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Outside perceptions of partner
I was having a discusion today in Wetherspoons of all places about ethics and we veered onto the subject of the ideal partner.
At first we talked about looks. When asked what I'd really like I spouted the usual objective stuff. Large breasts, nice face and witty companionship. Then we played around with situations. What if you get this ideal woman but there is a techtonic shift in what is generally seen as attractive but your perceptions remained the same. In other words you're going out with a minger who you find really attractive. Would you reconsider the relationship all other factors being equal?
I know this is stupidly hypothetical. After all, people generally agree within a culture on what is attractive and there are biological factors. But extend, if you will, the model to another quality- number of past partners. Generally men don't want a girl who's been around. Imagine your gf (or bf) had slept with a number of people you believed socially unnacceptable. But then imagine that all of these partners had been killed in a plane crash, nobody knew about them and everyone you know thinks that she is a nice girl. Reverse it. The girl is a virgin but everyone thinks she's been with a hundred men. Which would you prefer; the slapper who everyone thought was an angel, or the virgin who everyone thinks is cheap?
Of course, you could go on with the analyses, but the crux of the matter is this. How far do we make choices about our long-term partners based on personal values as opposed to what a plurality of society perceives.
At first we talked about looks. When asked what I'd really like I spouted the usual objective stuff. Large breasts, nice face and witty companionship. Then we played around with situations. What if you get this ideal woman but there is a techtonic shift in what is generally seen as attractive but your perceptions remained the same. In other words you're going out with a minger who you find really attractive. Would you reconsider the relationship all other factors being equal?
I know this is stupidly hypothetical. After all, people generally agree within a culture on what is attractive and there are biological factors. But extend, if you will, the model to another quality- number of past partners. Generally men don't want a girl who's been around. Imagine your gf (or bf) had slept with a number of people you believed socially unnacceptable. But then imagine that all of these partners had been killed in a plane crash, nobody knew about them and everyone you know thinks that she is a nice girl. Reverse it. The girl is a virgin but everyone thinks she's been with a hundred men. Which would you prefer; the slapper who everyone thought was an angel, or the virgin who everyone thinks is cheap?
Of course, you could go on with the analyses, but the crux of the matter is this. How far do we make choices about our long-term partners based on personal values as opposed to what a plurality of society perceives.
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The one everyone thinks is cheap of course. Who gives a poo-poo what other people think?
If it was a guy instead of a girl, I wouldn't care about what these other people thought, it depends on how they are as a person and the dynamics of *our* relationship. For example I wouldn't care if someone was a virgin or had slept with loads of people, but if they were untrustworthy, non-committal or irresponsible I wouldn't go out with them, likewise if they denied me sex on religious grounds I'd be wary too!
Also if my mates thought he was unattractive, but I thought he was and we loved eachother then it wouldn't matter.
I don't think the 'what other people think' business matters once out of school/uni, because relationships can start from completely distant peer groups (ie different workplaces) and therefore these people don't have preconceived views on your choice of partner.
Also if my mates thought he was unattractive, but I thought he was and we loved eachother then it wouldn't matter.
I don't think the 'what other people think' business matters once out of school/uni, because relationships can start from completely distant peer groups (ie different workplaces) and therefore these people don't have preconceived views on your choice of partner.
As much as I'd like to believe that I was capable of forming my own opinion about people, I suspect that outside perceptions will to some extent alter my perceptions
.
For example, if there is a guy that is widely deemed to be attractive by everyone else I probably would be more likely to fancy them compared to someone that everyone thought was unattractive. I think this idea is proven by the fact that at a lot of school the so called "popular" kids that most people like are in fact not the best looking/ best personality etc but instead are liked more for their social status. Often it's a sub concious thing that people are just drawn to popularity and people who are widely believed to be good looking etc.
