to take me away.


I heard them using the term domestic. Next day I was interviewed and was told to accept the caution for the matter to be dropped. In all honesty, I did hit her but wasn't deliberate at all. We're still together to this day, I've learnt a lot about making bad decisions out of rush.
Cautions show up & I don't know how to explain this. I'm a good member of society & no woman or even man would ever believe I have such a past apart from my immediate family or her family. I can get impeccable reference of character but I wish this never happened.


Her mum said if we had came out of the room the police wouldn't have gotten involved, she was left with no choice as she cried aloud and stayed in the room to convince her to come out. She has no permanent fractures or scars.


I'm a good person but I'm very worried because Financial Services might not be pleased with this incident as they receive huge number of applications and as such might not bother with a person who has a tinge of blemish on their crb.


Is a Financial Services Career out the window for me?
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Freddiehpp
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#38
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#38
(Original post by Littlejonesy)
Thanks for the replies

I have applied for a subject access request from my local police force to see what they have on the PNC, so I'm currently waiting to get that back and see whats there, hoping it will put my mind at rest/prepare me for the crb outcome!

It's a bit disconcerting but I'm not sure if a business could deny you a role because of a caution 5 years ago?
As long as it isnt anything dodgey- if youre working with kids etc? I guess as Evidza says it depends on the business.

If ayone has any experience of police cautions and CRB checks, please feel free to let me know!

Thanks!


Hi I'm just wondering how you got on with this? I am in a similar situation. When I was 21 I was suffering bad post natal depression. I went out one night and took drugs and alot of alcohol. When I returned home I attacked my mum and pushed her while she was holding my child. I remember none of this and up until that point had never as much as slapped someone. It's a part of my life I am deeply remorseful and embarrased of. I was arrested and the next day the police interviewed me. As I could not remember and still cannot I said it must have been true if my mum had me arrested. They told me my mum hadn't wished to press charges and it was for my safety mostly. A social worker visited me a few days later concerned for the welfare of my son and they were completely understanding of the situation and that it was a once off. Problem is now I am applying to midwifery and I think this will show up on my record even though no charges were made. I don't know whether to declare it or chance it. Any help would be greatly appreciated
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masgharff
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#39
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#39
"Message : offene; Solicit another for the purpose of obtaining their sexual services as a prostitute in a street/public place. contrary to section 51 A of the sexual offences act 2003
This was the caution given by police to me on 09/07/2013 they took my DNA, figure print and photograph as well. it will ruined my life and my future.my employer do vetting next year and they will find out and they will dismiss me as well i cant apply for nhs jobs.all doors are closed now. i dont want to live any more because if any one find about this i can't explain how bad is it for me.please please help me.i never done any crime in my life thats the first time i can do anything to remove myself from this.Thanks"
Is there any way i can remove that.Police told me that time it is just a warning if i will accept it otherwise they will take me to court i was so depressed at that time i find it easy way.
But I RELISE NOW IT DESTROYED MY WHOLE LIFE CAN U PLEASE HELP ME
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JustJustice
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#40
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#40
Ok I'm sooo confused and it is driving me crazy. Everyone seems to be saying different things! Please can someone who has actually had an enhanced DBS check after June 2013 tell me if a reprimand which meets the criteria to be filtered (happened more than 5.5 years ago for shoplifting lip gloss) will not show on the certificate so o can stop living my life in fear. I am now a pharmacist and have been offered a job by an NHS hospital but need to know if I should come clean or don't need to say anything??!!!
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