That's my opinion anyway. Feel free to disagree
. For example, if there is a guy that is widely deemed to be attractive by everyone else I probably would be more likely to fancy them compared to someone that everyone thought was unattractive. I think this idea is proven by the fact that at a lot of school the so called "popular" kids that most people like are in fact not the best looking/ best personality etc but instead are liked more for their social status. Often it's a sub concious thing that people are just drawn to popularity and people who are widely believed to be good looking etc.
That's my opinion anyway. Feel free to disagree
wendizzle22
I don't think the 'what other people think' business matters once out of school/uni, because relationships can start from completely distant peer groups (ie different workplaces) and therefore these people don't have preconceived views on your choice of partner.
I don't think the 'what other people think' business matters once out of school/uni, because relationships can start from completely distant peer groups (ie different workplaces) and therefore these people don't have preconceived views on your choice of partner.
good point, but a relationship never exists in a vacuum. One group of people somewhere probably think she's a slapper and even if you become hermits you have to live with that. Attractiveness doesn't have a spacial component. Wherever you move, people are still likely to view your partner on face value in exactly the same way as poeple in your office, her office and any other community.
Pretty Boy
Isn't physical attractiveness based on symmetry?
not on perceptions.
not on perceptions.
A fat person is fat on both sides though.
Pretty Boy
But you're not a guy and you can't think like a guy.
A real guy doesn't want a girl that has been around.
Thats embedded in the male psyche.
A real guy doesn't want a girl that has been around.
Thats embedded in the male psyche.
Yeah I said 'if it was a guy', not if *I* was a guy, hehe.
cambridgemuscle
good point, but a relationship never exists in a vacuum. One group of people somewhere probably think she's a slapper and even if you become hermits you have to live with that. Attractiveness doesn't have a spacial component. Wherever you move, people are still likely to view your partner on face value in exactly the same way as poeple in your office, her office and any other community.
Doesn't really matter though coz if they've got any tact they won't voice these opinions. I guess if you're at work and dress really provocatively and talk about your sexual exploits you might be branded a slag but otherwise, they have no clue about how many people you've slept with.
Pretty Boy
I dont know if you are joking....but
a person who looks horrible isn't in any way symmetrical to begin with!
Thats the whole point!
Read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facial_symmetry
a person who looks horrible isn't in any way symmetrical to begin with!
Thats the whole point!
Read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facial_symmetry
I'm not joking.
I understand the whole symmetry thing, but someone with a huge nose, no eyebrows, disgusting lips, bad teeth and ginger hair (
) can be perfectly symmetrical and completely minging.
Pretty Boy
But you're not a guy and you can't think like a guy.
A real guy doesn't want a girl that has been around.
Thats embedded in the male psyche.
A real guy doesn't want a girl that has been around.
Thats embedded in the male psyche.
if you're a real guy you shouldnt have to worry about where a girls been, because you're confident enough in your own abilities and qualtities for her not to be wanting to go anywhere else.
and to the opening poster...
If I was with a girl who I found excepetional, and there was a techtonic shift in attitudes and everyone else didnt think so... I wouldnt give a damn...
It'd just show how little everyone else knows. I'd be perfectly happy.
El Scotto
if you're a real guy you shouldnt have to worry about where a girls been, because you're confident enough in your own abilities and qualtities for her not to be wanting to go anywhere else.
if you're a real guy you shouldnt have to worry about where a girls been, because you're confident enough in your own abilities and qualtities for her not to be wanting to go anywhere else.
No. The point is that many men prefer 'pure' girls.
It doesn't have to do with cheating.
Handy
No. The point is that many men prefer 'pure' girls.
It doesn't have to do with cheating.
It doesn't have to do with cheating.
are we in 1506 ?
Define 'pure' for me before I reply properly.
To be honest, I think its very sad and very insecure of blokes to be judging girls on how many guys they've slept with. none of my mates do. Its not exactly realistic to expect every girl you're with to have slept with hardly anyone. so I'd say that 'many' dont really care. (as long as there isnt kids floating around, thats a different matter)
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